Renzatic's Textures

[Baddcog]

I'd have to see the flats to know how you laid out the UV's. I'd imagine you did them in a cylindrical fashion in which case doing how I decribed really wouldn't 'distort' it any. However you didn't like the window normals and they looked perfect to me.

 

As for collision and shadow, just export them in the same file as your model.

 

@Tels,

Well, I don't know what 'grill light' you mean. I don't think any of our lamps look any more modern than T2 had.

But no, I'd say we just add it. No sense in replacing objects at this point. More is always good though.

[Renzatic]

So basically it's one model saved different meshes on multiple layers? Hell, I'm just gonna hit up the wiki.

 

Edit: I'll upload the lamp later tonight when I have a bit more time, since I've got to take off here in the next few. Do you want me to save them as .lwo's or .obj's (hopefully lwos, objs always seem to mess up my smoothing angles).

[Baddcog]

I don't use layers.

 

Just have all models visible on screen at once, export. (In Max I have to select them and export selected because I generally have more objects in the file, even if hidden they get exported)

 

lwo will go straight into game. (obj is good to share with Max users)

[Tels]

@Tels,

Well, I don't know what 'grill light' you mean. I don't think any of our lamps look any more modern than T2 had.

But no, I'd say we just add it. No sense in replacing objects at this point. More is always good though.

 

I mean the ones that look a bit like this:

 

http://landandseacollection.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/90degreeligtcompos2.jpg

 

Where the metal cage looks like diecast instead of hand-made (because then it would be bigger).

[Baddcog]

Well, Thief had those too. Just a typical style mechanical area/alarm light I guess. But the two lamps really don't have the same style. The only reason I could see replacing items is if we decided to 'upgrade' to a similar item (and now after release it would have to be same size/position as old one to nnot break maps).

[Springheel]

But the two lamps really don't have the same style. The only reason I could see replacing items is if we decided to 'upgrade' to a similar item

 

Agreed.

 

So basically it's one model saved different meshes on multiple layers?

 

I make each one on a separate layer, but you have to cut and paste them all onto a single layer before saving it to work in game.

[Renzatic]

Here your go, the lamp model. I included both .objs and .lwos for the high and low polys, all the usual textures, plus the second normal I overlaid for the rust.

 

On another note, I just made my first attempt at doing the normal for the low poly table bits. The post came out great. A few bends in the normal, but that can be fixed by tightening up the low poly normal. The table top, though...horrible. I'm gonna try Baddcog earlier suggestion and cut the model apart, flatten it out, and do a planar projection to get everything right. It'll be tedious as hell, specially the bit where I'll have to line up the low poly UV to an existing texture. But if I do it right, it'll look perfect.

[Baddcog]

You should be able to detach the edge. Use a bend modifier to unbend it 360 and make it flat. Cylindrical map the edge of the lowpoly so it'll be in a long flat line (probably need to seperate and stack segments of the uv so it doesn't come out 2x1200 pixels [est. exaggeration]).

 

Should only take a few minutes.

[Renzatic]

Yeah, that part was simple. The baking itself? Still not so much. I've come close, but it's still got distortions all around my edges and creases that aren't easily fixable even in Photoshop. Cages, which I read a few tutorials on last night, haven't netted me any better results.

 

So I'm doing things the old fashioned way. I took a single piece of detail from each layer, flat projected them, and started copy/pasting them into Photoshop. I just overlay them on the UV, and things look halfway decent.

 

 

All I have to do is fix a few seams and misalignments, and it's good. I just wish I could get these results off a bake. It'd make life alot simpler.

[Baddcog]

You might need to just adjust your ray distances. That's basically what a cage is for, so the ray doesn't start out in space and extend through the mesh hitting the other side (and coming in at a bad angle). The cage just limits the ray distance form the cage to the object.

 

Without a cgae you need to get the distance set perfectly. But stuff I read at polycount yesterday makes it seem like some good modelers don't like cage resualts anyway.

It's possible that you are just picking up parts of your mesh that you don't want by having too long of a ray distance (I can see that happening on the top/bottom trim of the table as that's a really thin area).

[Renzatic]

You might need to just adjust your ray distances. That's basically what a cage is for, so the ray doesn't start out in space and extend through the mesh hitting the other side (and coming in at a bad angle). The cage just limits the ray distance form the cage to the object.

 

Without a cgae you need to get the distance set perfectly. But stuff I read at polycount yesterday makes it seem like some good modelers don't like cage resualts anyway.

It's possible that you are just picking up parts of your mesh that you don't want by having too long of a ray distance (I can see that happening on the top/bottom trim of the table as that's a really thin area).

 

The short rays thing actually worked a bit better. I think I read somewhere awhile back that you wanted long shots with the rays so it'd pick up the slants a bit better...apparently that was completely and totally false. Still can't get concave pieces on curves all that well yet, but it picked up the details on the cylinder without any problem whatsoever. I just had to adjust the LP a bit, and then no wavering, pinching, nothing. I feel like I'm starting to learn something.

 

So here it is, the current table:

 

 

Noise is just on there to break up the smoothness and make it look a little better. Unfortunately, the trim on the tabletop is all Photoshop work. Something I want to get away from except for some slight detailing and cleanup work when I start baking really complicated objects. Next up, the legs, then combining it all on one UV. Lets see how well it turns out.

[Tels]

Agreed.

