BSOD with EAX enabled question:

[Bikerdude]

I've been getting a weird BSOD issue when working on very large maps.

 

My setup is Win7SX64 with 8Gb of ram and when editing I have DR and TDM open at the same time. When doing a dmap I observe TDM using upto a maximum of 1.9GB, dropping back down to 200-300MB when the map has been loaded. DR uses about 1-1.3GB.

 

The BSOD only happens when I have EAX enabled and upon examining the memory dump I get the report of "Probably caused by : ctoss2k.sys ( ctoss2k+5cea )" And even then its not immediate

 

I have googled the aforementioned error but after an hour or so of sifting through countless "I've got this error too please help" or "have you tried un-installing and reinstalling the driver" flotsam search results I gave up looking. It seems to be a case of the creative driver being the route of the issue, which if you go by the search results where you will see both "BSOD" and "ctoss2k.sys"

 

The only ray of sunshine with this issue is it seems to only happened when editing v-large maps. So has any got any ideas? other than disabling EAX (at some point I want to learn how to add eax to my maps etc)

 

Im seriosuly considering getting rid of the XFi for the best non-creative card I can buy.

[Radiant]

Well, there are drivers available by Daniel K. for creative cards. Because the official drivers tend to have unfixed issues.

Please have a look:

http://www.hardwareboard.eu/threads/20712-Daniel-K-SB-X-Fi-series-Support-Pack-2-5-(10-25-2011)

http://danielkawakami.blogspot.de/

[Bikerdude]

Well, there are drivers available by Daniel K. for creative cards. Because the official drivers tend to have unfixed issues.

I get the BSOD with his driver also.

[Bikerdude]

A related question, how does TDM/D3 use OpenAL? if I buy another non-creative card (eg a Xonar) will I still have the option to enable surround speakers and will eax work by proxy via OpenAL..?

 

I suppose I should ask if anyone is playing TDM on a Xonar, if so what model and what has thier experience been.?

[7upMan]

BD, I was told that Asus Xonar deliver superior sound and have good, regularly updated drivers. I have no idea if this is correct, but if you manage to find a Xonar card that's any good, please post. I'd like to swap my Creative Audigy 2 ZS sooner rather than later.

[ungoliant]

As far as I can gather from my own research into the matter, Yes, D3 uses OpenAL natively, making ALchemy useless. see here.

 

Also, for other users having problems, OpenAL and EAX both "work". If you can even get a "error loading data into OpenAL hardware buffer" error, it means that D3 has done all its driver loading handshake work to initialize OpenAL and EAX. There seems to be something in TDM code that is putting a wrench in the gears. \

I hypothesize this because I can get EAX and OpenAL and 7.1 surround speakers working in vanilla d3 with no issue, and I can confirm 100% that there is TDM code interfering with speaker selection that was not present in vanilla d3.

 

Edit: Also according to the Post System Config thread, GlyphSeeker is using a Xonar. you might pm him to see if he has eax problems. (surround sound issue can be worked around without EAX being enabled)

Edited September 10, 2012 by ungoliant

[Bikerdude]

• that there is TDM code interfering with speaker selection that was not present in vanilla d3.
  
• Edit: Also according to the Post System Config thread, GlyphSeeker is using a Xonar.
  
• (surround sound issue can be worked around without EAX being enabled)
  

• Hmm, When things calm down a bit maybe Gman might be able to shed some light on this.
  
• Ah cool I will Pm him.
  
• Oh yer, how.?
  

[ungoliant]

• Hmm, When things calm down a bit maybe Gman might be able to shed some light on this.
  

no need, the problem has been identified:

Yeah, our code does this:

	if ( idSoundSystemLocal::s_numberOfSpeakers.GetInteger() != 6 && idSoundSystemLocal::s_numberOfSpeakers.GetInteger() != 2 ) {
			common->Warning( "invalid value for s_numberOfSpeakers. Use either 2 or 6" );
			idSoundSystemLocal::s_numberOfSpeakers.SetInteger( 2 );
	}

 

Probably easy to change, but I have neither EAX (doesn't work on linux), nor more than 2 speakers, nor a sound card for this (I guess?), nor windows. Sorry

Tel's has tentatively added "8" channel support for 7.1, but i'd be happier if the value check was removed altogether. For now, if you must get surround sound working, you must tell windows to use a 5.1 surround or Stereo setup. These are the only configurations TDM will cooperate with ATM because the only speaker values that are accepted are "2" and "6", and d3 seems to know to "look" for a stereo or 5.1 setup, and will barf up error messages if a 5.1 configuration is not found when you try to select "surround sound".

