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No worries mate, English is a bugger of a language to learn, even for the natives... I had to edit my last post three times to get rid of some silly typos Out of curiosity, what is your native language? I think all of your ideas are quite good, not being a coder I can't really comment on the feasibility of implementing them all, although I am curious as to how you see your idea of catching oil lamps from KO'd guards working. I like your suggestion regarding guards noticing and picking up out of place items. In Thief 1/2/3 you could drop an item softly or throw it, so I would assume that TDM will continue that tradition.

I have a bad habit of using the term 'atheist' as a blanket term to cover both agnostics and atheists. I suppose I am technically an agnostic, since I am of the view that it is impossible to know ultimately why or how the universe exists, but I think that the likelihood of there being an intelligent creator is so vanishingly small that you might as well call me an atheist for the sake of simplicity. Personally I view questions such as "what is the meaning of life?" and "did god create the universe" as invalid questions, sort of like asking "what is one divided zero?". The english language lets you ask such a question, but it isn't a real question, since meaning itself is a human invention and does not apply to the universe, and you have to first invent the concept of god before you can start asking questions about whether some hypothetical entity did this or that... I never cease to roll my eyes when the deeply religious view any question as to the validity of their beliefs as a test of their faith. They just don't seem to realise that doubt and uncertainty is a good thing. On the last census here in Australia, I put "Sith Lord" in the box for religion... I could have gotten into trouble for that, since it is an offence to falsify a census, and that sort of thing can be construed that way...

Finally I got what seems to be the last kink out of the thing. As some of you know a few months ago my 3 year old E-machine finally keeled over for good. Unable to scrape the money together to get a new system anytime soon I slowly had to get a part at a time to build my own. I thought it would be a while before I could pull it off, but after nearly being driven crazy by my old HP (1 gig athlon, 256 of ram and WinME ) I bit the bullet and now have finally got the thing together! I used: Codegen atx case Gigabyte motherboard 512 stick of Corsair Ram Athlon 2800 XP processor Sony Dvd Rom Seagate 7200 rpm harddrive sony floppy disk drive (reused old keyboard, mouse, speakers, monitor etc) Here it is! Special thanks to the Eidos Tech Forum and Maximum pc forum, newegg.com. I'm financially broken right now so it will take some time before I can make further upgrades or buy back Doom 3 and the other games I had, but I plan to get a Cd writer drive first and some other things. Right now I'm in the middle of putting together another Dromed FM that I started on while I was marooned with an old PC, but maybe I can start back on Radiant around the end of the year when that project is finished.

-omfg, I think I shit my pants. I wonder again, that in the wonders of the pc world, modders make retail games evolve, and progress (ex. : Valve-quake2 modders, made half-life, then a mod for HL was CS, that made valve and hl huge) On the other note, "Ultra Realism Possibilities?" Last time I checked, there are more things in the world then wooden floors! How about, if a guard is holding somthing (cup, sword, dagger) and you knok them out, it drops with noise and u hav 2 pik it up. and guards -differnt types is good, with differnt weapons and heights/body size. another realistic idea is replacing a guards route, for example, if there are 2 guards walking in parelel hallways, and they hear each other. if u knok one out, the other will chek it out if he stops hearing his buddies steps, HOWEVER, you can as well, walk at the same pace as the guard u knocked out did, so the others will take you (audibly) for another guard (if u r in the guards patrole route. another things, i strongly support the random factor, but instead of florbards, it should mean AI, not random routes alltogether, but conversations with others, daydreaming, looking at surroundings (Springheel had good examples) and another factor (for those still reading) pets- I think there was a parot in one of the thief games, but there could be dogs (track smell -hint -hint, cats, rats) and blood - shoot water,, its gone? no..... no. water needs time to evaporate, however, i dont have a concrete idea to elaborate on this, but kill, shootwater, move on, is a bit easy. door, objects and physics- this was promised in HL2 and dissapointed untrue in the final game -blckoing doors. by bloking a door with a heavy object, some guard may randomy try to open it and think its closed, and move on, if its not completly blcoked off (door opens slightly) they should ghet curious, and if they kno ur there, they would try to ram it open, and call for backup. poisen- (in TENCHU for ps1 u could poisen dogs with poisened rice) but if guards eat and drink, then u could slip sleeping potion or poisen in their food/bavergae) arrows- arrows shouldnt "disaperar" after shot (water arrows will be needed to be picked up, in case a guard sees it later on, broadhead arrows shot in stone break, but are still there) as for items/custumasation -thief should have a house (more like an apartment/closet in thief3) and have numerous items, which he can take before a mission, and players choses what to take according to mission (as in hitman2) the goods may include weapons, clothes and cloaks, which leads to next idea comoflage (no as simple as metalgear3)- lets say, black is the best color, but green would do better for more outside/par/forest based location and you could be detected harder in more light if u are wearing green next to a s bushy are, than black no? ok, im ready for the bashing. thats all thats on my mind for now, please respond honestly.

