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Problems for mappers with animations


Fidcal
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I wanted to give one of the characters in my FM some special movements. The first problem is finding the information. Mappers are led to a list of maybe 20 articles from the editing section and I'm not sure that any of them are relevant to the mapper. I propose to remove all those links from editing and make a new article just for the mapper with links to developers etc. at the end (also the following article.)

 

The only relevant info I found was lost under path nodes but unless you already know that you won't find it. There was a mention in there of also triggering animations but no link so I don't know how that is done.

 

The item also says that anims are found in the AI def. That's no good. Most mappers won't know what a def is or which and even when I looked in mine there were no anims. I backtracked through several ancestor defs but still nothing. I did find a list in another dev file and had an idea that they are all stored here now that human AI share one skeleton. Is this true? All of this is very unfriendly for the mapper of course so I think it would be better just to list every known anim in a wiki article and state that some do not work on all AI (if true) and new ones may be developed and where to find them. Dromeders work to a general list and understand that not all work on all AI though admittedly Thief is a finished work.

 

There may be a case for a reference test map with all known animations set up so mappers can browse, read the anim names from text entities and note which ones they want. We used to have such a map so it might be possible to build from that.

 

The second problem is that even when I tried 4 or 5 anims on a path_anim, none of them had any effect. I tried adding a path_wait but no change. I checked the only example FM that came to mind - Builder's Influence - and it seems to be set up the same way for the same anim and I am using a builder too. So I gave up and I fear this is what most mappers will do.

 

I'l try again with some other AI to reproduce what I did yesterday in case those anims only works on certain AI but otherwise I'm going to need help to get anims working let alone make them available for the average mapper. Of course, it may be that anims are currently being overridden by idle anims or not working for some other reason. I'm hoping it's something simple like you need to dmap (unlikely) or add a spawnarg to the AI or something that I don't know about.

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Yes, animations are far from user-friendly at the moment. I've organized them a bit inside proguard_devel, but most mappers won't even find them there to begin with.

 

I can add the list of existing animations with a slight description of what they do. If you can cut and paste the text from tdm_ai_guards_proguard_devel.def for me I could do it here at work. Do you have a wiki page already?

 

The second problem is that even when I tried 4 or 5 anims on a path_anim, none of them had any effect. I tried adding a path_wait but no change. I checked the only example FM that came to mind - Builder's Influence - and it seems to be set up the same way for the same anim and I am using a builder too.

 

I was the one who set that up, so I can try and help with yours if you like. What character are you using, first of all? If it's a builder guard then virtually all the animations should work.

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I've ran out of time tonight. I've not started a wiki article yet.

 

yes I recall you did that BI one which I quite liked so that was an inspiration to do some myself.

 

The AI I am using is a atdm:ai_builder_priest_combatant. I've modified a skin and head to improvise an alchemist. I gave it the sword which works OK. He keeps it on his back like a hammer which is cool. Dunno if that could affect other anims. idle anims all work.

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Strange, the sword should automatically replace the draw animations with the hip ones.

 

What animation are you trying to get him to play?

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These are some I tried:

 

anim bottle_drink02

anim idle_warmhands

anim turnpage_righthand

anim idle_stir_pot

 

He did not have a drawn sword so that should not be a problem. I set up two path corners and waits so ... corner > anim > wait > corner > anim > wait. He went back and forth and waited but no anims that I could see.

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I can't think of any obvious reasons why that wouldn't work. I can take a look at the map file if you like.

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I'd rather avoid spoilers if possible. Why not just copy the relevant AI and pathnodes and save it as a prefab? I can plop it in a map and see what happens. If it works in my map but not yours we can start looking at what might be causing the problem.

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OK, maps/test/anim_prob.map now committed.

 

I stripped out all my changes (skin, head, sword, etc) right back down to the basic combat priest and still can't see any anims. Also true on SVN and release 1.01 so it's not a release assets problem.

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Ok, found out the problem. Apparently, the path_anim won't work without an "angle" property (not sure why). When I rotated the path_anims, they worked.

 

I've updated the wiki.

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I confirm it's working now but that spoon stirring actually puts a spoon in his hand. But problems with it. The spoon is very bright. I tried to frob it as it looks continuously highlighted - and very bright highlight at that. In addition, he keeps it as he goes on to the other animations. Only after an alert did he let it go and then it remained suspended in mid-air.

 

I'll start a placeholder for that wiki article now.

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I confirm it's working now but that spoon stirring actually puts a spoon in his hand. But problems with it. The spoon is very bright. I tried to frob it as it looks continuously highlighted - and very bright highlight at that. In addition, he keeps it as he goes on to the other animations.

 

Yes, there are some problems with Tel's attach/detach system, which that animation is using. It spawns two spoons and then crashes when you try to destroy the spoon (so right now the destroy line is commented out). I'm not sure if Tels has gotten anywhere trying to fix it.

 

Here's the thread: http://forums.thedarkmod.com/topic/10924-new-active-prop-playing-cards/page__view__findpost__p__215397

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Thanks.

 

I've started a more general article for mappers...

 

http://wiki.thedarkmod.com/index.php?title=Animations%2C_Postures%2C_Controlling_AI_%28for_Mappers%29

 

I've also ripped out quite a few animation articles mostly relevant to developers away from the editing index so the mapper can more easily see what is relevant to him.

 

One link I added to my new article is about attaching objects. I'm unsure if that is the latest. I know you have done recent work on this so change that link if necessary.

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Yeah, I linked to it from the pathnode article. I'll fix it up this week at work; just wanted to get the raw data there for now.

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Ok, found out the problem. Apparently, the path_anim won't work without an "angle" property (not sure why). When I rotated the path_anims, they worked.

 

I've updated the wiki.

This sounds like a bug, please report.
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Yes, there are some problems with Tel's attach/detach system, which that animation is using. It spawns two spoons and then crashes when you try to destroy the spoon (so right now the destroy line is commented out). I'm not sure if Tels has gotten anywhere trying to fix it.

 

Here's the thread: http://forums.thedarkmod.com/topic/10924-new-active-prop-playing-cards/page__view__findpost__p__215397

 

No, any way I tried to find out why it does actually create two spoons (there is only one line in the animation) failed, e.g. I still don't know why it happens.

 

The crash is not allright, either, but understandable, as there are now two spoons instead of one (and possible the attachment system gets confused). I asked a few questions but I am not sure I read an answer by ishtvan or crispy on them.

"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man." -- George Bernard Shaw (1856 - 1950)

 

"Remember: If the game lets you do it, it's not cheating." -- Xarax

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I asked a few questions but I am not sure I read an answer by ishtvan or crispy on them.

 

I don't think either of them are reading all threads anymore, but they usually respond to pms.

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