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At least I now have some idea how it all fits together. :lol: Feel free to suggest other URLs though. Please confirm: It is SDK 2 (edit: v1.1) that I should be using, right? EDIT: For some reason Doom3_SDK_2.exe installs SDK 1.1 - oh well.

sword or dagger I have seen them both in many of the thief 2 fan missions I have played. its already been done. Both are Good and depending on how many times you may have to kill guards BIG GUARDS you may want a huge sword. many of the fan missions stretched the GAME either this way or That making each level fun and fresh and new. Making it an option or leaving it out all together FANS will Create there own if they really need it ... BUT it would be nice if the Dark mod Teem would right in as many tricks and weapons and bombs and potions as possible. PLUS I don't think that anyone started a game by creating all the stuff to go in it first. Didn't they create game spaces test spaces and then decide "hey that corner looks empty lets make a really cool shrubbery to go there" or "how will the player get to this area up here lets make a rope arrow" when Looking Glass People Gave us the DROMED it allowed us to use items that where created fro the specific levels that came with THIEF the reason some things where called RAMEREZ_CHAIR or something like that is because most of the items in THIEF are made for a specific level. so think about what infinite possibilities for Level storyline one may come up with and create all of them Or create say 15 really cool levels with varying Themes and Loosely cohesive stories that take the Player on a vary cool journey through a interesting Back story Each level Stylized differently and containing all objects and cool stuff that would be in that area (like golden hammers in the Builders Temple and nice Chairs in the dining Room of Lord Constantinople) once you have created all of your levels fully lighted and full of objects and objectives and each with its Toolkit and weapon-kit tailor maid for each mission. Then you will have Object_populated the same way they did when they shipped thief 1. all in all they would not have put a chair in a room if it didn't look empty without it. And they wouldn't have put a blackjack in garrets pocket if they didn't want you to KNOCK OUT THAT GUARD WHILE HIS BACK IS TURNED... SO IF YOU DONT MAKE 13-15 LEVELS WITH OBJECT, WEAPON, AND AI OF VARIOUSE STYLES YOU HAVE NO LIMIT LIKE THIEF 1 AND 2 HAVE ON THE DEMAND FOR OBJECTS AND PEOPLE AND WEOPONS BUY SAYING "HERE IS THE GAME" LOOKING GLASS HAD ALREADY DEFINED ALL THE OBJECTS YOU COULD GET AND USE IN YOUR DROMED. WE HAD TO BE SATISFIED WITH WHAT THEY GAVE US AFTER ALL THEY GAVE US ALL THE OBJECTS FROM THE GAME WE COULDENT EXPECT THEM TO CREAT EXTRA OBJECT FOR JUST INCASE WE NEED A SO AND SO OBJECT. DEFINE YOUR LIST OF OBJECTS AND TOOLS AND AI NOT BY THE REQUEST BUT BY THE LEVELS YOU CREATE (EACH ONE BEING STYLIZED VERY DIFERNT BUT LOOSLY COHESIVE TO THE BACKSTORY) AND NESSESITY

Hi Zaccheus. I don't know why you would think you didn't have the required experience, that sounds like more than enough! (I'm a physical science guy with a little programming background, and they took me for some reason ) . We don't do that much Direct3D programming that I know of. Much of the render engine source is NOT included in the SDK, so we can't change the low level render mechanics. As for VCC2003Toolkit : I used this at first to compile the vanilla D3 source, but I found I was too lazy to set up the makefiles properly for our darkmod source. So I ended up switching to VCC2005Beta. But if you're skilled in makefiles and building all the dependencies and whatnot, I don't see why you couldn't use 2003Toolkit.

Here's the concept for 'House Guards', the poorest of the hired swords. They are primarily used by middle class merchants or poor nobles. They are poorly trained and are often only one step above a hired thug. edit: ftp wanted to play with the filename for some reason....

Oh, if only the public forum browsers could see the discussions that go on behind the scenes about this and so many other topics... Anyway, yes, the ability to have non-pickable doors is important. Actually, this did happen in TDS. I've recently played the Keeper Compound and there are even two examples in that map - the passage to the lower area with Caduca's quarters (required a trigger), and the passage to Orland's chambers (required a Keeper ring). Ah, or some reason I'll never forget the one door in.. I believe it's Constantine's place? In the garden area, greenhouse if I remember correctly, there was a short stairwell down with a locked door at the bottom of it. I searched for that key forever before I found out what it was about. Such a sense of intrigue and mystery from such a simple thing... really makes the mind wander and fantasize. Oh the memories. Yes, non-pickable doors are very important, and were some of the best moments in Thief. For the record, I love the lockpicking in TDS (aside from the animation suck in/lock).

Oh crap, forgot my main reason for posting:) That is: So long as the map makers have a choice in their lockpicking/keys/etc.