Gildoran :How do you suggest that be accomplished? Making a movie/video-game/etc is often an expensive process. You say rich fatcats should be done away with, but what would be a good way to fund art without them? At least with the current model people have a choice about which art to fork over their hard-earned cash to support. For one, I never suggested anything, I was merely diagnosing the problem. Sure creating these things can be expensive, but how much of that expense is added on to actual production and distribution costs? How much of the funding goes to the art and the artists, how much goes to the shareholders and officers of Corporation, Inc.? And spare me the sermons about "choice", the vast majority of choices that we have to pick from consist of the Coke vs. Pepsi variety, in other words no choice at all. With the current model, people fork over their hard earned cash for shit over which the artist and the consumer have little say, while important decisions go down in boardrooms. Some choice. Gildoran: Admittedly, I think that most players have poor taste. For example, I hate how most competitive FPS gamers prefer mindless reflex battles to strategy; I prefer to be killed by a camper any day rather than some twich-happy gamer jumping around like an olympic gymnist. ...but hey, if that sort of thing entertains so many people it can't be all bad. Just realize that during Shakespear's time, he was thought to be pandering to the penny-knaves, and producing mindless entertaining crap that catered to mass-markets rather than intellectual high-brow poetry and art. And now we see him entirely differently. Maybe a hundred years from now, Counterstrike and Halo will be seen the way Shakespear is. *shudder* But its impossible to really compare Shakespeare, or his historical period, with the current day. What you say is true about his work, he was criticised as being low brow, although I think a lot of the criticism came from religious authorities who viewed theater, especially public theater, as being influenced by the Hooved One. (Dont quote me on that last bit, Im no Shakespeare expert.) But although Shakespeare continues to be influential, he could never dream of the level of influence that a gigantic conglomerate like MGM enjoys. They have control over content, production, and distribution, they bully artists and consumers, buy politicians and pay for lobby groups to advance their interests. At least a chunk of Shakespeares popularity can be attributed to the quality of his art, for whatever reasons people loved his work and still do, so he survives. Consumers of art through the centuries have said "This stuff is good, and I want to see it again." Thats not the total story, but its a part of it. Today, in the mass entertainment machine, all you need is a pretty face to sell album covers, you neednt be able to sing even, or act, or whatever, and you are suddenly a "SUPERSTAR", the supposed choice of millions of consumers. This is one of the reasons the recording industry concentrates so much of its influence on pre-teen to late teen/early twenty somethings, the most impressionable age groups where strong in-group identity makes it harder for an individual to resist popular trends. They know that once people leave this age group, they are far less likely to pay for the same re-hashed horseshit over and over again. Gildoran: Oh well... If that's the price to pay for having so many games to choose from (even if they're all clones of eachother), then so be it. So long as we don't outlaw people from writing their own games, I'll be happy. So we have a wide open spectrum of choice, as long as our choices consist of essentially the same product? Sounds like Coke v. Pepsi again. As to outlawing people making games, until the community is able to produce its own editor with no strings attached, that remains a very real possibility.

