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Not sure if this should go in the general Dark Mod category, Off Topic, or Editors Guild but I like the idea of having a thread with screens from Thief FM's or other games with a similar theme or time period... for inspiration.

Yep. I've been nervous about cutting up maps because I'm not the most adept in DR and I've been afraid I would miss some caulk or cause a leak... But I'll give it a go. Or I could just build some crappy sky-scrapers and use one of the textures with deeper normal maps...

NHAT 2/3 is a beautiful city. I was a little afraid that my art would not live up to that one... but I guess that is ultimate proof as the lighting is supposed to be sloppy to give it that natural bounced radiance look. I will see in my PC can handle having a map of that size running well in Dark Radiant then I will check with GC... unless Biker wants to give me some throw-away mini map to use ...

Yes, I will create a basic map as well (just a modified Start map). I just wish I had a basic pre-built city to play with so I could test all the concepts out.

My votes:

Pictures added to the wiki. Still need to create the definition and test it out. http://wiki.thedarkmod.com/index.php?title=Light_Textures_and_Falloff_Images

Thanks for the answers Baddcog. Smoothing groups are a manipulation of the Vertex Normals then. Same trick different terms. I am not certain whether Jesps setup smoothing groups for his cave models then because there didn't appear to be any light tricks with the vertex boundaries. His caves were stunning nonetheless.

That is a Vertical Contest rule LEGION

I might get a couple of winks of sleep then. Thanks for the pics!

(This is probably a bad idea but I won't know till I get yelled at... ) With the exception of visual TDM changes like new textures, could you have a legacy mode switch that mappers could add to their maps? Too cumbersome? Encourages reliance on Bugs? Bad practice? Edit: (yup... I think it was a bad idea... )

I was really surprised by the performance of Jesps' map given that it's all LWO models. I see that this also appears to be what Arx End of Sun uses (but they appear to have modular mini rock formation models over their basic geometry). Given how well it worked I think you could even extend the technique by using Rich_is_Bored's Bent Vertex Normal trick and perhaps even a huge Normal Map (not sure if there is some sort of Normal Map size limit)? I was under the impression that using a Model for world geometry would cause AI path-finding issues so I presume that you put some Brushes over the paths? Or maybe the AI were walking on the Caulk Brushes?

Very mysterious. The only time I've had this "ghost in the machine" type behavior was when I was using a newer (beta) atioglxx.dll and had AA and AF forced in the control panel CCC. I presume that you have disabled Catalyst AI (prime suspect usually) so I can only suggest lowered AF (maybe 8x instead of 16x). Making sure that this is the in-game setting. Finally, post your DoomCfg.cfg as well.

Nothing that I can identify yet. After invoking conDump, type "map alchemist" (do not close the console) Please post the updated conDump text file.

You know I won't be able to sleep until this is completed, right? You've ruined me Biker. Utterly ruined.

Before launching the mission open the console and type: conDump example_name After the crash look for that file in your Alchemist sub-directory. Attach the text file to your next post.

AFAIK credits would be the only requirement. I would send a Personal Message to one of the team members to verify.

What ATI Catalyst version are your running? (Rage3d consensus seems to say that 10.4 was the last "good version"...) Have you tried killing Aero before launching?

Cant wait for your first release solarspace! Welcome to TDM forums! I admire your chutzpah for building everything from scratch but please feel no shame about sharing art assets (or anything else) as this is the spirit of the TDM project. If you have anything nifty to contribute please let the Devs know. I hope to see you around the forums more often. Good luck with your project!

One of those shots reminded me of Heart of Lone Salvation but it might just be placebo... ?

Wikified BTW...

Brutal start Fieldmedic I did mention liking "Trapped!" so this is similar... but man is it Brutal Thanks again.

OK... That is an interesting context. Some of your points seemed to indicate a general sense of concern for world at large but if your examples were all merely detached logical illustrations then any contrary parties should probably relax about the ultimate goal of your discourse. A simple amusement for a complex fellow, eh? Heck, you could be a devout "holy roller" testing out your devil's advocate to prepare yourself for a debate with some real-world Atheist Somehow I think that you care about the consequences of what the lunatics like me cook up and are hoping that common sense comes through in the end. That is a moral imperative whether you recognize it as such or not...

