snatcher
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Posts posted by snatcher
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1 hour ago, snatcher said:
It was intentionally off from the beginning to support the 3D illusion, along with the thickness on lower half of the ellipse. I don't mind it one way or the other.
Actually, you can notice in my graphic I moved the center point a couple of pixels back because otherwise there was too much "empty space", if you know what I mean. Having the red dot off by half unit compensates in a way for that.
EDIT - The above statement about the red dot is BS because the dots are more far away from each other that way. I don't know, having both the center point and the red dot a little off in opposite ways looks good to me. The widget (source) isn't pixel perfect but it gives the idea that there's more room ahead of you than behind. I don't know
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10 hours ago, Geep said:
Anyway, here's the latest version.
Very well done, Geep! Remove the second "visible" parameter from SubtitlesLocationBacking and we have a RC1 (Release Candidate 1). What do you think of the result so far?
You mentioned your version of the code didn't make into the beta for whatever reason. @stgatilov should run a sanity check now.
10 hours ago, Geep said:Also, the location of the red dot may have been off by 0.5px vertically in the previous versions (and maybe the beta?). Fixed.
It was intentionally off from the beginning to support the 3D illusion, along with the thickness on lower half of the ellipse. I don't mind it one way or the other.
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20 minutes ago, Geep said:
Certainly I could put a translucent box behind the widget, much as you have shown. Except, for reasons discussed above, I can't spare that many pixels vertically. So the widget top edge would be at the box top edge, and the widget bottom edge would still be close to the top of the text chars.
All the space we need is already available in this screenshot:
(075_54.25).jpg.b7b86c2804199e5f483726f5c666f216.jpg)
Leave ~two pixels top and bottom for the text. Move the widget up by a pixel or two.
20 minutes ago, Geep said:I don't think I can get the gui itself to draw a translucent background in an oval, instead of a rectangle. The widget image itself could have a translucent background within the oval, but it would be hard to match alpha'ing with the text backing field. Alternatively, as mentioned before, you could forgo a widget background and just have an opaque widget interior. Maybe 2 shades of gray to denote the sector.
Forget about this for the moment. Just leave the widget outside of any backgrounds (if you aren't sure how to create a dedicated background for it).
20 minutes ago, Geep said:BTW, I noticed your white widget had a yellow center dot. Was that on purpose, or just an artifact of making a yellow version?
Does it? Probably I mixed up things at some point, I don't know. My current white is ok. Added to the list of things to check in the future.
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If you like the above idea, and since you are used to working with the gui, can you make it so that only the text is surrounded by the background and the bottom of the widget is almost touching the top of the background?
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How about we proceed next with something like this?
If done right the widget can have its own background, and blocks will naturally stand out from one another. Please note the above pic comes from a quick an dirty hack to illustrate the idea so I won't share any code.
Backgrounds can eventually be replaced with images with round corners or whatever.
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Definitely an improvement, @Geep
I am sure you can still borrow a few pixels here an there and let the widget breathe a little.
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Don't think the current solution is perfect, eh
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I am convinced outlined yellow is the superior version over outlined white. I encourage everyone interested to test the yellow version (z_Subs_212_NoBG_Yellow_v5.pk4) vs the improved original (z_Subs_212_YesBG_Geep_v4.pk4).
You can find the downloads in this post.
Â
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6 hours ago, datiswous said:
Btw. your yellow pk4 still gives me white text, but the position marker circle is in yellow..
Don't use quickload when switching pk4. For some reason the save keeps the font color. Start a new mission each time you have a new pk4.
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That above would be for @stgatilov or somebody else.
How come there's this this difference between the top and the bottom? (asking because I am not sure if there's technical reason or not)
I am thinking we could probably include the widget and the text in a same block.
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14 minutes ago, Geep said:
@snatcher, I meant to mention, I do like your sector sound-source widget. I'd be happy going with that. As to its ring color.... while my personal pref tends toward some color that would contrast with text color, I guess most folks would prefer white, to match the current text color (and likely default if text color is made variable). That would be fine.
The widget needs a background or a shadow or outline otherwise it cannot be seen in some situations. I am not sure how to deal with this.
At this point, I think you are leaning to:
- The existing background and background color (but from your code that includes a narrower background for barks)
- Original white text color
- Newest widget in white color closer to the text it belongs to, similar to the original
- More centered text
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1 hour ago, Geep said:
I wonder if you could test 9x versus 4x-diagonals and 4x-non-diagonals? Maybe the extra 5 renders don't add much. There probably is some minor performance effect.
Tested it and it doesn't look as good. Similar to v3.
