Search the Community

THought I'd post this here as an exclusive for our forum visitors - and fuck everyone else, the lazy bastards. First look at an in-game model. She's pretty tasty you have to admit, and you haven't seen what shes got on underneath yet either- you'll have to play the game for that.

I already told you the frame numbers the first time you asked - The walk is frame 9 (left foot contact) and 22 (RIght foot contact) The run is 2 and 12. THe model directories can be anything. 'models/chars/undead/revenant' would proably work for the Revenants, and zombies can have 'models/chars/undead/zombies' prelates 'models/chars/builders/prelate' noble woman models/chars/noncombat/noblefemale etc. THe textures were only the ones I had on the map, not the charcaters. The meshes and anims for the revenant would go in 'models/md5/chars/undead/revenant' and it's textures go in 'models/chars/undead/revenant'

What abut being able to frob rings/necklaces off AI like this. Are we having that, and how will it work. I guess they'll have to be separate objects, so I shoukln't model any on to the characters. Frobbable jewelry looked absolutely ridiculous in T3.

can you apply a bit higher smooth value to the model?(those edges should go from the cylinder) otherway it looks great and take a look at the list.. i've uploaded some more models,dontknow if you noticed them

"because the model of the panels on the headboard would not render properly in the normal map" why not? it should do.. here is the normal i generated(only the panel)

What I did for the normal map was copy and paste the panels from the foot of the bed to the headboard because the model of the panels on the headboard would not render properly in the normal map. I think it would be better to get rid of those completely.

no it's because of a) the lighting - I just threw in two light-sources and thus the model isn't lightened properley b ) the normalmap - the normalmap isn't perfect yet

Wow.. speechless. Don't have anything useful to say, just wanted to throw in my support for an awesome model.

I've registered. Give forth to me administrative status, so I can hack at this forum to give it a nice dark theme and create some art for it. Ahh. Why does my avatar keep shrinking to 64. What be the limit? I suggest we have forum separate main threads for: Announcements and News Object making ART: Concept art Texture creation Storyline Voice acting

The problem with modelling for correction of that is simply that it is wrong because it depends on the center of the view. Where the player is looking it. If the player is standing on a stair and the character moves right in front of his eyeleve the boots will suddenly look much bigger and when he stands in front of him they look normal? If somebody changes the FOV then the models boot will still look different or if he uses a weird resolution. The models should be made exactly as any other model. We don't broaden the floor of a chest for the same reason. That it will look straight when the player looks at it.

Yes, the models do get lit by dynamic lightsources DF. I changed her head for this model and made it more conventionally pretty. I was also apphrehensive about how well I would be able to transfer the models in-game, but I'm quite happy with the results, though 'could do better' is permenanly engraved on the surface of my brain.

The boots are not so big that you notice it at first sight. But if you take a cloer look at them it is slightly noticable. Actually I don't really buy that "D3 uses a persepective tweak" argument because it seems rather strange to me from a programmers point of view. The projection of a 3D environment onto a 2D plane (the display) is a mathematical formula. I was implementing a framework because I started to work on a 3D engine some years ago, and I started from the very basics because I wanted to learn it. The projection is a mathematical fact and works very well. The perspective view is a consequence of this formula. It can be influenced by parameters to give a wider or narrower view, but the perspective projection is still always the same for all objects goping through the rendering pipline. In order to make the boots appear smaller (why there would be a need for this is still beyond me) the models would have to go through a different render pipeline to achieve this. Also there would be the need to specify which one is a human model to make the boots apear smaller and I think there is no such parameter in the def files. Furthermore this would mean that if you create an animated object other then human characters they would look wrong and it would be very inconsistent for the code to behave like this.

Well Doom and halflife don't have much re-playablitiy. At some point you realise you're just playing through to see what comes up next, not because you're enjoying it... Same goes for typing an email or making a 3D model - its the end result you want. Where as games like Thief, its the experience that's the fun.

I disagree. I mainly quick saved a lot in Thief for a couple reasons: 1 ) Because it's a slow-moving game and a lot of time and energy is sometimes involved with safely going from Point A to Point B (to C, D, E, F, etc.) and I don't want to do any of it all over again *if* something goes wrong (e.g., I trigger one NCP who triggers the whole castle's worth of NCPs so I then have 15 guards after me; I get unfairly shot and killed by arrows launched when stepping on a secret platform or moving in front of a camera; or if I just accidentally upset the wrong guard.) I just got to a point where I found it a waste of time (and no fun) to re-do stuff. 2 ) Create save points throughout a level that I can go back to and either re-play if I liked the moments, or quickly show a friend the cool area or situation if I wanted. I think ( 1 ) is the biggest for me, but I'll think about it more. I'm sure I can think of more reasons 'why' but I need to get going here. I have lots of confidence in my playing abilities and decision-making. That's not really the issue for me. Although I could play very slowly (even slower than I already play Thief) to mostly avoid those circumstances in ( 1 ), I think I sometimes go insane if I go too slow or if I've done so much that I don't want to lose my work. Imagine working on a 3-D model in Lightwave for 3 hours without saving and then all the sudden something goes wrong (either system or human error) and you've lost a bunch or all your work. Would you really have the patience to eagerly do it again? Heck, if I write an email for 5 minutes and lose it I get p*ssed that I have to re-type it. BUT, again, I'm keeping an open mind with my future endeavors in game-saving. Aside from game crashes, I might enjoy the painstaking work of very slowly going through a game, or re-doing levels if I need to. Although, going once through Half-Life 2 and Doom 3 levels was enough for me. I would dread to have to go through them again. Heck, I even dreaded going back 2 minutes to my last QuickSave in those games to re-do areas. The games weren't bad, I just sometimes got bored of the repetition and wanted to rush through the levels from the boredom. Re-doing levels in a game like Thief might be different, though -- I think.

