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My opinion (though I'm sure it counts for little like most opinions) is that the release of the Deadly Shadows editor actually helps TDM. Why? well... Here's a quote from Krypt at the TTLG forums: I think it's apparent that no matter how great the future TDS FM's will be (and based on community precident, they will be great), the gameplay elements that were removed from TDS will be impossible to implement even WITH the SDK. Alot of people held high hopes for the TDS SDK not only for the ability to make brand new missions with the brand new engine, but primarily to re-implement gameplay dynamics (and some would call staples) of the Thief seiries that most believed the programmers were unable to fully realize due to time constraints, but that the elements themselves were still in fact latent in the editor itself. I think, even now with this new information, there are pioneering modders who are trying deperately to make a rope arrow or swim around. Unfortunately, water and rope arrows simply weren't programmed in at all. My point is that even if TDM is half as good as it appears it will be, it will feel more like Thief than it's Official sequel (TDS). People didn't moan and groan about no water and no rope arrows just because they wanted options, but because they wanted more of what they had come to expect...look how aggrevated fans of the Fallout series became when thier beloved RPG became a RTS sim. No matter how large the levels become, or how high-res you make the texures, it'll still be TDS. Once people start realising that they'll never have rope arrows and water and leaning forward etc, I think the community will be ready to try anything resembling a true Thief experience. Right now, TDM is our best bet. I think some of the TTLG crew bite at TDM because they care so much for the original programmers and creators of the "Official" thief sequel. Seems to me there'd be alittle trepidation at the thought a mod made by a bunch of guys on a game forum with no monetary incentive could make a better all around experience for free than a huge group of paid, established developers, many of which worked on previous iterations of the game, and force us to shell out $50 to play it. Just a thought. Or two. Hylix.

There are tutorials on doom3world.org on how to get your own weapons into Doom3. http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?showt...indpost&p=14120 That is in the resource thread. If you don't have access there, Ive pasted my post here; http://www.doom3world.org/phpbb2/viewtopic...3017&highlight= Just scroll down (past the useless Video tutorials section) down to the TXT/HTML tutorials section. There, they are all categorised, into Scripting, Mapping, Lighting, In-game models, etc.

Models work in the editor like everything else, Spar. It'll bring up a list and it'll show it in a little 3D preview window when it's highlighted...once it's in the editor it'll show up like it should once you go into render mode. Mappers have lived with FAR less in the past, back when Q3 and Vampire were out all your props would show up as boxes no matter what. The way D3 is set up is perfectly fine for someone wanting to select a model since they can preview it beforehand quite easily. And Sneaksie, the more I think about adding the /darkmod folder to the directory structure the more it makes sense. What if someone wants to mod the mod for instance, and wants to keep all our assets in the same place while he works with his own stuff seperately? That's just one of many reasons why we should go ahead and make the switch back to the old setup.

:lol: Just a few seconds ago I posted a similar thread in the models section. We should discuss this together, so we don't need to reorg every few months. http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?showtopic=1335

So can we have some opinions from mappers? I was on IRC with Fingernail and the conclusion was that this structure is also not the best one. What we thought would be helpfull is to group the textures and models according to this: Textures: walls/gothic/texture... walls/victorian/texture... floor/gothic/texture... ... wood/texture... stone/texture... etc. Models: table/victorian/model... table/gothic/model... table/generic/model... Does this make sense? IMO the current structure is not really good for searching specific objects, but instead of creating a new structure in a rush, we should consider it first. My idea was that a mapper will have a image in mind what the object should look like and selects an object according to this. Since that exact image may not be available in the repository he will need to find one that matches or can be used as an alternative. This indicates to me that an organization according to theme, as we have it now, like mansion, crypt, etc. doesn't really make sense. IMO a mapper would not think, I need this table and it looks like it could be a mansion table so I look into the mansion folder. Instead he will more likely think like this: I need a table, so let's look for a table. Maybe he knows exaclty whaht style this table should be in, so he might know that he needs to look into Victorian tables. I think that this doesn't make sense and will not allow for a fast browsing. Since we don't create THAT many different objects (for a given type that is) my position is to put all tables into a single folder with accompaning screenshots and a map which includes all the objects so the author can easily browse the repository for objects he needs without the needs to memorizing where particular objects are. The distinction of the tables would be then in the name of the file, instead of the folder. Sample: table/Mansion_low_rich_0001.lwo table/Dungeon_office_wood_0001.lwo ... This way an other will have all tables in a single folder but he still knows what theme a particular objects is supposed to be in. Any comments?