I think that Mortem has sufficiently boiled this down to the "belief in magic is what it is". It's merely personally rewarding for him to see things that look like proof or vindication. I see no need to dissect further. He has essentially capitulated that religion cannot be framed by reason and is positing that "reason itself" is not the epitome that others claim it to be. This is the indivisible atom that defines that aspect of his life. I doubt further in-roads to his personal development will shake free any insight that will say "Ah..., now I know why I believe this stuff so much and it's actually kinda silly...". This is the remaining path for these lines of inquiry as far as I can tell. As such, the only possible way to unseat such a strong belief would be to show, for instance, a copy of all the neurological activity that happens when a religious awakening occurs... then prove it can be invoked or repeated in ways that make the belief itself seem to be a fabrication from our failable conscience. Until we can jack Mortem into the Matrix and playback a miraculous feeling over and over again (to show it's artifice) he would be unlikely to jump from his current stance (and I suspect he would hold this stance even in the face of such an exercise). Then we would get to the point of, how much mood induction would be sufficient to "help" show Mortem see the artifice verses what would be biasing and mind-control. I suspect that there will be faithful religious folk even after we can jack people into VR worlds and make them think they are living in another reality. But that is where we will have to wait to see what the true devout do in the face of crushing logic. When feelings themselves can be conveyed in a concrete repeatable fashion. Conversely, at that point in our future, the religious may record their feelings of belief and transmit them to the Agnostics and Atheists of the world and some may "see the light" after trying out these recordings. Those points are both biased in my belief that the brain has some resemblance to a computer. I have seen some preliminary stuff that shows that we know the physical place and mechanism of short-term memory in mice. I have snowballed my own personal stock in this concept from that preliminary evidence. Sprinheel can comfortably believe that indoctrination is the reason anyone has religious notion as the statistics show a large correspondence. Since the science of psychology is not anywhere near as "hard" as the other scientific disciplines his take is the best that Occam we can cut. I, again, would stress that Springheel is simply living up to his own personal moral stance. And (from my interpretation) all the Abrahamic faiths require you to live up to your own known moral guidelines. If you violate or back-down from your understanding of your moral requirements you are in trouble with God. In a strange way, if Springheel were to let this go he might be punished by God for his apathy. These are slippery slope issues and I will again posit that Springheel probably doesn't mind religious folks "as long as they don't make real-world decisions based on advice from God". I think we would all prefer that a Politician or CEO would simply choose to do the right thing rather than do the right thing because they were afraid of going against God. So I will suggest that this is a common desire for both the Atheist and the Theist. We both prefer that the decision to "do the right thing" comes from an intrinsic respect for our fellow species. So here is our puzzle. If we are uncertain whether insanity has struck us with the notion that God is talking or if we are really being summoned by him, are we in trouble if we do not heed the call? Are we in more trouble if we carry out a command that violates our common moral stance? Abraham's example says "Yes, even if it seems crazy you must do it." That is a scary idea for the Agnostics and Atheists of the world but I think they (we????) can take comfort that even the most religious out there would not live up to that requirement (if it even exists?). And that is probably the thing that any Agnostic or Atheist would want to know about. They would want to know "If God told you to do something harmful would you do it?" Now the words of Jesus indicate that our active role is to pray and let God "do stuff" rather than to enact anything so that issue has been mostly skirted in Christianity. Unfortunately "dont do anything let God do it" is a hard rule to follow and brings up the problem of "I can see an immediate danger to someone else, should I help that person or follow the let God do it doctrine?" Which is a slippery slope towards "If I let unfaithful folk influence the faithful am I a bad person". The "let God do it" concept has never really been held-to very well in our history. So the Faithful and Atheist alike have reason to suspect anyone who suggests it. I doubt the US Military would "lay down all arms" and let God take care of things (for example). A) So the Old Testament has us doing "anything" God asks of us. The New Testament says "dont do anything, let God do it". Neither is practical for our lives. A) Leads to insanity and following weird whims. Leads to people being pushover pacifists who will be eaten alive by real society. Maybe the unrealistic goal of path is what is so inspiring about it. It reminds me of our "Commie" friend Aidakeeley's idealism. If all people lived up to either Communist or Christian ideals we could imagine a utopia as the result. But instead we have the foils to these approaches. For Communism we have the Authority who do not resist the temptation to empower themselves and take more than their fair share. For Christianity we have what I call "The Big Bruisers" people who want to uphold Christianity but cannot abide the "let God do it" doctrine and have to "help" (Holy Wars, Inquisitions, etc) God accomplish things. I think that the ideals set forth by the Christian and Communist notions are both noble and may be part of our intrinsic moral structure (whether given to us by God or Evolution). But I realize that we must not wander so far into these ideals that we allow ourselves to be ensnared by their shortcomings. If Christianity, for example, must try to enact real-world changes then the art of reason could be an ally against full capitulation to the "Big Bruiser" effect (or simply being utterly devoured by "real-world" active people who don't follow the "let God do it" doctrine.) I dont have anywhere near the faith to be a Christian Gandhi and let the world bowl me over so again I fail another requirement to keep me from burning... (I'd better save my pennies for those Android body-part replacements...)

No problem Baddcog... I'm just waiting for the beat-down from SneaksieDave for updating it

Yep. While I plug away with my learning and testing I am hoping for any "expert" additions to this wiki: http://modetwo.net/d..._Falloff_Images ...but I think we could get close to this look by: 1) Remove all direct lights 2) replace textures with plain gray textures 3) Place lights in map emitting where bounces would come from (FPS be damned) 4) Capture screen-shots 5) Use Image Editor (Gimp) to obscure all but the light patterns (bucket-fill, contrast, and selection tools) 6) Blur and Smear (faked Radiance transfer) 7) Save as a light texture or light decal (depending on preference...) 8) remove bounces and performance stealing lights that are "baked" 9) Add Shadow and Shadow-edge decals So some art some automatic engine work... and a way to avoid learning real GI baking methods