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thx finger you posted the normal of the thief 2 style wallpaneling on the beta-forums - is this the final version? if it is I'll pick it up and combine it with the photoshoped normalmap.

I don't really have a problem with a poll, but most forums don't take it well if your first posting is a poll.

I think we're in relatively good shape for the milestone, in terms of props. We still have about forty models that need to be skinned and put in game, but we at least have enough to fill up a room. There is one model that still needs to be finished for the first milestone though: A door handle. Deep Omega modeled a few but I don't know that he ever put them on the ftp site. If he did, they still need to be skinned. Odd is busy with characters and animations, so Atti, Diego, Corth, or Fingernail, if you guys could get one handle in game that would be great. Am I correct that we can get them in-game now and animate them (for opening and lockpicking) later? Here are the ones Deep O did. http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?showt...t=0entry18624

We want to keep the website pages manageable in terms of size, so we don't always post everything there. Some is just a reward for those willing to hang around the forums.

Im making some of the architeture with object's as the bsp seems to freak with some complex brushes(I dont know why) One object I made in max that shows what I mean is here http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?showtopic=1845 Im just using one of the wall textures and applying it to my objects. The arched celler shown in that thread comprises of 9 objects with each of those having about 50 subobjects making the whole. While alot are the same shape and can share the same uvmap alot need a different uvmap. The reason Ive moved from max to lightwave, is the formats. The ase file for the whole celler comes out at 25mb where as the comparable lwo is 2mb (from a converted 3ds) Also as far as I can find I can only have one uvmap assigned to a surface.

Hey all, long time thief fan and loved the dark mod from its very birth. Im Dram's brother. I saw the new bow cos my brother showed me, and i didnt like the way the fire arrows drop, the way all the arrows move very fast and the slanted angle and lack of aimer on the bow. Im sure you guys already argued this to death on the dev forums but i dont see much taken on board from the community here. The new bow and arrows are not much like in thief, i know its based on the real speeds of a medieval recurve short bow, but i for one really prefer that the bow had an aimer, that it drew back slowly, that the fire arrows flew straight and slow, and the way all the arrows flew slower then in real life - they feel like bullets now! a lot of people whined when thief 3 did this - i didnt like what thief 3 did either, but a lot did - it would be nice if we could get some public polls on this, and maybe on other major design decisions - these things are important to me and others who want to play the dark mod. Oh btw i really really love how its going - the music is great and the atmosphere is already feeling very thief like - i love the sound prop! i think most games underrate the importance of this! cheers --Tommo

I can't begin to fathom how you can be part of any of the discussions that go on in the dev forums and seriously believe that we aren't making this "for the fans".

When did we ever give the indication we wanted suggestions about the bow? The public forums are here for the express purpose of giving the public a chance to talk and give their opinions on things. But the idea that we should be polling the public before making "major design decisions" is ridiculous. The aiming guard was removed because it was modern and unnecessary. Bow zoom was kept because it simulates greater concentration as you aim (although I'll be turning it off). The bow is slanted because it is easier to knock and fire that way in real life, and it obscures less of the area you are aiming at on screen in the game. The speed of the arrow, time of the draw, etc, are all customizable and have not been tweaked to their final values yet.

This forums' smilies are rather rubbish though. They convey a very small range of emotions. I usually just use the Thief smily because it's so ambigious.

Heh, as far as Brian at Id is concerned, 'id makes games first, engines second'. Doom - the game. is beneath my contempt, it falls off the scale, it's underneath the barrel trying to scrape it's way in, so I won't bother. I already had a good go at it over at the doom3world forums anyway, so I'm cool now. Among other things, I accused shooter fans of being so dumb, they have to use pheromones to communicate. I enjoyed that one. Arguning with doom fans on a doom forum that doom isn't any good:lol:

well if ever there was a forum on TTLG, we'd all need to be admins there to prevent a T3 flamewar and the fact that we actually KNOW what we made ourselves. IMO, it is somewhat better letting us handle it. But that's not to say I don't want the TTLG folks to be CRAZY MAD IN LOVE with Dark Mod, I obviously do; they are our main audience in one respect. But the forums as a whole are part of a much larger community, and we have to respect the Admin's wishes.

You have a couple of talented art guys here. So they can reply to. But I can see why you guys think it is odd. But I collect feedback on about 5 forums so dont worry. One of them dedicated to WWII plus on deviantart. Cobra 6

I also find it a little odd, given the sheer number of art forums out there. What kind of feedback do you expect to get here that you wouldn't get from an art forum? We only have a handful of 2d artists here. Thiefish art, or even generic fantasy, I could see, but WW2...?

Jeez, haven't you considered that he prob has posted in dedicated art forums, but wants as much feedback as possible.