 

I mean not that we take the new lamp exactly to replace the old one, but that we ask Renzatic to make a new lamp in the style of his lamp to replace our grill light.

[Renzatic]

So...uh...you all want me to make a grill lamp?

[Tels]

So...uh...you all want me to make a grill lamp?

 

No, "tels" wants, Springheel and Baddcogg don't want you. Overruled again *sigh*

[Renzatic]

Eh. I'll do it anyway. It's up to them if it replaces anything, but at least you'll have something new to play with. Just wait for me to get finished with this table first, and I'll give it a whirl.

[Tels]

Eh. I'll do it anyway. It's up to them if it replaces anything, but at least you'll have something new to play with. Just wait for me to get finished with this table first, and I'll give it a whirl.

 

No hurries, don't want to distract you.

[Baddcog]

I don't care either way personally. I just didn't want to replace a lamp of one type with a lamp of another type. I think that's what Springheel agreed on.

 

Whether or not we replace the grill lamp with another 'better' grill lamp isn't my decision really. Probably matters more to whoever created the first one.

But if we do go that route the new one needs to replace the old one precisely in position and size so as not to break any current or being developed missions now that it has been released publically.

 

But IMO simply adding one that was 'more appropriate' would be better than replacement. Just because content has been released and someone might actually prefer to use the current one.

 

Not like additional lights will hurt. In fact with games that so heavily depend on lighting for mood I think the more light models the better.

 

Table's looking good btw.

[Renzatic]

It is DONE! This model has been, by and far, the biggest whore of a thing I've ever worked on. I'll tell you why by posting a convenient list of things I learned below.

 

1. Never, EVER should I make and UV a low model by individual pieces then hope to paste it all back together again. It should be done all at once.

 

2. Only do a UV when I've got my final geometry. I had to redo the UV three times before I got my final there. Once for the recombining, which screwed it up beyond repair, and once for when I started culling down the poly count. URRRRGGGHHH!

 

3. When I resize my low poly, I need to make sure I do my high at the same time. Realignment ain't fun.

 

4. Cylinders bake best with a single model subdivided from the low poly. Even with the smoothing jacked up as high as it'll go, a good normal can never come from an 8 sided cylinder...but weirdly enough, it pastes on just fine.

 

So there it is. 968 tris. All on one contiguous mesh. I lost some definition going from multiple UVs down to one 1024x, but it's not horrible. In fact, the lower resolution makes it look a little aged, which is a good thing in my opinion. Now all I have to do is do some fix some alignment issues for the trim in Photoshop, and do the diffuse. Then I'll have my damn table.

[Baddcog]

lol, yeah, modelling is just a pain in the ass anymore

[Renzatic]

Eh, it's not a pain in the ass, provided you plan ahead. I only barely did, and ended up having to do 10x the amount of work because of it.

 

But hey, yayyyyy.

 

Got one question here about shadow and collision maps. I now have a good idea on how to do it, but what about the material files? I know I can't just put them all in the same layer let it roll, so what else do I need to do to get them working?

 

Edit: I got it ingame, and the texture on it isn't exactly what I'd call crisp. Specially not compared to its surroundings. I'll blame my UV here, since it's only 1024x and had a ton of extra space left when I was finished. I plan on leaving it in for now, but the texturing really needs to be redone.

 

Shot

[Renzatic]

So I go read up on a few tutorials, redo the entire UV from scratch (again) for efficiency, and end up with the new table. Much, much better in my opinion. This one I didn't have to cheat much in Photoshop, it's all baked from the HP top to bottom. AO and everything.

 

I tell you all, I didn't expect to spend nearly this long on this damn table. Oh well, at least I'm learning something.

 

HALLELUJAH! It is done. And this time I mean DONE! The diffuse looks great ingame this go round, and the normalmap is far, far better. I even managed to get it down to 850 tris. Beyond some cosmetic work on the diff and normal, I am closing the book on this one.

 

Tels: I've got your new cage light started. I didn't go into it with a plan though, so it's kind turning out a little...funky. Like it's too wild fantasy looking. I'll let you be the final judge of it.

[Capela]

I asked Renzatic whether his latest textures can be added to TDM:

 

 

Can we use thoes textures in TDM?

 

And another quest, i tend to put a more darker textures in my maps, can i take some TDM textures and modifiy a little for my purposes?

[Mortem Desino]

You're absolutely welcome to modify them for using in a TDM Mission.

[Capela]

You're absolutely welcome to modify them for using in a TDM Mission.

 

Nice , because theres realy excelent textures in the TDM. expecialy the windows, realy nice job doing the windows

[Tels]

So I go read up on a few tutorials, redo the entire UV from scratch (again) for efficiency, and end up with the new table. Much, much better in my opinion. This one I didn't have to cheat much in Photoshop, it's all baked from the HP top to bottom. AO and everything.

 

I tell you all, I didn't expect to spend nearly this long on this damn table. Oh well, at least I'm learning something.

 

HALLELUJAH! It is done. And this time I mean DONE! The diffuse looks great ingame this go round, and the normalmap is far, far better. I even managed to get it down to 850 tris. Beyond some cosmetic work on the diff and normal, I am closing the book on this one.

 

Tels: I've got your new cage light started. I didn't go into it with a plan though, so it's kind turning out a little...funky. Like it's too wild fantasy looking. I'll let you be the final judge of it.

 

 

Hows it coming along? Btw, is the table in game yet?