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Well I talked to my friend and he said it could be that Maya is not saving the history. I'll investigate a lil more. Edit: I have a jar opened in another maya and it has it's inputs. If I create a new polygon on another Maya it has no inputs. If I create another polygon on the same maya it has no inputs. What the hell is going on.

Oops! Make that *Don* Ross ... I didn't have the book in front of me when I wrote the post and just did it by (bad) memory. http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/026218246...glance&n=283155 Thanks for your suggestions Max. The Ross book starts of distinguishing just what economics is the study of ... utility-optimization in the face of scarcity. I don't think it ever claimed to cover *all* behavioral patterns, but then again it also took pains to say that no particular behavioral patter could be a priori left out of the "machine" either, e.g., religious, artistic, political behavior, etc. So there you go. But I haven't got to the really interesting chapters at the end that talk about the actually links between econ and cogsci, so I'm anxious to know where he's going in that regard. I know right now he's focusing on just what "utility" really amounts to, what it is to "want" something that prompts you to action, and how the maximizing of satisfying that desire lets you choose among options, theoretical stuff like that. The Glumcher book "Neuroeconomics" looks at it in the reverse direction, how evolution actually "designed" neural-areas to be optimizing-machines, so the lessons of economics could actually be used to understanding the wiring, and uses the example of the (LIP) system which directs your eye muscles, that is, visual focus, what you want to look at, how you want to look at it, when, for how long, etc ... and the case is really pounded home that it uses a simple method of relative expected utility to weigh various "look at me!" options and choose among them, at least in part. And then it goes on to suggest that this sort of thing is a general feature in a lot of behavioral decisionmaking and should color how we look at these sorts of brain areas, at least for low level, more "reflex" like behaviors. The higher-level/more reflective decisionmaking you go, maybe the more things get complicated. This has got to be one of the more meandering threads ... anyway, I like it; sort of a grab-bag of what's interesting in the world right now. And it's not like you guys police OT so much in these "undisciplined" forums to stave off the overly-curious masses...

demo: First, I was mainly talking about economic thinking going into cogsci (and a lot of behavioral studies, pidegons eating breadcrumbs, etc...), not vice versa. But now that you mention it ... I know, I wasnt trying to criticize you by extension or anything I just wanted to bring up these points. But I should make clear that although I think its useful to model our evolutionary development along the lines of "utility maximization" in the natural world its a. not the whole story of that level of experience and b. highly controversial at mass levels of organization. I argue there are as many examples of organizations like governments, corporations, political or religious groups acting wildly irrational as not. To turn to the argument that each organization is following their own particular institutional logic (which is still blended with irrationalities but an argument I agree with a lot) begs the question what is this measurable rationality that the stand econ. theories refer to? I think there are definitely corresponding interests but rationalities? dem:I was educated in a tradition that was worried that classical theory was being too reductive to a lot of behavior, too. Recently I've started to rethink that skepticism ... because I'm reading a book *right now* where the exact thesis is that cog sci is going to vindicate classical economic models. Dan Ross's Economic Theory and Cognitive Science. The book is incredibly engaging; I can't put it down! But since I'm still very early in, I don't feel confident responding to your point yet. The best I can do right now is just point to that book (actually it's 2 volumes, the first is on microeconomics, individual decisionmaking, the second is on macroeconomics, larger trends) and say there's your best response that I know of directly to what you are wondering about. But so far, I'm hooked. It sounds like a good read, it joins the Legion of the Unread on my to-do list. But all I can find on the net is Dan Ross at BetterBizBooks.com. Is this the guy? dem:The WW1 example you mentioned I studied in law school (as I studied international law), and that experience was a leading reason for things like the Marshall Plan and the European Union as ways to more properly deal with ending a War and restoring order, which were significantly more economically rational. The psychological motivation behind something like the refusal to offer debt relief (not only that, but Germany had to pay reparations to the Allies until 1989!) revolve around the phenomenon of a "desire for recognition;" the US/Allies wanted to reinforce their world position to Germany/Old World ... really 19th Century way of thinking. I would highly recommend you read Micheal Hudson's Superimperialism, its available in Pdf at his website for free. He makes a case that aid programs like the Marshall plan were in fact a way for State Department officials and economic/political elites to create a system of perpetual debt slavery for Europe and other nations. There was something about Public Law 480 which defined international aid in a way that included gouging loans and onerous pay schedules. This whole contraption went too far and collapsed time and again. You should read him firsthand though, he's a great writer to boot. dem: Carl Schimdt really summed up this way of thinking in some of his books (Political Theology), and more recently Fukuyama (who has the added benefit of explaining its contrast to homo economia, our economically rational selves) ... although you should also take what they say with a grain of salt since they are talking with a definite political bias. Pukeyama? History has not ended yet! But anyway, I've read lots of articles distinguishing people's "economic" self from their "autobiographical" self (whatever identity features are important in making up who they think they are). I can't answer to this until I've read more into Ross's book, but I want to know myself what the relationship between these two ways of behaving are, whether it's like 2 different selves or something more general going on. I'll let you know what I come up with! Im interested in hearing more about this guy.