Most of the locks in Thief were simply immersion. As a comparison, spiffy graphics are useless in the gameplay, but I imagine theres a reason we don't use ugly for our games. Same with sounds. We could have a robotic voice that tells us whats going on, where the footsteps are coming from, etc. It would even be more challenging. But it would suck. Blah blah blah. So on, et cetera.

I have experience. :| And there is no reason for me to really believe that something like that will not be used if the technical problems can be solved, which they will eventually. After all Steam is only at it's first version. And as soon as the technicall problems are resolved people will get used to it and accept.

Oh dear. . . No it's not. Those two elements are extrinsicallly linked. There is no reason why the nubmer of pickable doors would be in any way linked to lockpicking mechanics. UNLESS they are ALL pickable and ALL need too be picked, ie there are no keys at all. You know what? This makes no sense. Right? What do you mean "right"? This is ridiculous. That is like saying I HAVE to make my FM easy because everyone has the right to finish it. Do I HAVE to slow everything down in UT2004 because people have some right to not get owned because they are too slow, crap and poor shots? And "patronise"? I think you need to go back tot the dictionary. If bothered to read what I said I think you'll find that I said just that. No twisting. If there is really THAT much of a difference then you just plain suck and should go and play another game. There is no way that lockpicking times will alter the design of a map form a mappers point of view. Unless it takes 10 minutes per lock. But that's not going to happen.

Why did you place moss and gravel under "floor"? Shouldn't they be under you know, nature/garden or something like that? Also, shouldn't all folder names be lower-case? Also, for some reason, CVS wont download them. I got the email and all, but the new folder doesn't show up. Edit - Seems like I got the material file (materials/floor.mtr), but not the textures. Even weirdier.

Do I believe anything is possible? Yes. I didn't say what I felt the percentage possibility of it happening was; I merely said it was my "hope." There was public discontent and outcry of Janet Jackson's "wardrobe malfunction" at the Superbowl and now look where the FCC has gone. They're having fun censoring and fining everything and everyone. So, you see, public discontent can work both ways. I would love to. Sounds interesting. I dunno. Parents complained about video games being too vioent for their kids, so manufacturers had to put ESRB ratings on them. Same with sex and/or violence in TV shows. There's public discontent over how forceful police are sometimes, and they're forced to change their ways. I was providing reasoning as to why I have HL2 because you made this comment: "But it is enough for a company to throw in some eye candy and some physics and the kiddies go all "WOW! I MUST have this!" and buy it." My argument wasn't sidetracking anything. You basically implied I was a google-eyed kid for choosing HL2, when in fact you must be too for buying Doom3 (assuming you bought it pre-DarkMod.) I'm just stating facts; I'm no sales rep. If Id's Doom3 was the funner game, I'd have to problem saying so. In order to play HL2 legitimately, I need to have Steam installed. That's another reason why I brought it up. I must admit I didn't know Steam and Valve were two unrelated, separate entities until now. (I guess they are?) Regardless, I brought the gameplay points up because I buy games to have fun. C'est la vie. I pay higher prices for clothes, electronics and everything else because of people who steal. I'm also sometimes inconvenienced and embarrassed when retailers don't properly deactivate alarms in clothes after I buy them and the buzzer goes off. I'm automatically labeled as a thief. They watch me like a hawk as I'm shopping for clothes and watch me in the dressing room, all to combat theft. How is computer software any different? They're implementing controls to try and combat piracy. Even though they won't work, they might thwart (or catch) some. That's, I guess, what it's all about. I feel Steam's attempts at combatting piracy is too intrusive and that people will let their feelings be known and they may change their methods of operation. Seems like some Intel Pentium chip from a couple years back had something in it that secretly sent personal information from a person's computer over the internet to Intel. There was public outcry and they were forced to change their ways.

Looking great so far. I'm curious. Are you making two versions of the gem itself? One for when the compass is toggled off and the other for when the compass is on? Reason I was wondering is because in this version I see the retention rings are in place, so I was wondering if you put those over top of the gem with a layer in photoshop to make the gem look more complete? If the compass were toggled back on a gem without the retention rings in the bitmap would probably need to be put in its place or I suspect you might see the retention rings when the compass moves. Then again, it might be so small that it won't be noticable.

I did some quick tests, but for some reason my lightgem-bitmap gets always strechted ingame. do I have to change the size of the lightgem in the code somehow?

Good point. Though what I did'nt add into the rest of my previous post was that I bought the game, played it, finished it, returned it. That's right. Damn straight!!! . Was amazing that the shopkeeper took it back, though the reason would've been cos I actually got Doom3 as an exchange. DIE STEAM!!!!!!!!!!!!

Can you tell the difference? Because I can't. And guess how many polys? Go on, guess. 236. Niceness. Oddity, the main reason I like mapping this to a model is that it does add a lot more depth. Of course, this may not be worth it for something that we'll have many many copies of. If you want a flat texture, BT, let me know. Very easy to set up.

Ahhh, that would be great Dom. I already tweaked the tired time to be bang on with Thief 1 and 2. It settles in nicely at 12 seconds. Seems to be much longer in Thief 3 for some reason. Guess they were trying to make it easier on the player.

