Animation Critiques

[Springheel]

Thought it might be better to make one main thread for this.

 

I've been watching the new walk animation for a while, and something about it bothers me. It's hard to describe exactly what it is, but there is something very stiff looking about the torso, as if the entire torso and hips are rotating back and forth as the AI walks. It almost looks like the character is wearing a wet bathing suit and is trying to minimize the chaffing. You can't see it from every angle, but it is fairly noticeable to me after watching an AI walk for a time. It may also be connected to the arms not seeming to swing as far as they should (the shoulder moves quite a bit but the arm does not swing much).

 

People can fire up test/walk_ik and see what they think.

[oDDity]

I have a walk animated, but its not in the game yet.

http://www.pixelwerks.be/pictures/walkt.avi

[squill]

thx for bringing this up Springheel. I noticed small differences ingame and what i animated in Maya. I made some clips to show you what i'm seeing and maybe it's also what you mean.

 

walk in maya

walk in-game

 

The torso rotates (y-axis) much more then what i created in maya, watch the pauldrons. Also the head rotates along witch the torso, like he has a stiff neck, which is not happening when you look in maya. I think it has to do with the other anims being played on top of the walk, but i'm not sure. You can also check the default anim with testmodel command.

 

The arms have a few ticks at the end of the cycle that i can easily fix by smoothing the rotation curves in maya.

 

Oddity with what rig did you animate that walk? Could be used for variation on the different guards.

[Tels]

The ingame walk was a bit too dark to see anything properly, but I noticed in both the ingame and the maya version that his feet slide over the floor while walking (instead of being put down in one place and then lifted off again), just like in a comic.

[squill]

The ingame walk was a bit too dark to see anything properly, but I noticed in both the ingame and the maya version that his feet slide over the floor while walking (instead of being put down in one place and then lifted off again), just like in a comic.

 

Ok maybe i should brighten clips in the future cause i'm working on a tft panel.

But yeah that's happening when you translate the origin for the forward movement of the whole body. For now the left foot stays in place but if you move the origin back some more to keep the right foot in place, the left leg starts sliding and vice versa. It's tweaking the distance until it looks good.

[squill]

Today i created a new idle pose/animation. Let me know what you think.

The feet are slightly rotated and it's closer to the old idle pose. I only have to edit the feet for existing idle anims.

 

idle 1

 

tweaked and added the following:

 

idle - default idle animation

idle_02 - a more subtle idle, but maybe hard to tell the difference from idle 1

idle_armwipe - new anim based on the previous version

idle_lookleft - ""

cough1 - adjusted feet to new pose

walk - tweaked the arms

 

Above are now in-game. I only adjusted the feet of cough1 as a test which you can see for yourself. For the rest of the existing idle animations i only have to adjust the feet and re-export which i'll probably do tomorrow. I'll also add the idle_pose.mb to the model_scr folder.

[SneaksieDave]

It's hard to describe exactly what it is, but there is something very stiff looking about the torso, as if the entire torso and hips are rotating back and forth as the AI walks. It almost looks like the character is wearing a wet bathing suit and is trying to minimize the chaffing.

Exactly! Though the first thing I imagined was that he uh... well, had an accident in his pants, and was trying not to smear it around too much while searching for a bathroom. Sorry for the vivid description, but I trust it makes the point clear.

[Springheel]

The idle animations are much better now. The blends between animations are a lot smoother. There is a little bit of clipping in the right hand as it sways back and forth, and the elbows might be tucked into the torso just a bit too much, but otherwise it looks great. I love seeing the fingers actually animate--it's the first animation where they actually look alive.

 

The walk animation seems somewhat improved...the shoulders don't seem to twist as much...but there is still that awkwardness in the hips.

[Springheel]

I have a walk animated, but its not in the game yet.

 

Odd, if you can upload the .mb, I can see about getting it in-game.

[squill]

The idle animations are much better now. The blends between animations are a lot smoother. There is a little bit of clipping in the right hand as it sways back and forth, and the elbows might be tucked into the torso just a bit too much, but otherwise it looks great. I love seeing the fingers actually animate--it's the first animation where they actually look alive.

 

thanks..these anims are wip..meaning i'm usually going back and forth improving animations but at least the base is in-game.

 

The walk animation seems somewhat improved...the shoulders don't seem to twist as much...but there is still that awkwardness in the hips.

 

i haven't touch the shoulder part, only smoothed the curves of the arms. It still has the same weird rotation on the torso and head because of the other anim played on top. If you check the walk with "testmodel atdm:ai_citywatch" (type nextanim to find walk) you'll see it has no rotation on the torso/head part.