Napalm, if you really have been just hanging around waiting to hear what to do, why haven't you contributed to the recent discussions about the menus? The following issue in particular was directed right at you: If/when you're around, you need to speak up. Projects like this require continuous communication. The relevant thread: http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?showtopic=3549

Just on the last point, I like www.artchive.com, which has a pretty extensive collection of free, downloadable art. But it's not a wallpaper site per se, and the quality might vary across pieces depending on what you want ... but I've always used it for my backgrounds, I guess just because it's such an extensive collection in one place and still free.

Im trying to use my computer desktop as a picture frame, putting nice art on it and making the desktop icons invisible. The problem is when I switch the desktop icons off the resolution of the picture goes to shit. WHen I turn them on, it looks much better. Can anyone tell me how to stop this change? And does anyone know of any good wallpaper sites with high res pics of good pieces?

Maybe you can look around in an animator or 3D forum? MD5 is IMO rather popular, so there should be some converters to reconstruct it, or some app that can read and play it natively and export to other formats. Don't know wether some forums exist specifically for animators, but I would be surprised it not. At least in 3D forums they should know about it.

It's a great picture. But maybe the look and the pose of her is a bit typical "fantasy art female".

I'm in the mood to share and thought I'd post a recent commission I finished.

This has nothing to do with the Dark Mod, it's just a standard deathmatch shoot 'em up really, but I'd like your views on it. The idea is this: A standard Quake 3 style deathmatch, CTF, and so on, setup, but that every player model and mission represents a different country around the globe. So for instance, for England: There would be a player model which represents England, in a cool red/white cyber suit, but there would also be an 'England' deathmatch level. The deathmatch levels would be based on the culture of that country, so maybe there would be a stonehenge bit for dodging other players' fire, a street with tudor architecture, a Globe style theatre, and so on... The Japan deathmatch level woul have cool Japanese temples and streets lined with neon signs. Loading screens would give you something about the history and culture of the country. Perhaps for America there would be missions for different states rather than the whole country, or there would be too many people using the same model. The plan wouldn't be to do all 200+ countries and models, but to do a few of the most popular and idiosyncratic (Egypt, France, China, Australia, Russia, India, and so forth), and then let the mod community develop and all the patriots out there to create maps and models based on their own countries. Every player AI would speak the language of that country when shooting/laughing/so on. This mod isn't that ambitious because the coding work and so on would probably be in place. Any game engine that supports this kind of deathmatch play would also do.

Whoa... http://forums-fr.ubi.com/groupee/forums/a/...2234#7911042234 A guy translated it, and it can be roughly read with babelfish, but supposedly it says that Ubi is dropping starforce for future games. Damn, starforce is in deep shit.

I don't know much about the series, I've never followed it (pics from the next one reminds me of NWN a bit though), but according to this http://forums.ubi.com/groupee/forums/a/tpc...3234#5521023234 Ubi won't be putting starforce into HoMM5. That is pretty darned significant. Ubi is the starforce bitch of the gaming world. Maybe they're finally hearing the fans and dropping it. I hope they make it company policy before Dark Messiah comes out.

