Better not use any real cathedrals in TDM!

[Macsen]

You don't want the Church of England complaining that you've inspired thieves to break in to their buildings!

 

Cathedral row over computer game

 

The Church of England is considering legal action against entertainment firm Sony for featuring Manchester Cathedral in a violent Playstation computer game.

 

The Church says Sony did not obtain permission to use the interior in the war game 'Resistance - Fall of Man.'

 

The game, which has sold more than one million copies, shows a virtual shoot-out in the cathedral's nave in which hundreds of soldiers are killed.

 

A Sony spokesman said that permission had been sought where necessary.

 

However, the Church said Sony did not ask for permission to use the cathedral and it has demanded an apology and the removal of the game from shop shelves - otherwise legal action will be considered.

 

Sony has not returned calls from Church officials.

 

'Beyond belief'

 

The Bishop of Manchester, the Rt Revd Nigel McCulloch, has described the decision to feature the city's cathedral as "highly irresponsible" - especially in the light of Manchester's history of gun crime.

 

"It is well known that Manchester has a gun crime problem," he said.

 

"For a global manufacturer to re-create one of our great cathedrals with photo-realistic quality and then encourage people to have guns battles in the building is beyond belief and highly irresponsible.

 

"Here in Manchester we do all we can to support communities through our parish clergy. We know the reality of gun crime and the devastating effects it can have on lives. It is not a trivial matter."

 

The Dean of Manchester Cathedral, The Very Revd Rogers Govender, also hit out at Sony's decision to feature the cathedral, claiming it was "undermining" the work of the church.

 

"We are shocked to see a place of learning, prayer and heritage being presented to the youth market as a location where guns can be fired.

 

"This is an important issue. For many young people these games offer a different sort of reality and seeing guns in Manchester Cathedral is not the sort of connection we want to make.

 

"Every year we invite hundreds of teenagers to come and see the cathedral and it is a shame to have Sony undermining our work."

 

No-one from Sony was available for comment.

 

However, David Wilson, a Sony spokesman, told The Times newspaper: "It is game-created footage, it is not video or photography.

 

"It is entertainment, like Doctor Who or any other science fiction. It is not based on reality at all. Throughout the whole process we have sought permission where necessary."

[Unstoppable]

Looks like the problems for Sony will never end.

[OrbWeaver]

The church can complain all they want, there is no permission required to create a virtual environment based on publically-available material. At least not until they create some new kind of Intellectual Property right governing "similarity to a real location".

[Unstoppable]

Aye the church can go stick their lawsuit up their ass. Religion is the cause of billions if not trillions of lives lost throughout the course of history.

[sparhawk]

Sometimes I wonder in what world we are living. Everybody holds on to everything as closely as possible. Reminds me of my kids, when they complain where one reads some Mickey Mouse and the other looks over her should and gets a glimpse of it. There could be something missing afterwards. But of course we know this is different, because if people get used to the idea of shooting in a church on a computer, of course all of them will start to do this in real live as well.

[Domarius]

Featuring realistic places in violent video games has gone on long enough, and cost too many lives! It's time someone took a stand! Go Church of England!

 

:/

[Baddcog]

I only shoot in public in Vegas, New York and the general San Andreas fault area. I don't think it has anything to do with video games.

[Ishtvan]

One of the bathrooms in Max Payne 2 was eerily similar to my own bathroom. Now I have to check the toilet for mercenaries every time. Time to cash in, ca-ching!

[demagogue]

Yeah, this isn't a legal issue. Something built in the whatever-medieval-century is as public domain as it gets. And like some of you are implying, it debases what this is really about for them anyway. It's far from the economic interest they hold in whatever IP-assets of the Church they imagine they have. Maybe they have a better claim under libel, debasement of reputation of the organization, or trademark, debasement of brand, but all of that still smacks a little of the wrong interest.

 

It's really a political issue for them. And if they really want to make a stand, they should stand on the merits of what they actually believe ... which is that it's socially irresponsible for them to portray this real-world site in this way, if that's really how they feel, and keep it political instead of legal. I'm not sure they could really mount a credible boycott, though. They should be creative and mount some big campaign against gun violence in the world if they care so much about it ... really show people why they feel the images feel so unjustified/ irresponsible for them in a way people won't miss the unfairness of it.

Edited June 9, 2007 by demagogue

[Macsen]

Heh this thing is the second top headline on the BBC 10 o' clock news here. You have the G8, Iraq, Darfur to talk about... but nooooo, let's talk about a computer game.

