bed height

[Fidcal]

The sleeper pose is now fixed but we need to consider what to do about the height. Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm assuming here that the sit animation height is already done and dusted and does not want changing. Since the sleeping animations involves sitting before and after then presumably this determines the sleeper's height.

 

If the above is true then in tests it is now clear that this height is fixed above floor level. I tried non-solid beds and different tricks before I realized it makes no difference. The only thing that works is to raise the bed 3 units. The new pose means now that at this height the body is flush with the surface, probably very slightly clipping in which is ideal as the bed is meant to be soft, and the head sinks slightly into the pillow - which looks natural. See picture below.

 

 

So temporarily I've made some 3-unit high brush blocks as feet to raise the bed. (The far bed in the picture is just raised up with no feet so you can see the distance involved.) But I'm wondering how easy it would be to extend the legs of the bed models so we have a standard height.

[Springheel]

That looks really good now.

 

I could raise the beds up without much difficulty, but that would cause problems in all existing maps with sleepers.

[Fidcal]

Only if the mapper has raised the bed up. It would probably cure more than it breaks. I think we need to set a standard while we still can. Plenty of other stuff getting broke.

[SneaksieDave]

Agreed there.

[Tels]

Agreed, too. Raising the bed model would actually fix maps with sleepers, wouldn't it? (How many of these do we have, btw? Probably not many)

[Springheel]

Ok, add a tracker entry for me and I'll get to it.

[Fidcal]

Now on tracker. Not all beds need fixing. The best height seems to be 23.5 above floor level for the main top surface of the bed.

 

This is PLUS 3 doom units for the following bed models:

 

models/darkmod/furniture/beds/doublebed_simple.lwo

models/darkmod/furniture/beds/singlebed1.lwo

models/darkmod/furniture/beds/singlebed_set01.lwo

 

But MINUS 4 for this bed (this ruins the character of the bed construction so I'm not sure how this might be shortened unless the bedding can be lowered.) The mapper might put a step at the side of this bed as a compromise. The sleep height is measured from the floor where the AI was standing not the brush surface beneath the bed. This bed is also short - an AI can just about fit.

 

models/darkmod/furniture/beds/bed_single_timber.ase

 

The wiki article on sleeping gives: "Another problem is that the bounding box stays behind and is solid when the AI goes to bed." so I don't know if that would be a further problem if 'fixed'. At the moment they can clip but this seems good to me to clip a little. It also means the AI can sleep in the lower bunk of a double bunk bed. Yes, he clips his head as he sits down but seeing an AI get into a bunk bed is so superior to what we had in Thief it is worth it. I think I can also get him to use the top bunk...

 

Test map is test/sleeperbed.map. All the beds are raised or lowered to the ideal height. Take a look; it's great fun.

 

The four poster bed and double bed equivalent are OK but mappers should stick a patch pillow on there as the head is now slightly raised. There is a pillow in one of the bed prefabs (which have now been changed to the correct height.) In fact, I think there is a prefab with the four-poster with bedding and pillow.

[SneaksieDave]

Cool. Noticed a couple of problems:

 

- They don't close their eyes when sleeping? I was surprised to notice this, because the ability is already there -- they close their eyes when slain.

 

- Don't know if this is a result of messing with the beds or the anims or what, but when they get up from the bed, they fall through the floor (like they used to with chairs)

[Mortem Desino]

@Fidcal: Try stabbing a sleeper in bed. Does the extra clipping cause ragdoll breakdancing either immediately or when you begin dragging the corpse?

[Fidcal]

Immediately. Some of it very violent and flying high above head height and sometimes upside down. Some alerted AI went back to sleep but floated high. I forgot to either monsterclip these beds or better yet, make them unfrobbable, unpushable moveables so they can path them properly.

[Tels]

That's a fun map!

 

Some points to consider:

 

* Could we raise the bunkbed's upper part? The clipping might then not be that worse (it must hurt

* wish the player position was higher up so you could watch the "go to sleep" better. Ditto for a small delay before they go to sleep

* some of the beds don't cast proper shadows the one in the far right corner f.i. the matress doesn't seem to cast a shadow

* AI weapons seem to clip quit a bit but don't think that can be changed. Does the AI have the ability to put their weapons down before going to bed?

[Ishtvan]

Ragdolls can go unstable if any part of the AF collision bodies are clipping into a solid. You can see them with g_showcollisionmodels 1, they're the red low-poly structures on the AI. Or if the ragdoll is already activated, you can see just those model with af_showbodies 1.

[Springheel]

I can't do anything about the .ase one, but I'll adjust the others.

[Springheel]

- Don't know if this is a result of messing with the beds or the anims or what, but when they get up from the bed, they fall through the floor (like they used to with chairs)

 

I noticed the builder do this once, but no one else.

 

 

I also notice that when you KO a sleeper, he 'teleports' to standing, then collapses.

[Fidcal]

Let's not worry about the ase one as it's the odd one out and mappers can avoid it for sleepers or there are other ways if someone desparately wants it. Let it just be a non-standard bed that is the exception to the rule.

[SneaksieDave]

What does greebo use to convert? Is it a complicated process or something anyone can do (e.g., install blender (free), run conversion script)? Seems silly that model adjustments are always hamstringed by the whole process involving multiple people who may or may not be available at any given time.

[Springheel]

Mappers can always just lower it into the floor anyway.

 

The .lwo ones are now fixed.

 

edit: Wow, I just saw the jittering problem when you kill a sleeper. It's hilarious! I shot him in the head and he flipped around like a rag doll and smacked into the wall, twitching and flailing like he was being electrocuted. Eventually he came to rest, still stuck to the wall.

[Springheel]

Hmm, I tried shooting all the sleepers in the head to see what happens, and the vast majority of them seemed fine. The body jerked up a bit, one actually flipped over, but nothing that seemed that unbelievable for someone just shot in the head.

 

The end bed, however, beside the bunk-bed, seems to be a special case (actually I've not tried the bunkbed yet). The AI acts like he's being electrocuted after death, quite different from all the others.

 

edit: I've seen the falling through the floor behaviour a few more times...seems like the AI falls off the bed while in the sitting position and sits on the floor, then goes through the floor when standing up.

[Fidcal]

Updated map with monsterclip, AI in top bunk, and adjusted bed positions for changed models. I think that end one who break dances when dying is not the bed but the AI as I tried him away from the bed. Basically I think these are reasonable but not perfect. I saw an AI fall through the floor after awakening at alert so that might be serious but hopefully for the time being a mapper can allow for that, eg, if a critical AI falls out of the map then maybe put a room below from which he can walk back up freely. That might have to suffice until it is solved.

 

One other thing, I've noticed these AI attack me once I alert them even though they are on team 0. Is that intended? That if a team mate is alerted he will attack you? That could be a serious problem if a friendly is needed to help the player but gets alerted.

 

[Springheel]

I think that end one who break dances when dying is not the bed but the AI as I tried him away from the bed.

 

I'll have to see if any of the archer attachments are the problem.

 

One other thing, I've noticed these AI attack me once I alert them even though they are on team 0. Is that intended? That if a team mate is alerted he will attack you? That could be a serious problem if a friendly is needed to help the player but gets alerted.

 

If you hurt them they'll turn violent. Possibly if they see you hurt someone else on the same team, not sure about that.