The rules have been constantly broken, revised and improvised over the last 500 years - that's how music evolves. Classical music all but died out around the 1940's and 50's and was replaced largely by the ideas of modernism by some cunt called Schoenberg who thought dissonance for it's own sake was the way to go, and calssical music basically became an anti-popularity exercise. Thats why you now have a situation where modern classical music has been shunned by the populace at large, in the same way modern 'art' has. THe point of Metal is something for teenagers to annoy their parents with. They just want something as loud and offensive as possible for the purpose- any meaningless noise will do. Metal was created for this anarchistic social role, not as a form of music. Not surprsingly, it remains very popular among teenagers. It also shows the puerlie level at which anyone who likes it as an adult operates at. I see, so any sound can be considered music can it? THe sound of your jeans being ripped off? THe squelching noise of you being raped up the ass? Your screams of pain? Well, send me the recording of it anyway, I'll get a good laugh out of it at the very least, even if I don't start tapping my foot. What was all that blabbering in aid of? WJHere did I say European classic music was better than chinese or hindu? I was comparing earlier Western music to modern Western music.

You had something (because opinion is a major factor) until that post. I half-think you're kidding about the "technically demanding" stuff? Death (or other) metal, love it or hate it, is not one of the most technically demanding styles of music to perform. Vamping out a "complex" pattern on the E string, grinding through repetitive patterns of 5-chords, and breaking the monotony with a screaming arpeggio-laden and progressive scale based in-key solo, is not uncommon for a guitarist to pick up in under a year of play. If even only to compare one type of guitar ("metal" guitar) with another (classical guitar), the considerations for performance are SO different and unbalanced that they're not even the same instrument, really. Deafening, muted, distorted, chugged electric versus glass-smooth filed fingernails, one plectrum versus four (or more) attack fingers, jamming a repeating rhythm versus simultaneous solo performance of backing and lead melody lines, etc... no way. And this is from a guitarist who spent his late teens and early twenties playing just such music - both kinds. The classical pieces I know are infinitely more challenging to perform well, in countless ways, than the latest Kirk Hammett solo. And today, every 20 cent band has an Yngwie or two (though I'm not one). I know, I know... "that's not death metal." It should also be noted that speed does not necessarily equal skill. That said, I think the majority of classical music simply sucks. It's boring, often complicated for no reason other than to be complicated ("Oh yes maestro, we're so impressed!"), and so goddamn derivative that you swear you have heard that same cadenza in a thousand different pieces. Yuck! Get a new idea, and stop copying the so-called "masters." Yet there are the gems that earn classical music the respect it deserves. Now that last paragraph can be reworded for any type of music. (Well... except for Top-10. That's simply shit, consistently.) The majority of metal sucks, too. As far as I'm concerned, there are only a handful of metal bands worth listening to. The majority of everything sucks. But the gems are out there, in everything. Edit: LOL, a post about Sin2 and Steam, no more!

There might be a 'realistic' solution that dev's could implement to solve the old problem of wood torches burning in the hundred-year old abandoned catacombs of where-ever. Don't quote me on this, but Whale Oil was used mostly during the Victorian Era; both in candles and lamps; and burned with a clear, bright flame that lasted for quite a while. It was also used in Asia. Supposedly the Emperor Qin's tomb, discovered in the last century, had lamps with a large vat of whale oil built in the wall behind them. Though reports are sketchy, because the tomb hasn't been opened to the public since its discovery in the 70's, the first people to enter the tomb found many of the lamps still burning (after a few thousand years). I suppose if we wanted a realistic solution to the lighting of abandoned crypts and caves problem; this might be better than saying they're lit by 'magic' (of course Luminous Fungii is one too, but probably better for caves). As thief is in a fantasy setting, it would not be too much of a stretch to suppose that they would be able to implement a lamp with a reserve of oil built into the wall behind it. The modellers may be able to implement some design like this. Anyways, just a suggestion Edit: I suppose if the Dev's were so inclined they could also just create a torch thats 'magic; and that burns forever, unless put out'. Hey, Thief does have magical elements in it; so even this would be plausible! (But lazy)