Hi guys [Edit - Just to clarify, this is only for sound prop. with regard to AI. ] First of all, I was wondering if anyone could clarify what Theo mentioned about the differences in 'direct' wavefront propagation and diffuse field propagation. I think I understand that direct wavefront amplitude decreases due to geometric spreading of spherical waves (1 / ( radius squared ) ), whereas in the diffuse field, you have an infinite number of standing waves filling up a room. How does this diffuse field amplitude decrease as you move from one room to another? The important question for me is: which one of these models is dominant in indoor and outdoor sound propagation? When someone makes say a footstep or 'impulse sound' in another room, and you hear it a couple rooms away, are you hearing mostly the diffuse field of the sound coupled thru the rooms, or are you hearing the initial wavefront bouncing to you? (I know you actually hear both, but which is the dominant effect?) Also, Theo mentioned that the diffuse field experiences coupling losses when going to another room, and that one model would be to count how many portals sound goes thru and divide the diffuse field amplitude by that. One problem with that approach is: some portals are there solely for rendering purposes and would not really result in a sound coupling loss when going thru them (for example, a portal in the middle of a long hallway). Anyway, if anyone could shed light on this, or direct me to some sources on propagation of the diffuse field, I would be very happy.

I'm just wondering if anyone else has much experience with game engines, either SDKs or just the level editors. Personally, the first one I dabbled in was Build for Duke3D Engine (by Ken Silverman), great fun and really easy to put together levels, with some simple scripting done by area-effectors etc. You had/got to paint in your own shadows for atmosphere! And they were dynamic in that you could program doors to cast shadows when closed or opened - really great for back then, especially since it was a 2.5D engine unlike Quake (sprite monsters and objects). It was later upgraded to have voxel objects! Then I tried WorldCraft for a bit, never really liked it much, so didn't make anything with it. I've never properly owned any Unreal games, and the only times I've dabbled with UnrealEd I've never really got on with it; I tried it in Ut2k3, and couldn't be bothered to make my own static meshes. Which of course, now I'm having to do for the Dark Mod :lol: . DromEd was probably my next 'addiction', leading me to join the Hammerite Imperium and really try to push it to it's limits with new textures, models, huge levels etc. I'm still sort of part-time with those guys, although I've mostly stopped to work on the Dark Mod! There's something about DromEd that makes you want to see what it's capable of - it's limited and sometimes buggy, but it can make really huge, nice looking levels - and perhaps the thing that I aim for most in DromEd is impressiveness considering the technology - the "wow! THAT'S in Thief 2????" factor. Then of course, Radiant. Probably my favourite actual system for building levels - it's simple and powerful at the same time, and doesn't crash unless you try to do something like import a model with no surface names...

Me too. I've played around with level editors since Doom ][, but never really finished anything (apart from a few AoE and Impossible Creatures maps). It really helps to have a team working on something to do the things you don't have any interest in doing. I just don't understand coding (though it is what my brother and few of my friends do for a living), I've played around with 3D model making, I can draw but I'm out of practice (mostly cartoons rather than realism anyway), but I enjoy building levels and hope to create a FM for the Dark Mod.

Finger, you should upload a model as soon as it is finished. No point in waiting until you get more. Why? If it's ingame it belongs on the server.

No. I'd just have to the tweak the model and then re-rig and weight it. Hopefully undertow will be doing that job soon.

well Oddity obviously saw the model when he took that screen..so if there was something wasnt allright about it he would have noticed it.. but Oddity,calm down it wasnt nitpicking,and even if the boots were big they could be scaled in no time..(by that i do not claim the boots big, just remembering you to be open to constructive critism;)

Yes, modeling the feet a little larger to compensate for perspective distortion is a little trick I picked up form a Wtusi tribesman in the Sudan. He knew a surprising amount about fish as well. Spending enough time to get each model perfect will result in virtually none of them ever being completed at all. I'm not sure how aware you are of how much time it takes to get one from concept to in-game, but I can tell you that it's quite a bit - especially like this one, when you're doing everything form concept to animation by yourself.

well..we wont really come across that model in light so in the dark these minor things wont really matter;)

All game engines have exaggerated perspective. Look at that model running around in the game and you won't notice the size of the boots.

I haven't started on the city watch elite, but I've done a basic mock up of the elite mercenaries (or private elite guards if you like, the people the rich nobles hire). I've also done a worker bot. I don't think we should use D3 zombies since we're doing upwards of 70 AI models already *faints* another one isn't going to matter. I say seventy becasue you have listed 45 there, but only have 'noble man' or noble woman' 'female servant', 'townsperson' etc down once, but of course we're going to need several differnt of each of those, you can't just have one female model populating the entire town or one noble man populating every house in the city. Ok, you can just reskin them, but it's best to do variation in the actual models. Plus, you haven't listed all the various characters from the plot which will require special models. And also to take into consideration are all the extra heads. Whether it's realistic to expect we'll get these done in a year is irrelevant really, since they are all necessary for a fully functional Thief toolset. THe way to look at it, is that we have to get them done before we release the toolset.

That ingame shot looks great! Looks like the highpoly model. I also like Revenant. Sounds cool for this ghost thing.