 

So basically, the fix for my computer is: Change speaker setup in Windows from 7.1 to 5.1. Start tdm. select surround sound. 5.1 sound now works, but I lose 2 channels in the process.

Edited September 10, 2012 by ungoliant

[Bikerdude]

So basically, the fix for my computer is: Change speaker setup in Windows from 7.1 to 5.1. Start tdm. select surround sound. 5.1 sound now works, but I lose 2 channels in the process.

I shouldn't have to do anything then as my setup is only 5.1.

[ungoliant]

Sounds about right. However, i think having EAX enabled and functioning is a game-changer. I remember when i was using the Audigy 2 ZS with EAX enabled, 7.1 would "work", and TDM would not barf error messages, but my speakers would always act funny. I realize now that it was probably downmixing from 7.1 to 5.1. There might be some weird kind of auto detection going on with EAX enabled, which would explain why some people cannot get surround sound to work without EAX. However, in the aforementioned posts, you can configure speakers properly without using EAX in the manner I described.

 

Basically, I believe that EAX when enabled and functioning, can pick up on multiple speaker setups other than 2 or 6 channel. However, TDM will downmix or upmix to your chosen s_numberOfSpeakers cvar settings, which are currently locked at either stereo or 5.1 (2 or 6 channel), and without EAX, you must manually set your speakers to 5.1 in Windows to use surround sound at all.

This is all speculation of course, but it seems to fit.

 

Oh yea, to return to original topic: I think that TDM code is screwing with EAX somehow (because it works properly in D3, and the speaker settings code has definitely been screwed with). The same problems that prevent some people from using EAX may be the same or related problem that allows EAX to crash your system. It likely has something to do with that damn buffer.

Edited September 10, 2012 by ungoliant

[Bikerdude]

Oh yea, to return to original topic: I think that TDM code is screwing with EAX somehow (because it works properly in D3, and the speaker settings code has definitely been screwed with). The same problems that prevent some people from using EAX may be the same or related problem that allows EAX to crash your system. It likely has something to do with that damn buffer.

Hmpf, thats what i was afraid off. Well its safe to say this wont get looked at untill after 1.08 is out the door. I have PM'd Glyph as I am keen to pickup one of those Xonar cards and see if I can kiss good bye to creative once and for all.

[Tels]

Serpentine has programmed a massive patch that changes TDM to use OpenFX (anEAX replacement) or whatever. However, he didn't check it in and now has vanished.

 

This is a common problem, Serpentine likes to only check in code that works 100%. He didn't check in the massive change that makes compressed Normals work, either.

 

So we are now out of the sound change, out of the normal change, AND out of Serpentine *sigh* I wish I had bet 1000 € that this would happen...

[Bikerdude]

Serpentine has programmed a massive patch that changes TDM to use OpenFX (an EAX replacement) or whatever. However, he didn't check it in and now has vanished.

I think you mean OpenAL?

 

And do you mean this code is already part of TDM or Serps was going to make it part of TDM?

[Tels]

He was going to make it part of TDM - he has not commited his code, so nobody knows what the code is actually.

[Bikerdude]

Hmm, I'll drop him a PM and or email.

[Springheel]

Serpentine likes to only check in code that works 100%

 

I'm sure Angua might dispute that.

[Tels]

I'm sure Angua might dispute that.

 

I meant he likes to check in code only when he thinks it is at 100%.

 

That doesn't mean its at 100% then But let's not bash him, he did a good number of things for us and I'm grateful for everything we get. It's surely easier to fix a few mistakes in a few minutes then to write several hours or days worth of code.

[Springheel]

But let's not bash him

 

Certainly none intended. More like good-natured ribbing.