Actually, I've done loads of webdesign the last couple of years. After I started with xhtml, css and reading tricks and tips about webstandards and walkarounds, I now know how to design a website that looks good in all 3 major browsers (IE, Opera and Mozilla/Firefox). I first used a separate CSS file for IE, but soon had no need for it. It's all about using the xhtml/css correct, and use small walkarounds when encountering a problem.

Yes. The last post from me at least.

Here are a few things to maybe help with animations... 1) Opening door... 2) Overhead hammer swing... 3) Walking/running animations... Click here for a larger view of the last image... ------ Notes: 1) This is my interpretation of what happens when I reach to open a door. I didn't have a mirror to help me, but I reached for the door over and over again until I captured in my mind what I thought was happening with my body. 2) Drawn from a reference in an anatomy book I have. A near copy of what is in the book, but the book had a pick axe in-hand or something instead. 3) Photocopy of a page out of the anatomy book. 1st row is a walking animation. 2nd row shows an overhead view of the footsteps, along with the hip axis twisting (fig. 2), and added shoulder movements in conjunction with the hip movements (fig. 3). 3rd row shows a running animation. 4th row shows walking up stairs. 5th row shows walking down stairs.

Thanks oddity. Yeah the chest brush one was exactly what I spent a while tweaking last night. Fixed it up and it's pretty much done but I think there's still something about it that bugs me. I'll get back to it in a few minutes. I'll try to get the updated ones on the FTP once I figure out what the problem is

It is both consumers and publishers that are the problem, not so much artists per se. Most big movies/games/music/TV shows these days are put together by large commitees pandering to focus groups, not artists. Copyright was invented a few centuries ago to give publishers a total monopoly over the production of printed works, thereby enabling them to determine what content was produced, and to milk every last cent out of it. It never had anything to do with protecting artists rights, then, as now, the artists themselves were paid a pathetic pittance by the publishers for their works. Before copyright was invented, composers like Bach wrote music for specific purposes under the commision of a church or wealthy aristocrat. They made a lot more money out of it than most modern musicians and composers do, as their profits now go mainly to publishing companies coffers. Consumers are resposible for perpetuating this by shelling out their cash for the most hyped-up mega special effects hollywood blockbuster instead of indie films made by actual artists, or buying crappy computer games that are basically the same as all of their other ones instead of trying different things. Abolishing copyright puts artists back in the spotlight, rather than commitee driven repetitions of tired old formulae. Artists that make something worthwhile will recieve enough donations to continue their craft and make a living, even if they don't get rich off it... The quality of things will improve dramatically. Interesting... I grew up on classical music, but I always like the more bombastic composers like Wagner, Holst, Prokofiev, and when I started playing guitar and discovered progressive death metal, it was like I had found the music I had wanted to hear all along... To me classical music was quickly replaced by death metal as the pinnacle of music for me, and while I still like a lot of it, just as much sounds derivative and boring - most classical composers ripped each others ideas off so much that lots of classical music sounds pretty much the same to me. Movie soundtracks are almost completely interchangeable these days, apart from John Williams, there are not many film composers that are worth listening to... I guess I am an officionado of a sophisticated, elitist form of heavy music with interesting, complex mathematical structures, odd tempo changes, and wierd time signatures, not the boring verse/chorus/verse/chorus/solo/chorus/chorus crap that most people listen to these days... Anyone else like old-school point and click graphic adventures, like Beneath A Steel Sky, The Dig, Universe, Monkey Island, Dark Seed? Those were my favourite games when I was a teenager, and I wish more people made them, or incorparated more elements of adventure into other game types. I prefer games with lots of puzzle solving to lots of shooting... Bring back puzzles (but not jumping puzzles, I hate those)!