 

Is there a way to turn off the anim channels for the torso on the walk? couldn't find it in the def file.

I guess some idle anim is still overriding the joints in the back/head when he's not looking around.

 

when i load the citywatch with testmodel the console says: anim "walk".... and head "idle"

[greebo]

The idleanim code is pretty confuscated. The channels TORSO and LEGS are often overriding each other and were giving me a lot of headaches. When I tried to swap the script call "idleAnim" with "playCycle" all the D3 zombies broke.

[Domarius]

I've always hated the walk. Whenever you see me comment "the walk cycle looks too much like the mocapped one" that's what I'm talking about. It's the result of using the walk anim from the motion capture library we have on the FTP and trying to tweak it to make it look different. Nothing will convince me that this is a good idea, unless you're filming your own mocap data specifically for your game.

 

The mocap files are good for reference though.

 

I've always planned to re-do all the movement cycles when I get good enough, since I don't like any of them, except the new ones squill has made - they're fine. If I re-did those I wouldn't mind people voting on mine or his.

[Springheel]

I've always hated the walk.

...

except the new ones squill has made

 

We're talking about the new walk Squill made.

[squill]

i've adjusted the feet of most idles that are played in-game.

 

also added a new wip idle animation:

stretch idle

 

the head looks a bit detached in the viewport but in-game it's better weighted... so you know

[Domarius]

We're talking about the new walk Squill made.

Oh ok sorry. I only saw the video of that. I thought it was good enough though, but I guess at the moment we are good to re-work existing ones, there doesn't seem to be a high demand for new ones yet.

[Springheel]

also added a new wip idle animation

:

 

Hmm...I don't have much problem with it technically...but it just seems like an odd action for a guard to take. Something about it strikes me as kind of feminine. Might just be me.

[Domarius]

Nothing odd about having a stretch, but maybe it needs more video reference, cause yeah it kinda doesn't feel "guardly" enough yet

[squill]

there are so many ways to visualize a stretch.. i'll make a variation with his arms in a more lifted pose.

[Tels]

Nothing odd about having a stretch, but maybe it needs more video reference, cause yeah it kinda doesn't feel "guardly" enough yet

 

Here is a good reference:

 

http://www.ebaumsworld.com/video/watch/428

[squill]

Cautious walk animation setup:

 

Perspective view

Side view

Back view

[Springheel]

Looks good as an animation Squill...I'm having a hard time imagining whether it will look like a cautious, search type walk or not--it seems a bit like a determined march from the side. We'll have to see in-game, but we can definitely use it somewhere.

[squill]

it's exported.. you can load it up in a map with the testmodel command.

[Springheel]

Ok, I've stared at it from different angles, and to be honest, I don't think it is ideal for the suspicious walk. It's a very good animation, but it looks like the AI has a definite purpose in mind, like he's stalking someone. The body is hunched over a bit and it looks like he could burst into a run at any minute.

 

That isn't exactly what "walk_suspicious" is supposed to be, however. Walk_suspicious is for an AI who doesn't really think there's an intruder, just something kind of off or unusual. I acted this out a bit in my house, and I think the walk would be much straighter (vertically) and less direct (horizontally). The AI doesn't know exactly what the source of the suspicion is, so he would be turning this way and that rather than stalking straight ahead. And he isn't expecting an immediate attack, so he wouldn't be hunched over with his weight on his knees--he's more erect, walking on his heels, with fairly short steps. It's a slow walk, but small steps. Don't know if that helps. TDS had something similar, if a guard gets kind of alerted ("that was a strange sound") but doesn't draw their weapon.

 

If the hand were changed to hold a weapon, I think this one would make a good alternate 'searching' animation for a level 2 or 3 alert.

[squill]

yeah suspicious would give this type of walk a clearer description. Luckily we can use this one for other search type of walks.

 

I indeed referenced this walk as a kind of alert level 2 search. That's why i choose a more extreme pose with his torso posed forward like "i heard something/someone and should check it out" kinda like the guards from the first thief but with swords drawn. I already made a quick setup with his right hand resting on his sword ready to draw.

 

like so ready to draw

 

suspicious would be a slower walk like his listening for any sound. Body is more at rest and head is slightly going side to side listening for clues. I'll see what i can come up with.

[Springheel]

I already made a quick setup with his right hand resting on his sword ready to draw.

 

That looks quite good. Nice and threatening. I'm sure we can use that for something.