I am building a low-end/mid-range PC with a target price of $550. My goal is to build something that will be satisfactory for the time being, but substantially upgradable in the future. So far, I think I've done pretty well (much more credit to those on the steam forums and hardware IRC channels that have assisted me), but I'm trying to get as much input as possible. Therefore, if my fellow DarkModders would be so kind as to analyze the configuration I have below, your criticisms would be very welcome . MB: ASUS A8N5X Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 ATX AMD Motherboard - Retail $77 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?...N82E16813131569 CPU: AMD Athlon 64 3000+ Venice 1GHz HT 512KB L2 Cache Socket 939 Processor - Retail $120 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?...N82E16819103537 PSU: Antec TRUEPOWERII TPII-550 550W Power Supply - Retail $90 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?...N82E16817103931 RAM: pqi TURBO 1GB (2 x 512MB) 184-Pin DDR SDRAM Dual Channel Kit System Memory - Retail $66.99 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?...N82E16820141152 GFX: GIGABYTE GV-NX66T128D-SP Geforce 6600GT 128MB 128-bit GDDR3 PCI Express x16 Video Card - Retail $114.99 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?...N82E16814125015 CASE: CHENMING 301KEB-0-0 Black Computer Case - Retail $35.50 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?...N82E16811125450 HD: Western Digital Caviar SE WD400JD 40GB 7200 RPM 8MB Cache Serial ATA150 Hard Drive - OEM $49.00 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?...N82E16822144173 (I know I don't have a CD/DVD drive selected...I'm hoping one might just "pop up" at one time or another...it could happen...) Total: $553 In addition, what are your opinions on cheap vs. expensive Power Supply Units? Do I really need to spend >70 to get a quality PSU? I'm seeing the same stats of $90 units on $50 units, but I'm warned that the $50 units are prone to die and kill your whole system. And then there are others that say the $50 units are perfectly fine--even for a person who plans on making a substantial upgrade in the future. One part of me wants to go for a $50 unit--in place of a $90, and spend the difference on a higher quality video card, and the other part of me wants to ensure stability and upgradability for the future. I'm torn to say the least.. Also, how much of a difference is there between CAS2 and CAS2.5 DDR ram? Thanks

What style of clothing do you have in mind? The dress on that girl seems to be a pretty generic dress that might be worn by any non-wealthy woman. The majority of urban pagans will be poor, no doubt, so that part fits, but if want pagans that look in any way distinctive we'll have to go a little further. The celtic idea was just one look for pagans outside the city. But the 'urban' pagans were always referred to as being 'gypsy' like. KFMcCall did a bunch of concept art for them last year (nothing useable though). Ren's original idea of urban pagans looking somewhat 'gypsy' referred, I think, to them having a bit of a vagabond look--colourful scarves, bare arms, somewhat less-restrictive clothing. Something like that would contrast nicely with the uptight, metal-bound builders, and at the same time wouldn't make them identifiable on sight.

No, there's no need for that. The city pagans are normal people wearing normal clothes. THe differences are their long blonde hair (male and female) and their style of clothing and jewelry. THe warrior pagans will look compeltely different, but they'll not be seen in cities anyway. We long ago decided on a celtic appearance, so I'M not sure where that gypsy thing came from. If you look at the concept art for pagans by SH, it even shows celtic warriors. THe desgn document it a little too vague about pagans, it basically says there are many different types, from normal people who dont happen to follow the Builder religion, right down to vicious warrior tribes who can turn into animals. Things have to be narrowed down a little more when it comes to actually modeling the things. These pagans I'm currently doing are the upper end of the scale, some live in the city, and some have native villages close to the city where they behave more natually (don't wear clothes) I can also do the warlike pagans, who don't come anywhere near the city and kill outsdiers on sight. THey wil llook more like the concept art of warrior celts.

Haha, this is so cool - just go to the starforce forums, and there are plenty of threads on the front page with people with undeniable problems with starforce - one of them Starforce tried to test and didn't even test it properly. http://www.star-force.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=826 And this one is gold - here we have 2 people, who, while fighting, are putting Starforce in a bad light no matter what side you're on http://www.star-force.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=857 Also on the front page are these 2 complaints http://www.star-force.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=672 http://www.star-force.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=866 This is my own personal problem that I posted. Actually in truth its my brother's computer we're talking about but I can write it better than him so I just worded it for him. I also ask them why they closed their competition. http://www.star-force.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=868 When I say they have a smarmy attitude when describing how their "contest" proves everyone wrong, i'm talking about this attitude (under the heading "The truth about starforce drivers"); http://www.onlinesecurity-on.com/protect.phtml?c=55

the fonts im using are the same fonts that were chosen, and thats what they are based off, but the actual fonts do not look as good ingame as they do made in photoshop or other concept art, which is very crisp and clear. you can take a concept image and put it in doom3 but it will not look as good as the original due to the way doom3 resizes the image and the scale of 1.3 to 1 that it uses... thats all. you can come very close to it which is what im trying, but i am using the 3 fonts that were decided upon for it. for things like the shader effects the text will have to be images, like the doom3 logo. the ingame carelton font can still be used, but in area's where effects are not needed, such as the key bindings and tooltips.. ect..