Got the remaining two. The handhip one looks great, and the stretch is nice and subtle. These are all very good. I was quite excited imagining watching these in action in a map. I think what I'll do, rather than trying to link every one above (I can't host that much), is bundle them up and put them on the FTP site for others who want to check them out. If you send me the last two in your list above I'll put them all up.

Here's the only one that's arrived so far (though it says 'last one') Scratching Cheek -looks great!

Please don’t be vulgar. But in any case I was referring to the ability to hide, sneak past. Pariah, farcry?- it wasn’t the aim in either game but could be done quite effectively. That is true to varying degrees but there is scope for this to improve. You site gothic 3 and oblivion as games you are looking forward to. What are they but fps with RPG elements? (Ok you can play in third person). The fps needs to expand and it has been doing. Deus ex (though it didn’t start it) can be sited as invigorating the fps formula and showing that rpg elements add to the experience. The story that you reject so utterly, and is central to the RPG experience, has to be improved to change the fps into the rpfps. Take the story out of the RPG and all you have is a landscape to wander about, and some very trivial npc's to trade with. But the main aim is to kill things, sounds abit like an fps with a bigger map. Take the story out of the fps and you have serious sam or just an excuse to shoot things. Take just the killing out of an rpg though and you have a story and characters an adventure game infact. The story and the characters are what make games, books and films work. Doom3 failed for many people not because it was too dark, and not because its guns weren’t good enough. but because there was little character building and about a paragraphs worth of plot. A complex plot can work in an fps as well as an rpg. Deus ex managed it, arguably its sequel did. It isn’t first person but Max Payne 1 and 2 managed it. But yes there is lots of room for improvement. Pariah aimed for this and missed by wide amount but the attempt was there. Perhaps those that worked did so because their main aim wasn’t to let you shoot things, story telling was.The shooting was a device to move the story/plot and characters along. None has the story depth of a true rpg, but they don’t have to, an rpg normally lasts about 40 hours in which you spend at least two thirds killing things, an fps normally last 10 hours at most The fps has to become more like an RPG, as you point out they are becoming very repetitive. Im looking forward to dreamfall btw. (http://www.dreamfall.com/)

Stealth in FPS - my cock. There's always the obligitory 'stealth level' in an FPS which everyone hates. Most of them don't' actually include any stealth mechanics in the game, but just say 'ok, you've been mindlessly shooting any moving object for the last 30 levels, but now we want you to walk through this part of the map with your guns holstered and without letting any AI see you' I don't care about story either. The basic principal of any story that involves walking through a series of maps shooting people and blowing things up with a variety of big guns, will always be crap. It's inevitable. Why game developers wanted to take the worst genre of movies - the action movie - and emulate them in games, is a mystery to me. I don't want to see a bunch of stealth games either. I've already had my fill wth Thief. I can't just keep playing the same genre with slight differences to plot or graphics. Virtually any game I try these days I quit within a few hours. My initial thought is usually 'Hang on, haven't I played this before'? The only genre I haven't tired of is the RPG, because there's a certain amount of freedom to wander around and explore, play a wide variety of different characters, progress in a wide variety of different ways, learn a wide variety of different skills, do what you want when you want etc. You can do stealth, action, or talk your way out of situations. There's so much more depth to them (the good ones). Not that I like every RPG, but Gothic 3 and Oblivion are the only games I looking forward to with any hope.