Evil Avatar has an interview up with Emil Pagliarulo (amongst others), designer for Thief Gold, Thief II and T:DS and now the Elder Scrolls:Oblivion. here's the most interesting part for stealth-fans: "Jashin: Stealth, tell me about stealth in general. kathode: I'll let Emil handle this one, he's the Thief guy after all Emil: Well, the most important thing to remember about stealth in Oblivion is that, unlike in Thief or Splinter Cell, your ability is based as much on your skills (or more so) than it is the darkness level, or the sound you generate... Jashin: But darkness and noise level is still a factor, is it not? kathode: Absolutely, they are still factored in. But like combat, your character's skill plays a big role as well. Emil: If you approach a guy in total darkness, wearing soft leather boots, and your "Sneak" skill is 5 out of 100, he's going to see you, and he's going to kick your butt.... We've also given the player much better audio feedback for stealth. NPCs will react as they do in Thief or Splinter Cell, with unique spoken dialogue for spotting the player, THINKING they spotted the player, losing the player…that sort of thing. It's tough, you know. I'm playing Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory right now and it so, SO much like the classic Thief gameplay. Shadows and darkness are all important. But both Thief and Splinter Cell are games with one core gameplay mechanic -- stealth. Yeah, there's combat, but the game's primary development was in the area of stealth. In Oblivion, we need to deal with magic, dialogue, skills, etc. etc. In an RPG where you can play as ANY type of character, it's tough. bapenguin: It also becomes a balancing issue. If you focus too much on stealth, stealth may become too powerful, right? Jashin: Stealth is a game by itself. kathode: It can get that way, you're right. It doesn't mean we intentionally hobble it though. It just means that if stealth is really cool, we've got that much more pressure to make combat and magic really cool as well Emil: Yes, exactly. If we had a stealth model as good as that in Thief, where shadow was all powerful, an Orc in platemail could sneak up on a master assassin. One of the things I've been doing is utilizing the other core Oblivion systems to compliment the actual sneaking...let me explain. In Thief, Garrett doesn't talk to anyone in the world. Ever. He picks their pockets, knocks them out. But in Oblivion, the player can join the Dark Brotherhood and play as a character who CAN engage in dialogue. So what would you say to someone you need to kill? How could you use dialogue as a weapon, to intimidate, to trick, etc. I've been having a lot of fun doing stuff like that, and I'm really hoping the player will enjoy that type of flexibility in Jashin: Can I bluff and use my poker face? Bluff and get the best of a higher level character for instance? Emil: Possibly. All of that dialogue is unique, so it depends on the quest, the NPCs you're dealing with, etc. But you'll always have a few dialogue options. Jashin: Wow, the next Deus Ex, perhaps? bapenguin: As long as it's not Deus Ex II. Jashin: I can't imagine what you're suggesting. Emil: hehe" you can read the whole interview right here: http://www.evilavatar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1356 kind regards gleeful

I know, that's why we talked about alternatives to canonballs. http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?showtopic=1483

Ok, I take it back, you can draw anything except thiefy scenes) This isn't an art forum though, it just seems a bit of an odd place to come in order to ask for feedback and drawing tips, and what materials to use. There are plenty of dedicated art forums where you'd get better feedback and tips I'm sure.

Hi, there! I'm new 'round here - I've hopped over on a misty blue trail from TTLG forums. My initial thought, having looked at them screenies, was "yum!" so, at some point I'll have to buy Doom 3, I reckon! Looks like your bunch of artists, modellers, sound people and so on are extremely talented. The textures and models really do put Thief 3 to shame - lovely. I've been playing Thief since TMA, and was hooked immediately. I hope you are able to succeed in filling in what was missing from TDS.

I have only once bought a prebuilt and it lasted that way for about a month. Since then I’ve built about twenty different rigs for people. The trick is to research everything you get, not just reading the reviews but going to the tech forums and checking for the common problems. That and knowing what the post error beeps mean. It is only worth doing if you feel confident in doing it, but stability and speed wise I would put one of my systems up against a comparatively spec'ed dell any day. Warranty wise you are covered on the parts, and extended warranties on pc's are worthless due to the depreciation (imho) Dell and hp have improved over the last few years on the gaming side of things, but they do use custom cases and components so upgrading can be a nightmare as one of my friends found out. At the end of the day its all down to what your comfortable doing. The above spec I gave should be available from dell in any case edit Ive been looking at xp 64. It seems good but is built on the server 2003 kernal so it has some app issues in the beta, hopefuly sorted in the gold release. Im still running win2k so it a couple hundred £ if I decide to get it.

There's info on creating clip models in the Doom 3 forums. I think they're fairly important because they're a middle ground betweenl Bounding box collisions - super fast, but its a box, so its not super accurate. Polygonal collisoin - the game finds no clip model so it creates one during the game, based on the actual polygons of the real mesh. This is WAY more detailed than it needs to be for collision (will you really notice which nostril your arrow hit??) and slows down computers unessecarily. CMs are like a realy really low poly version of the mesh.

Skinning is our most important need right now...check this thread: http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?showtopic=1554 As for models, we could use some more loot objects and decorative art objects: vases, ornamental statues, etc http://www.bellaumbria.net/umbria/immagini/vaso.jpg http://www.khm.at/khm/data/page1034/image1.x300.jpg http://www.culture.gr/2/21/211/21122m/00/lk22m017.jpg http://www.usask.ca/antiquities/Collection/Hannibal1_1.JPG http://www.sculpturesplace.com/Images/Fantasy/fAndosa350.jpg

Again guys, you'll have to excuse me if you've already discussed this stuff 10000 times. I haven't had too much time to read through the entire forums yet, and I'm curious as heck to know what the low down is on buying equipment and sellings goods will be like? will/could the amount carried affect movement in any way? Could people who prefer ghosting thru certain levels choose to leave certain weapons at home, in exchange for some additional speed scrolls? heh heh. I think it would be definitely worth your time to figure out a nice bartering system to add to your MOD if you haven't already. If so, can u shed some light??

I only know this because I was a forum lurker whore on the Unreal Tournament : Infiltration forums for so long. I believe it somehow also makes distances in front of you look shorter than they actually are (like 100m away will look like 80m), but I'm not sure how that works.

I sent an email his way...but it's been awhile since anyone has responded on the forums, so he might not be quite as concerned about it anymore.

I get almost no hatemail now I had restraining orders put out. Also welcome to the forums. Please use proper English. Thank you.