I would like to experiment with the tattoos a little. Please upload the stuff you have for this model. There's not really any "right" when you're talking about art, though. And I don't agree that we need to plagiarize off of dead civilizations for our purposes. We can make up our own stuff. Creating new tattoo designs doesn't take rocket science.

A concept art piece for werewolf:

Has anyone tried this blackjack mod? http://www.elderscrolls.com/forums/index.p...howtopic=341499

I think that concept, with loincloth and tattoos, seems to go hand in hand with the male pagan concept art and could work well. Two questions though: 1. Out of curiosity, what did the Celts do when it got really really cold? 2. How much extra time are we going to have to spend animating the boobies?

This is an architectural project in the works for an assignment in my introductary maya class. Is it anywhere in the right direction to becoming a modeller like Orgy? Thanks.(By that I mean talent wise, I know he does alot of characters) -Unstop http://www.picfury.com/galleries/ImageGallery-5204.html I owe alot to the Thievery Mod team and all modders out there. They were a strong inspiration for me to start modelling. I am also learning Photoshop and Adobe Illustrator. All stuff there is about 99% original. I only got the base shape from art history. From there I drew it and made it my own. It's funny but this was the first time I did some actual Subd work on Maya. It's not that bad. Course when I say original I mean it came from my head. I'm sure i've seen that tree/bowl somewhere. However to create it from scratch has to count for something. I've done alot more stuff however this is prob the best i've done so far. Dalai has seen my work and well I know that he knows that i'm not where he needs me to be. LOL Some of my other amateur skills include, lighting, texturing, and camera placement.

Well, we really got a lot accomplished in this thread. The whole point of discussing this was because drumple (and Gildorian too, apparently) was ready to start getting these menus in game. Two weeks and three pages later we still don't have any finished art to give them, nor have we--as far as I can tell--agreed on how to do the animations, or even what the mission loading screen will now look like. We're actually further behind now than when we started all this. Moving gears aren't exactly original either--all the Thief games used them in some form or another. At least the parchment-style screenshots are interesting to look at. We could always work the gears into the top and bottom bars if people are dead set on having them.

I like the light concept better here... but I feel the peach color that is incorporated in both the light and dark logo is inconsistent with the rest of the coloring in the image, which is somewhat a no-no in art, imo. This is the only thing that bugs me about it. That peach color just doesn't flow with the rest of the coloring in the image. I think it'd look better to take one of the rusty brown colors in the background parchment, or a dark gold color from the background gears, and lighten it up. Just my two cents... As for watching those gears quickly rotating for a minute as something loads, it doesn't seem very interesting to me. Maybe if they rotated more slowly. But I still find the more photo-realistic gears in the other menu presented in the poll better/more interesting. I also like the idea oDDity had of having a screenshot of a mission show up, faded with parchment over it. The only problem I have with it is that it's pretty standard these days for games to show a faded image from a level as missions load, so it's not that original. The styling oDDity incorporated is what makes it unique and possibly worthwhile, imo. EDIT: Hmm... just to clarify regarding the peach color: * It looks "peach" color in this static JPG image, which I don't agree with: http://www.tjoff.com/jens/darkmod/gui_startup_lightlogo.jpg * Yet it looks fine (not peach) in this video: http://www.tjoff.com/jens/thingy2.avi

I'm in France at the moment, near Lyon. Today I visited Vichy, a beautiful city despite its ugly history. I have great pictures of the architecture, I'm particularly proud of a picture of a nice tiled floor (in fact from a catholic school) face on, maybe good enough for textures, **shrug** I'm no expert, and would like to give them to the team or the beta mappers to study for inspiration, resources. I can't upload them off the digicam till next weekend, but when I do who wants them?