So, Blender Is A Bit Of a Clusterfuck

[aidakeeley]

Yeah, but, no, but, yeah, but...

 

To all the experienced:

 

What is the best 3d modeler? I'm thinking these are important considerations:

 

* Open and free. (yet, as of yet, maybe nothing free and open exists that isn't a giant mezz?)

* Standardized (as much as possible interface-wise AND native or working export/import-wise)

* Simple to do simple things; Reasonably simple to do more complex things. (encouraging to beginners in that they can create a sphere pretty handily; and then maybe tweak it with a bit more experience; and then more and more with more and more. But not a huge learning curve right off the bat, unless there is just no getting around that!)

* Well documented

* Established or at least not teetering on the brink of extinction.

 

All of the above are considerations, if the best over all is not free... so be it. Please declare it to be the best and that'll be that. Unless you need to invoke some Lucasville SG super-sw that runs on super-hw -- I'm not wanting to talk about that so much.

[rich_is_bored]

• Wings 3D
  
• Google Sketchup
  
• Gmax
  

 

There may be others. And I have to mention that I have no experience with any of them so you may find the documentation isn't good enough and/or they don't export to a TDM friendly format.

[CorwinWeber]

I've been working with AC3D and so far I like it. It's not free, but it's cheap. (I think it's 40 bucks, which compared to Lightwave and such is nothing.) It's also cross-platform, Windows, Mac and Linux all have native versions.

 

There's a two week free trial and I've had decent luck with it so far, I think the trial disables plugins but not much else.

[Tels]

I've been working with AC3D and so far I like it. It's not free, but it's cheap. (I think it's 40 bucks, which compared to Lightwave and such is nothing.) It's also cross-platform, Windows, Mac and Linux all have native versions.

 

There's a two week free trial and I've had decent luck with it so far, I think the trial disables plugins but not much else.

 

Corwin, have you been able to export/import .LWO files with AC3d? I tested the linux version and it never exports anything, and on import it says some error about "error 0 at byte 12" or whatever. Maybe I am missing something?

[CorwinWeber]

Corwin, have you been able to export/import .LWO files with AC3d? I tested the linux version and it never exports anything, and on import it says some error about "error 0 at byte 12" or whatever. Maybe I am missing something?

 

No, I haven't. Actually I get exactly that same error when I try.

 

I've been working with original models and focusing on ASE as a format, so it hasn't been an issue. I've also been working more with Blender because AC3D does seem to be missing a few features I've needed..... that might just be because of the demo, tho.

 

Blender's less of a clusterfuck when you find some decent scripts. Kind of like Photoshop in that respect.

[Tels]

No, I haven't. Actually I get exactly that same error when I try.

 

I've been working with original models and focusing on ASE as a format, so it hasn't been an issue. I've also been working more with Blender because AC3D does seem to be missing a few features I've needed..... that might just be because of the demo, tho.

 

Blender's less of a clusterfuck when you find some decent scripts. Kind of like Photoshop in that respect.

 

Ah a shame, I was hoping I could fix some of the most problematic LWO issues

[CorwinWeber]

Ah a shame, I was hoping I could fix some of the most problematic LWO issues

 

I think there's something odd about Doom's implementation of lwo. I can't get lwo's from Blender to work right either.

[Mr Lemony Fresh]

Yeah, but, no, but, yeah, but...

Little Britain for the win.

 

You can download plugins that makes blender have a more intuitive interface, so perhaps don't rule it out completly until you've explored all the options. I downloaded one that made it look and feel like 3ds max, although the only downside i guess is that you wouldn't really be able to follow the tutorials.

 

Otherwise, you might want to go with gmax, I love using 3ds max and gmax is essentially just a watered down version for modders.

 

Here's something that might interest you

 

http://www.hongkiat.com/blog/25-free-3d-modelling-applications-you-should-not-miss/

Edited June 27, 2010 by Mr Lemony Fresh

[Bikerdude]

so what are the list of 3d modeling apps that are TDM friendly, as I would really like to contribute to the master models wanted thread request.

[aidakeeley]

Thanks to all for the suggestions...

 

I gave a fair few a look, and yes... Blender is maddening (maybe the beta is much better, but, I've such a bad taste from the other I didn't bother). I'm just beginner, so I'm sure I'll, later (if I stick with this lark ), be wanting the features it offers; still I'll never excuse the intentionally obtuse interface it "sports"...

 

I'm gonna try and stick with gmax just to get a-hang... Can't tell you much about it, biker, beyond that it is very basic and probably won't make AI and such complex things but does, at least to my liking, get you going quickly with "primitives" (spheres, cubes, cones, etc)

 

The google one, SketchUp, seemed all too nifty; very google, IOW.

[Bikerdude]

Well as I don't have much trust in all things google, I'll skip sketchup. Whats the model format that a program need to export so I can import it into DR..?

