simplen00b

Bought this a year and cannot cannot cannot get into it. My brain just isn't configured to view doing that level of micro-management as a 'game'. However, to go slightly off-topic for a moment (but still on the subject of difficult games): everything I heard about Dark Souls made it sound like a complete no-no for me, but I've started watching a Dark Souls run on Twenty Sided, and gotta say, if I found a Steam key going for about £5, I'd be tempted to give it a try. I'd probably suck at it big time, but it doesn't half look amazing. To make money for the AAA-game industry?

Yup, v2.01. No worries, now I know how to get out I'm happy to explore the rooftops a bit more. I didn't bother too much with loot on the way over - I still remember 'In The North' and the paroxysms of guilt I got from realising I had just stolen money from a refuge for abandoned crippled orphan kittens (or something) - but will probably just grow a pair for my return trip and hoover up anything that isn't nailed down. Not much to add to the praise already heaped on this. I got lost on the rooftops too, and liked having to use the map and compass to try and keep my bearings (still took me ages to find the final access point to the station though). Loved the deadpan humour of the evidence notes, especially Also, re the generator fire: And finding the 'alternative route' in the station was a bonus, even though by that stage I didn't need it. Also, I came to this from having played T4 for a few weeks, and oh the joy and freedom of having control over jumping/mantling again. There's quite a few things I enjoyed about T4, but the jumping 'mechanic' (viz.: 1. Move character into position; 2. Hit space bar; 3. Watch game do the jump for you) wasn't one of them. Thanks for a(nother) great FM.

Just loaded an earlier save game:

Great mission; just having problems finishing it. I got to the Cleighmoor entrance in the sewers, and achieved the final objective, but didn't get 'Mission Complete'. (I haven't got the optional loot objective - wasn't playing to get that anyway - but the other objectives are OK.) OK, I thought, I'll just get back out onto the rooftops and finish the game that way (which I was very happy to do), but the waste gate is now stuck in the closed position and (short of noclipping) I can't find any other way out. Probably missing something painfully obvious, but any pointers welcome.

I never knew you could do underclocking at all. I had only heard of overclocking. I had a look in my BIOS and didn't see anything relating to CPU; as Lux said, most laptop motherboards don't, and I guess mine's the same. And yeah, I don't think it's a dust issue. I'll look at getting the thermal paste renewed at some point.

Well, I've got the 75% CPU limit set in the 'Power Saver' option, so I can just select that whenever I want to play nuThief and use 'Balanced' (100%) the rest of the time. If anyone can recommend a CPU/GPU tweaker for Windows that's fairly easy to use (MSI Afterburner looks really complicated to me, tbh), I'd be happy to give it a shot. I'm quite intrigued about how cutting the CPU for T4 makes a quite major difference to the temperatures but barely affects the loading times and fps (it's added 5, maybe 10 seconds to the game load time, and a few seconds to the level load time). If I start it up with 100% CPU available, at least four of the CPU cores are in the 90's just by the time I get to the 'Continue' screen. At 75%, they're about 70C tops. Interesting. Just out of curiosity, I may give the 75% setting a go with TDM and see what happens.

Wow - set my processor to 75% (using Windows power options); T4 still ran between 20-30fps, but the GPU ran about 66-67C, and CPU ran about 70C. That's loads better! Just out of interest, what did you use to slow your CPU down? Any particular utility you could recommend? Setting a percentage via Windows power options feels a bit hit & miss.

Laptop was a custom-built job from PC Specialist just over two years ago. It was way cheaper than any equivalent specification from anywhere else, and there may have been a reason for that (especially in the light of the motherboard conking out after nine months - fortunately it was still in warranty). It sits on a Belkin laptop cooler which definitely helps lower the hard drive temperature; not sure it does much to the gfx card or cpu though. I've had a look inside and all the vents look clear. T4 is by far and away the most cutting-edge game (graphics wise, that is) I've ever played. I have played Miasmata, which is a resources hog, but I never had any problems with it shutting the laptop down. Did a test with TDM for comparison - loaded up Requiem, and in the outside at the beginning (where I'm up on the rooftops most of the time), the gfx card ran at about 60°, and the cpu's at about 65-70° pretty steadily. @Lux: I'm not going to worry about the laptop getting damaged, but my understanding is that hotter temperatures = shorter component life. And Captain Tightwad says this is a bad thing. I guess I'll get someone to reapply some cooling paste and see if that helps. Thanks for the replies.

Definitely up for gas mines. More non-lethal AI-disposal tools are a Good Thing. And if they stop hanky panky, so much the better.

Had a couple of total shutdowns while playing it - installed MSI Afterburner and saw that (i) the Nvidia GT555M card was pretty steady around 75°, which seems to be OK according to some internet searches; (ii) the i7-2670QM CPU temperatures were going up to the mid-high 90's. According to other searches, this is not OK, especially for sustained periods. I've actually been really enjoying T4 since I finished the main 'story' (mostly - that cursed contextual button has been the only annoyance). Exploring the City with the side quests has been pretty good fun, but not enough fun to risk frying my processor. The laptop's about two years old - might the thermal cooling paste it came with need replacing? Any technical insight/advice appreciated (apart from 'Stop playing T4', which I'm pretty much close to doing anyway).

Yup, game said 'Mission complete', so mission completed even though you then died during the fadeout (which I've never seen before and think deserves an award on its own). And mantling onto that pumpkin at the end is exactly what I was hoping you'd do.

This must be some new definition of the word 'enjoy' that I've never come across before. That misspelling is entirely appropriate.