1 hour ago, Geep said:I think you're still showing the widget too high, so it seems to be associated with the wrong subtitle. I prefer @stgatilov's original vertical positioning, even though it pushes the widget's lower edge against the top of the caption lettering.
Sure. Settle on an style first please (background and color).
1 hour ago, Geep said:I wasn't sure what you where trying to point out as a problem... was it the word wrap? Yeah, the automatic word wrap with centered text can look ugly at times. An FM author can choose to insert a manual line break in that case. I do that routinely all the time for barks.
Overlapping elements is what looks bad.
1 hour ago, Geep said:The simple implementation would be a single CVar that toggles the background on/off and possibly, conversely toggles fake drop shadows off/on.
I think players should also be able to toggle the situational graphic off and on. It is well executed but it draws too much attention. I rather not focus on it but on the text and my surroundings. Personally, regular subs is all I need but hey, that's just me.
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One last chance!
In the two mock-ups attached to this post I am printing out each block of text a total of 9 times. In my humble opinion this is as close as we can get to a true outline.
9 times may sound excessive but I recall very complex in-game digital screens with tons of text and graphics in Doom 3 and I assume my approach cannot hinder performance in any way. I can be wrong, though.
Download a pk4 and place it in your TDM root folder. Do not use quicksaves/loads, start a new mission when switching pk4. Delete the pk4 once you are done with testing.
Some missions to give this a go:
- Seeking Lady Leicester: Intro
- Braeden Church: Beginning
- The Black Mage: Intro + Beginning
- A New Job: Intro + whole mission
Here is a comparison in extreme situations (better to experience it in-game because of image compression):
Outlined white [z_Subs_212_NoBG_Yellow_v5.pk4]:
Outlined yellow [z_Subs_212_NoBG_Yellow_v5.pk4]:
And also attached the original, improved version [z_Subs_212_YesBG_Geep_v4.pk4]:
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This is how v3 look like in those situations.
Verbosity isn't fully realized yet and this shouldn't happen often today but it might happen often in a year time.
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The problem with (the original and) v4 is this, and there is little we room for improvement unless we go back to the drawing board
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And here is v4 "Geep", based on your code from four posts above.
- Background enabled
- Text centered
- New graphic
- White color (let me know if you want to test other colors)
Choose between any v3 or v4. We will take your choice to @stgatilov for a sanity check afterwards.
EDIT: Download removed. Check this post for the latest version.
Â
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Yeah, I guess it is a little too late for customizable backgrounds and font color settings but you'll get there eventually
Happy to assist in realizing your vision for this round.
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2 minutes ago, Geep said:
@snatcher, based on your earlier sample, I see that the horizontal widget positioning in the beta release of tdm_subtitles_message.gui and in my version were both off by 10px to the left. (Probably because the widget was originally wider.) My version corrected here (but not addressing text centering problem):
Ok, no problem. We shall request @stgatilov's assistance in due time.
I need you to evaluate yes background or no background and have a final word for 2.12. Take your time, please.
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Zip re-uploaded in the above post. I forgot to remove the background.
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Thank you very much, Geep.
On 1/2/2024 at 10:33 PM, Geep said:And the sound location widget is also off-center.
Not in my samples but mind you: I consider this a visual exercise to evaluate what looks best and decide what works and what doesn't. No guarantees in the code. Gui values must be properly reviewed once you settle on something.
Find attached to this post v3 "Yellorange". Text is centered and the font color is a yellow leaning to orange, that looks like yellow in the game but it actually is more orange than yellow (for me anyway).
EDIT: Download removed. Check this post for the latest version.
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I am sure it is explained somewhere in the topic but mind if I ask for the technical reason?
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Just now, Geep said:
Yes, the backing field shown, while narrower, is still a fixed width for all bark texts, so still wider than ideal for that particular phrase. The width is the minimum needed to safely accommodate subtitle lines up to 42 characters long of 12 pt Stone font.
Thank you. I understand.
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Subs are not centered. Not sure if this is because of known reasons (leading / trailing spaces) or simply gui misalignment.
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48 minutes ago, Geep said:
So true. In that regard, gui code has been available for a few months to create a narrower backing field for barks (i.e., speech verbosity) than for story text. This code has not been included in the beta to date. Perhaps it will take users in addition to me to favor and push for it!
If you want to try it, put this code in your FM's "guis" folder as over-ride file "tdm_subtitles_message.gui":
Ok but.
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Subtitles - Possibilities Beyond 2.11
in TDM Editors Guild
Posted
I get this consistent behavior when moving the mouse around.