[sparhawk]

I can't hear about G8 anymore. 100Million Euro spent for this dickheads to get together for four days, while we have kids in the school, where the goverment is haggling with the communities, because they can't afford to get books in the public school, and nobody wants to pay for it. It's ok to waste money as long as these fat assholes are concerened, but please no money wasted for something as useless as schoolbooks.

[Domarius]

One of the bathrooms in Max Payne 2 was eerily similar to my own bathroom. Now I have to check the toilet for mercenaries every time. Time to cash in, ca-ching!

I love Midtown Madness. But it's made by Microsoft. So I could never possibly move to Chicago - I'm afraid I'd be overcome by impulses to drive recklessly all over the city and I'd never be able to sue Microsoft!

[Crispy]

Better sue Microsoft over the fact that you can't move to Chicago because of them, then...

[Nyarlathotep]

It never ceases to be shocking mankind's ability to beat logic into a senseless bloody pulp and never look back. "These violent video games are forcing children to behave in a violent manner themselves. They must be banned!"

[OrbWeaver]

Heh this thing is the second top headline on the BBC 10 o' clock news here. You have the G8, Iraq, Darfur to talk about... but nooooo, let's talk about a computer game.

 

You mean Madeleine Fucking McCann's not the big issue any more? At least something's improved in the world.

[Macsen]

You mean Madeleine Fucking McCann's not the big issue any more? At least something's improved in the world.

Not until Sony release the long-awaited Madeleine McCann kidnap simulator.

[Ombrenuit]

Thief turned me into the word-class professional jewel thief I am today. I'm right now lounging in the Bahamas after my biggest score yet. Thanks Garrett. Thanks Looking Glass.

[Komag]

Well, because of Thief I bought a set of lockpicks online and have opened a few things such as padlocks, cabinets, desks, a couple doors, etc. It's quite cool when the lock finally turns, almost like magic.

[sparhawk]

Hey, we should do a page of that advertisment style used in mags to sell phony stuff. The above already sounds like it. You know the one like:

 

Thousands of customers all over the globe attest how effective our training program is. Here a few excerpts.

 

Martha S. from Vienna: I was never very a proficient thief, but Thief from LGS changed that, and now I finally know where my neighbour has his valuables.

 

Thomas B. from Madrid: Everytime I saw these highclass cars, I was jealous because I couldn't afford one. Now I change them every few days. THANK YOU Thief from LGS.

 

...

 

[SneaksieDave]

http://gamepolitics.com/2007/06/16/sony-ap...dral-officials/

 

So does anyone have any floorplans for this Manchester Cathedral? I think Return to the Haunted Cathedral (of Manchester) has a nice ring to it. Only this time, it'll be a lot more BLOODY and VIOLENT.

 

Oh I sooooo hope this provokes 09 F9 type of blowback.

[sparhawk]

We should make it.

[OrbWeaver]

I hate Sony as much as the next guy, but these dumb religious fucks need to get slapped down hard. It's an ancient building, you do NOT own any IP rights on it (particularly when the "images" are actually a virtual recreation, not a photograph), STFU.

[Vadrosaul]

Let's face it, the Church has always been slow to adjust to social progression, always playing catch up, and now more than ever they draw criticism and ire from an increasing fragmentation of beliefs and the slowly emerging power of atheism/agnosticism.

 

This won't amount to anything more than alienating them further from the age group they desperately need followers out of. The new Pope seems to like shooting his religion in the foot with every word out of his mouth, why not the Anglican ministry in England as well.

[oDDity]

Well I agree with them, not about using the church specifically, but about how pointless and inane computer games are, and particularly violent ones.

Whether they lead people to be violent in real life is not even the point, and anyone who uses that as a point in favour of violent games (all of you) is a drooling naive fool. That's like saying a game depicting sexual abuse of children for the amusement of the player, racial abuse for fun, or putting jews in gas chambers for fun and and seeing how many you can kill before being caught, would only be wrong if it caused lots of people to start doing it in real life, and that there is no inherent wrongness in having such 'games' in the first place.

The key words here are 'for the amusement of the player'.

As soon as the simulated violence, rape, buggery, racism or whatever becomes the 'fun' part of the game, then it's wrong.

Too many game are exactly like this, the 'fun' part is actually pretending to shoot someone in the head, that's the buzz.

[OrbWeaver]

and that there is no inherent wrongness in having such 'games' in the first place.

 

There isn't. The concept of "wrong" does not exist, it is just an archaic religious nonsense-term that people cling to because they can't stand the idea that other people in the world are free to take an interest in things they don't like.

 

I would very much like to see the "extreme" games you mention, not because I would get any pleasure from playing them, but because it would get the stupid moral prudes in a flap, which is exactly what they deserve.