[rich_is_bored]

*.ASE or *.LWO will work.

[aidakeeley]

Well, gmax doesn't, as far as I can tell, have a direct way to import or export either of those... but being a child of 3ds max(?) (autodesky), it ought to* be a 1 or 2 step (external) process, you'd think?

 

Here is a starting point

 

http://www.katsbits.com/tools/index.php

 

*"ought to"... yeah, "you'd think"... yeah, I know -- don't count on it; more likely? count on headaches.

[Bikerdude]

yeah I already noew about Kats bitys, very cool website, he has a free quake 4 map on there that a while i was looking at how to convert it into a Dm4 map..?

[CorwinWeber]

Little Britain for the win.

 

You can download plugins that makes blender have a more intuitive interface, so perhaps don't rule it out completly until you've explored all the options. I downloaded one that made it look and feel like 3ds max, although the only downside i guess is that you wouldn't really be able to follow the tutorials.

 

Otherwise, you might want to go with gmax, I love using 3ds max and gmax is essentially just a watered down version for modders.

 

Here's something that might interest you

 

http://www.hongkiat....hould-not-miss/

 

I've never seen such plugins, you don't happen to have a link, do you?

[rich_is_bored]

How about instead of a plugin you download the new 2.53 beta. If you find the new UI confusing, you'll find all full featured 3D modeling applications confusing.

[CorwinWeber]

How about instead of a plugin you download the new 2.53 beta. If you find the new UI confusing, you'll find all full featured 3D modeling applications confusing.

 

The last beta I tried was an improvement, but it was still a pain in the ass. Don't think I've tried 53 yet.

[Tels]

The last beta I tried was an improvement, but it was still a pain in the ass. Don't think I've tried 53 yet.

 

You can use DR and then the ase_export script for DR to create some basic models. It can't do smoothing, the UV mapping is a bit limited (but easier, tho) and I think vertex painting is not supported either.

 

But it works for simple models like crates, tools, and so on.

 

Edit: Script should be included with DR 1.4.x, but here is a link to our wiki:

 

http://wiki.thedarkmod.com/index.php?title=Running_Scripts_in_Darkradiant

[Serpentine]

Lately I have been playing around a bit with Misfit Model 3D.

 

I really must say, it's one of the simplest yet powerful UIs I've used, very much like using DR. While Wings was a bit more functional and easier than Blender for me, it wasnt nearly as simple as Misfit.

Though it does not support ASE or lwo exports, I think it's still quite awesome, the latest betas include a lot of new functionality too. - and who knows... maybe adding them wouldn't be too hard.

[Baddcog]

Gmax exports md5's. That's the format used for rigged stuff like AI and ragdolls (bucket with handle)...

I don't think it's good for anything without a skeleton though.

 

Does anyone have a link to the Blender script that makes it like 3ds Max, I'd like to give that a try.

[SneaksieDave]

Really anyone interested should give the 2.53 beta a try. The UI is completely revamped, and is nice. I've been watching tutorials for both the old and new UI, but the funny thing is, and this has happened repeatedly over the last few days: every time I want to find out how to do something in 2.5x, all I have to do is look at the side bar, and it's right there. Since I know of/have minimal exposure to some of the "how to" (e.g., marking a seam), it makes the tutorials almost unnecessary at this stage for me, because all I really have to do is find the Mark Seam button.

 

And it's right there.

 

 

I'm amateur for sure, but this is refreshing. And if you can't find something, try hitting spacebar and doing the new command search for it. Another pleasant thing I had happen a day ago was, I was trying to remember how to do something (in 2.43) and couldn't figure it out. I opened 2.5a instead, and was able to figure it out without a tutorial.

[aidakeeley]

Well, goddamnit, ... all that assurance AND Rich's scripts? I'm back in then... for a spell at least.

 

(Dammit "spell"! "Spell" should have made the Top 10... sit a spell; spelt rong; spell casting shaman...)

Edited July 24, 2010 by aidakeeley

[Arcturus]

After all these years I have found that Blender has inverted colours in the x axis of the baked normal map (when compared to Doom 3). It means that normal maps for models I made, including Aphrodite were screwed up. It takes 10 seconds to load image to Gimp and using it's normalmap plugin invert the colors.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Before:

 

http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=5140

 

Fixed:

 

[SneaksieDave]

Wow! I wondered why the faces were behaving oddly. Great discovery and the results are excellent. Can't wait to see what else you come up with.

[Arcturus]

I am making a video showing how to make normalmap for a simple wall texture using Blender, Sculptris and Gimp. Before I was baking normalmaps for 3d models only. It became obvious when I baked 3d model on a plane that it's inverted. Interestingly enough, articles about Blender say that it's the y axis that's different in different applications.