That drove me potty as well - basically, it seems that you have to successfully flee/fight an alerted guard. If you keep reloading (as I did), the game doesn't think you've learned how to dodge. On the subject of fleeing (now I've raised it), I must have been doing something wrong, as the only way I managed to run away from an alerted AI was get to a higher/lower level. Just turning and running away pretty much always resulted in me getting killed. Even swooping didn't help. Anyone else find this? Or is it just further confirmation of my general incompetence in combat? (Although I can say that not only did I have several fights which I won, but there were one or two when I didn't even get any damage. *performs internal victory dance*)

Amen. It was such a relief when I got that removed (and the white flash). Why oh why etc.

Just to flag an alert up about updating nVidia card drivers - I've started having major laptop issues since updating my nVidia drivers, including freezing and BSODs which I never had before. There's some evidence it's related to the gfxdrivers, but the problems have remained even though I've installed an earlier OS backup, so there may be other reasons as well. (However, googling 'nvidia driver update causes blue screen' brings up lots of pages....) Up to my eyes with other stuff so don't have time to explore further - will report back when I can. (I've added this to my earlier post too.)

For anyone who's never used a hex editor before, this may help: 1. Download and install HxD hex editor (other hex editors are available but this has always been enough for me). 2. Find thiefgame.u (in Steam\steamapps\common\Thief\ThiefGame\CookedPCNG\) and make a backup copy. 3. Open thiefgame.u in HxD. 4. Search for the relevant hex values using 'Ctl + F'. NB: Datatype in the 'Find' box must be set to 'Hex values' (the default setting is text-string, which won't work). 5. Then do a 'Paste write' ('Ctl + B') (not 'paste insert') of the new hex value. 6. Save. That should do the job. The only issue I had was that the hex values you're looking for can vary depending on whether Steam has applied a patch or not. There's a few different values in this thread at TTLG - the first set of hex values I tried in HxD came back with 'Not found', but then I tried a set from another post and it worked. HTH.

Hope it works. I haven't played a NewDark FM for a while, but I seem to remember this made a real difference for me - it almost felt like I was playing TDM.

May be worth checking your 'cam_ext.cfg' file - look for: ; enable new mantling code new_mantle Make sure there isn't a semi-colon in front of 'new_mantle'

I had something similar at one point playing nuThief. Got spotted by a guard, so I ran and cowered in a corner - the guard saw me, came right up to me with his sword drawn, and then (for no reason I could see) suddenly backed off and started throwing stones at me. He did this a few times, then on the third or fourth approach decided he could thwack me after all.

That really shouldn't have made me laugh but it did. Particularly liked (i) the technique of continuing to hit AI even after they were KO'd; (ii) the sweet ickle spider (at 4.45). It looked like it was begging! While you were clubbing it to death. Re the two AI from the first sequence (Score to Settle) - I guess they weren't on the same team - or something??? Seemed odd that they didn't both gang up on him at once.

There's a servant/master dialogue sequence in one of the side quests (Carnal Connoisseur, iirc) which is well-written, well-voiced and funny. Qualities sadly missing from most of the story missions dialogue. +1.

I'm probably being too lenient (and over-analytical), but I was trying to be honest about how much of the game reduced me to an incoherent rage rather than just feeling exasperated/impatient. Steam says I've played for 50 hours - it may have felt like it took forever to get across that wretched burning bridge, but it was probably only about 15-20 mins. Likewise the final boss fight - probably took about 30 minutes to finally manage it without getting killed by And if I had gone into it with more health packs, I'd probably have been done in 5. Add in the early game pains like getting clobbered because I was trapped by a knee-high empty wicker basket, and I think 2% is about right. And yeah, that 2% plus the 18% really undermines the other 80%. Don't think I've ever felt so constantly disconnected from my character in a Thief/TDM game. But there's some good stuff among the dreck. (EM, feel free to quote etc etc.) @Melan: Yeah. Not the cleverest bit of dialogue to give him. (Along with most of the dialogue given to most of the 'characters' in the game.)

I've played TDM for about two years and never learned how to fight. I prefer running away and hiding. Much more fun.

Well, I've just managed to finish the main story missions, and my thumbnail(ish) review is: 80% of the game is somewhere between 'Not too bad' and 'Actually, this is pretty good'. (Feel free to quote me, EM Marketing Dept.) It was never as good as the originals/TDM (the borked audio alone put paid to that), but the more I played it, the more often it felt, well, fine. It's a different game to them, and that was a real obstacle at first. But as I learned/accepted how it worked, I got better at sneaking around, and had some lengthy spells of gameplay where I had a good Thief-like experience (yes, even with the fact that I couldn't jump up onto anything I liked. Seriously, about halfway through it just stopped bothering me)(mostly). 18% is bad on a "yeah, whatever, follow-the-railroad-and-get-it-over-with EYEROLL" level of bad. You know the sort of thing. AC-style climbing sequences. Scripted escape sequences. 'Exciting action' cutscenes that look like they were directed by a student with ADHD and a Tony Scott fixation. Howlingly bad dialogue. Thief-Taker General. Etc. Etc. Etc. 2% is bad on a "reduced me to an inarticulate, hate-filled, aneurysm-inducing, soul-crushing miasma of murderous rage and inadequacy that has shortened my life expectancy by at least four years" level of bad. And yes, burning bridge sequence and final boss fight, I'm looking at you in particular. Never, ever, ever again. I've still got most of the side missions left to play (I did two during the main game and really enjoyed them), but I have to wait for my soul to heal from the memory of that final boss fight first. tl;dr: When the game's good, it's pretty good; when it's bad, it's a life-sapping train-wreck of epic proportions.