Yeah. He is working on our internal website. If you could modify Bugzilla that would be great. Devloping such a tool from scratch would take some time, which is another reason why I don't want to start on this on my own.

The mod I was involved with (for morrowind children of the night 3) fell apart for a very simple and admitedly stupid reason. All of us were busy working on our respected parts, I was an interior builder and 3dmax object maker and we didnt realise only one person on the team knew the whole plot and had the info needed to bring it all together. When he had to leave through no fault of his own we tried to continue but with the main plot having holes in it we couldnt. It was rather disheartening as I had put about a years work into it and built about sixty interiors and nearly 100 objects. The remaining team decided to halt work until oblivion and restsrt, as strangly oblivion has a very similar plot to ours My point being it is very easy for small things like this to ruin great mods. I just hope those mods for doom3 dont make the same mistake as we did. write everything down for other to see. You may only have one or two writers but they can leave too.

Sounds like a good idea to me. I was actually thinking about some special 'paladin' like abilities they may have, beyond just shooting flame with their hammers. What about making their hammers glow with a holy light? It becomes the equivelent of a torch, but the Thief can't put it out. It will make it harder to hide from them when they're suspicious. I wouldn't give them any healing ability though...leave that for the priests, so they aren't made irrelevant by these guys. I like the idea of using a Stim-response to make other Ai take a step backwards, or mutter in fear, or something around them. It will really make them stand out. And I see no reason why they can't have a one-shot kill...normal hammerites can take you out in two.

Hi guys, thought I'd introduce myself. I'm Kristian and I'm from the "cold" country in the north (Sweden). I've been modding since 1992 and I don't see an end to it at the time. I actually hadn't played Thief until a few days ago. (aside from a one map conversion for Doom2) Tyrot was talking to me about how awesome Thief 1 and 2 was so I went and bought Thief 2 (Thief1 was nowere to be found). Anyway, I'm rambling on. I just wanted to say that I am very intrested in your mod. Finally a team that seem to know what they have in the Doom3 engine. I was looking at The haunted mod and A terrible secret before as they were making mods that would really benefit from the dynamic of Doom3's lighting, but they both changed to HL2 engine for some strange reason. And I don't have HL2 (I played it through though, great game but the engine wasn't much to build a mod on compared to the Doom3 engine IMHO). Anyway, you are one of the mods that I'm looking out for. Keep up the good work.

I love ET. The only reason I no longer play it is that it doesn't play nice with my firewall [1]. And I don't get cheaters either. I was actually the opposite of a cheater; I used to "volunteer" myself for the hardest tasks (like building the assault ramp on the Normandy Beach map) for the satisfaction of accomplishing something difficult. -Glee ----------------------------------------------------------- [1] I could work around it, but I'm lazy

Hmmm, It seems to keep logging me out whenever I press reply, and when I log back in and try clicking it again It logs me back out and makes me type my "Unregistered User Info". Anybody konw the problem? Oh and for some reason I couldnt find the Reply button on the last thread I made... is it only on the first page of the thread? That could be it cuz I remember I was reading on the 2nd or 3rd page when I thought of replying and couldn't find the button.

Well, this is one of the problems with secrecy. The public just dont like to accept decisions which have been taken behind closed doors for reason unknown to them. And also, I like to have a good argument for the sake of it.

I don't like flash (or similar sites) for one simple reason. It delays the loading of the site. When I want to access a site, I usually want to acces the content and don't have a flash movie forced on me. Don't know if flash can be used for other things as well, but an intro movie is a bad thing for me. If I want to see a movie the siteowner can provide it as download, which I prefer much more.

I appreciate your comments Springheel. Let me explain my train of thought on our Mr. Thief. From the Guidelines New Horizon gave me: This seems to be in contrats with the Garrett type of Thief, who is very 'non-personal' when it comes to his work. If our character does not emerge as a hero and 'save the day', the only way the plot could put our character in any real danger and create powerful villains is if there is a day to be saved, and the character decides not to save it. The first possibility is that the character is simply a coward, and decides the day isn't worth saving. The game player probably wouldn't like that character. The second is to create something the player would perceive to be more important than saving the day, which in this case is the character's daughter. By making his story personal and deciding that he would not 'save the day', our character could never be Garrett, who hides a heart of gold under a curtain of cynicism. I decided that our character should have been at war for six years because he is wearied of taking orders and being the 'pawn in the game', and also because having been in the awfulness of war would make him a pained man, who has seen hell and can't quite get over it, and would appreciate a family, and could walk away from glory and 'saving the day' towards a quiet life. I also decided there should be a war because it gives a reason why the conflict between the two sides of the City has only recently flourished into a threat, and because it explains why our hero has been away for six years without knowing what his daughter looks like. Being in jail for six years would make him look weak, and having him simply be 'away' would make it seem as if he does not give a toss about his family.