I've come to realise that the way our current directory is set up is a bit....counterproductive. You can blame it on me considering that it was originally my idea, but I was more of a stark newb then and I now have a better idea of how to approach this. The biggest problem with the current directory is that it's a pain in the ass having to jump from folder ot folder just to load up specific textures that you need. None of the other editors out there, be it vanilla Doom 3, Unreal, Farcry, or whatever, are set up this way. I'm thinking of modeling it around a theme specific setup rather than the set/subset dealie we have now. For example, instead of: Mansion/walls/stone/mansion_wall_stone01 Mansion/doors/wood/mansion_door_wood03 or Crypt/doors/metal/crypt_door_metal01 Crypt/Floors/stone/crypt_floor_stone06 ..it'll be designed to load up every specific texture for that theme and organized by name. Like: mansion/mansdoor02 mansion/mansdoor04 or crypt/crypfloor06 crypt/crypwall07 That way a mapper won't have to jump back and forth between folders to have access to all the specific theme textures. If he wants to get to the door textures all he has to do is scroll down the window til he reaches em then jump back up to the walls later. Easy as that. Plus we have to consider that we're wasting tons of space by having an extra _ed file in there when we can just use the diffuse for both. This is how Id has it set up and we could easily cull an extra 60 meg from the mod by doing this. It'll take alot of material rewriting and texture renaming, but it won't be as difficult as last time thanks to Blackthief reorganizing all the materials into seperate files. The only problem I see with it is if we get ALOT of textures, as in more than 200, in a specific folder....but overall this is a much better setup. Your thoughts?

http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?showt...indpost&p=19130

It doesn't make sense to put models in a folder named mansion. People look for tables, lights and such stuff and not mansion or crypt. That may be usefull for very specific models, but not for the majority. So models should be grouped on their usage and not where they usually are put. For textures this makes sense, because textures are used for a specific theme. I also wonder who is "we" who have decided this, because I haven't seen any mentioning of this.

This had got quite out of hand, with people shoving stuff in "Props" directory etc. with no real order. So, we decided based on a logical progression of how the textures are organised, to sort the models into themes, that is "Mansion", "Cathedral", "Crypt", "City" etc. This doesn't impact on generic models, such as "Loot", which will have it's own folder. It just makes sense, considering both textures and SFX are being organised in this way. So, as an example, there'd be Mansion/Furniture/Chairs/Chair1 or Cathedral/Furniture/Pews/Pew1 but Loot/Plates/SilverPlate1 and Plants/Trees/LargeOakTree1

How would you "see" me around EvilAvatar unless I registered? I don't think I need to post in the forums to be able to form a conscious opinion of the site.

... but anyway here´s my current portfolio: keeper haunt enforcer profile badass mofo head detail zombie I´m also at the Hammerite Imperium team, but my artworks are mostly useless there (but that doesn´t mean I want to leave, there´s enough other work). That´s why I want to join also the DM team, where my concepts actually can be made into models. I could also eventually skin AIs and maybe objects, I did some retexturing for the HI. No experience with Doom 3 specs yet. These artworks are the latest ones and at this time I prefer BW, which you might not like as concept art, but that can be easily changed. If you´re interested in more various stuff, just have a look at my folder at the Imperium FTP. Oh and there´s one more thing: I have some major exams in may and june and at that time I probably won´t be able to do much. So that you know.

Hmm.. where could this have come from??? Nah, similar to BT. I jumped into the forums around when DromEd was to be released, and had no nick. Assuming that it would just be a matter of "grab the editor and disappear" I had no idea this awful choice of a name would be around for years. Since then, I've had a few ideas for good ones, but how does one change? Bah.