I like your thinking oDDity... I say we should abolish copyright... it only serves to line the pockets of big publishing companies that produce mountains of shit. Getting rid of copyright would go a long way towards wiping the slate clean. I very rarely buy CDs anymore - I have all the music I like, and it is not often that someone comes up with something new (I write a lot of music, but I do it for myself, I don't intend to publish any of it. If I do publish it, I will not copyright it as such, it will be a creative commons sort of thing). I can't remember the last time I saw a movie that didn't dissapoint me... I am sick of Hollywood USA-centric movies that are all special effects and no substance. Before copyright was invented, artists didn't care whether what they made was derivative or not, it was about quality and substance, about producing something that was unique, even if it wasn't original (I hope the difference between the two is clear to all). An artist created work for themselves, and if they were good enough, someone would pay them to do it. These days, publishers spew out any old crap and market it as the latest 'must have' thing, even though it is vacuous, vile, contemptible garbage worth less than a mound of elepant dung (at least elephant dung has some uses). Damn straight oDD, scrap it all!

That brings me back to my point... if game devs sell their games at a lower price point, they will have to sell more copies to make enough moeny to make it worth the effort. To sell more copies, they must have a much higher quality game than they get away with at the moment, and they must make an effort to make it stand out from the crowd by giving an old idea a new twist, doing something a bit differently. I never buy games anymore until the price has dropped down, even if that means waiting for 6 - 12 months after the game has been released before purchasing my own copy. I still don't have Doom 3 yet! I mostly agree with oDDity on this, I have bought very few games over the last few years... they mostly seem like the same game once you get the CD out of the packaging. Personally, I think if you aren't going to make a game that is highly original, then at least take a well used idea and improve it. I guess that is what TDM is all about - taking the best of Thief and improving on it. Sure it is a derivative concept, but that is not the point... There is a difference between something that is simply derivative, and something that is an attempt to improve on the original concept.

Posted a colour streetlamp concept last week. I'm currently working on blood-splatter decals, and learning more about how D3 does decals in general.

I'm using a lot of refference photos and sites to get the best look. I am planning to put in as much detail as possible with the program without getting a too heavy load on my system I'm using Sketchup 4 by @last software I'm a novice moddeler Cobra 6

You're obviously a competent enough modeler to join the team, but the last thing we need is another modeler who can't texture his own work to a high standard. I think I'm the only modeler here who textures to the same degree as he models. We already have a sack of untextured models as it is. Concept artists are one thing we don't lack, so while your drawing is good and it's nice for a modeler to be able to improvise and come up wth hs own suggestions, it's not really a bonus. I'd have to see your animation. If it's good enough you could definfitely get in as an animator/modeler.

I just had my last University exam. It was shite, but I'm still happy overall. :lol: Now, like New Horizon, I will have a certificate showing that I can do something I'm already perfectly competent at, and have been doing for a few years already. Woo! Now what am I going to do with the rest of my life?

The last days i work with the editor. A found substract, vertex editing, and how possible select brushhes these under some other brushes!!!!! The resize is very good, i could work 2 times faster than dromed. Only the lighting not good for me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! doom3 engine use pixel sized realtime lights. This Eat much cpu power (10-25 framerate plus when i off the shadows) and not look too good!!! In first time when i look projected shadow i think how i look some grafical erorr!!!!!!!!! I used shadow off option in system/advanced menu, in doom3 and the framerate is good. when i on the shadows, the performance boosted!!!!! I think in darkmod impossible off shadows options, if possible, cause less shadows, more difficult the hiding!!!!!! And the mods several times slower than modded game. This slowness plus shadows cause how darkmod not enough fast on my poor machine p2 2.4 512 mg ati 9600 xt! ANd additin how realtime shadow not enough nice:( The lightmaps very good things in games unfortunately doom3, and t3 not use ! (

i have been very busy over the last couple of months but now i should be able to put some time into this again. Here is a very quick test of how my zbrush normal map is working out . i am just posting it to let you know i am still working on the nobleman as i havn't posted for ages. the technique of generating normal maps in zbrush is working great ...although i have not tryed it in the doom engine yet. anyhow just to let you all know i am back on the job