Direct link: http://www.evilavatar.com/forums/archive/i....php/t-268.html

I love how writing sound propagation code leads me to post uninformed questions in so many other development forums... Anyway, I have to load a collision model for doors early on in my code, and I have a choice about whether to let it go ahead and use the rendermodel as the collision model if no .cm file exists for the model, or give an error at this point about the door not having a .cm file. I don't know how you guys make collision model .cm files, maybe they're automatically generated from SURF_COLLISION surface when importing the model? I dunno. I'm inclined to just do what D3 does when it loads collision models, which is try to find the .cm model, and if not, use the rendermodel. Because maybe you guys like to use SURF_COLLISION in your models themselves rather than generating a separate .cm file? I just wanted to check what you modelers' preferences are. As a side note, if I'm reading the code right, for a collision model to be precached on map load, the model files MUST include a .cm file, otherwise it's dynamically loaded from the rendermodel every time an entity using that rendermodel needs a clipModel (which I would think would be bad). So that may be one argument for making .cm files.

welcome to the tdm forums uglyed nice to have you here (@ others he's a pretty nice guy from the german ttlg. made some awesome custom objects for T2 )

Anything you guys would like to see from us on the PR side of things (this isn't a mod feature discussion, mmk?), or to make these public forums better, more exciting, a public IRC channel, anything? We're a touchy-feely mod team, we want our fans and critics to be treated well. :lol: Seriously though, don't suffer in silence!!!!

Sounds good Diego. She's yours. Be gentle. Here's the concept art: http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?showtopic=362 Play up the young and pretty angle. Oddity has already done a more matronly, older noblewoman so we want the two to be distinctive. Here's his version, just so you can compare: http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?showtopic=887

lol, log on the FTP and download it from the screenshots folder then.

I have searched now high and low for Doom3 tutorials, but haven't found anything beyond the most basic stuff. Do you know of any thing I should bookmark and read? Here are a couple I found: http://doom3.planet-multiplayer.de/article.php?150.200 (only the most basic stuff - I already read it) http://forums.glenmurphy.com/4/ (Not much there) http://www.planetdoom.com/leveled/tutorials/ (Simple, basic, not good...) There are a few that I think might be interesting (e.g. more than just "create your second room, create a ladder): http://www.planetdoom.com/leveled/videotuts/ (Edit: Ah, crap, planetdoom is part of fileplanet, which wants you to register with the evil[tm] gamespy before you download. Screw that Unfortunately, most of the "custom" objects (e.g. animated objects, textures) stuff deals with 3DS Max, which I do not have access to. So, there goes this idea. Is there are a comprehensive guide to doom3 mapping/scripting? If not, would it make sense to start one? I wouldn't have a problem in hosting a wiki letting us pool our wisdoms together. Best wishes, Tels

There is one area in which T3Ed could be far, far superior to TDM - The City. The City could be expanded upon (see the Map Project over at TTLG Thief Gen forums) and new missions could be plugged into it. I've talked all about this over at thiefpetition.com. And I think it is early to knock T3Ed - you have no idea what it will be like. I know the D3 engine is next-gen in comparison but still, you don't know.

now is that guy naturist or just plain perverse ? sometimes i feel things are a bit ill around these forums:)

You should try to make them match up as much as possible for obvious repeated actions like walks, runs, attacks etc One thing about doom animations is that they aren't basic 'run on the spot' cycle loops like most games. A walk cycle can be several strides and actually moves forward along the ground. YOu can get a plugin from the doomworld forums to import the original doom charcater animations into max to study them.

Hi, I am registed, was logged in (it said I was) and tried to post a message, but got this message. "Sorry, an error occurred. If you are unsure on how to use a feature, or don't know why you got this error message, try looking through the help files for more information. The error returned was: "Sorry, an error occurred. If you are unsure on how to use a feature, or don't know why you got this error message, try looking through the help files for more information. The error returned was: Sorry, you do not have permission to start a topic in this forum Useful Links · Forgotten Password Recovery · Register a new account · Our help documentation · Contact the forums administrator" I have never been able to post when logged in, I have to logout to guest post. Could someone fix this please? I have registered, and was logged in. Doesn't make sense, if as a guest I can start a topic, but not as a logged in user. Fix this please...

Hey guys- Here's something that we all wish we would have seen over at the Ion Storm Forums..... First of all, a semi-tribute....

New Horizon said this on one of the Dev forums: This therefore means that Ion Storm IS closing down. It all so means 2 other things (possibly): 1: No Thief 3 Editor 2: and now it's up to us to keep the spirit of Thief going. I personally would've liked to see a Thief3 Editor too, but it looks like that's impossible now. --Dram