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PranQster

[Updated] FM: The Siege Shop (v4.4) by PranQster and lowenz (2020/3/16)

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The hot-air balloon ride didn't work in v1. goodjob.gif

Yeah. It was a one-way ride in the previous version, and easy to screw it up. At least now, if the player jumps/falls out, etc, there is still another way in and the balloon can still be ridden later. :)

Linux pranqster 5.6.3-desktop-2.mga8 #1 SMP Sat Apr 11 14:38:22 UTC 2020 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux

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I just was working on re-building my fms directory, deleting anything older than late September. When I went to check siegeshop (marked as update), it claimed version 3, but had only the old info (missing lowenz as co-author, etc), file date, screenshot, etc from 2 years ago. I didn't bother downloading it, since I already have it installed.

Can anyone verify if the version in the in-game mission downloader is indeed version 3?


Linux pranqster 5.6.3-desktop-2.mga8 #1 SMP Sat Apr 11 14:38:22 UTC 2020 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux

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It's the 3rd version ;)

  • Like 1

Task is not so much to see what no one has yet seen but to think what nobody has yet thought about that which everybody see. - E.S.

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Congrats to both of you on the update. I am finally getting a chance to play this and so far love the changes you've made except the

radioactive spider at the beginning. Nuff said. lol.

. I've been through it but must go back as I seem to have missed some loot but I did want to mention one thing that is a carry over from previous version:

When I blackjack Pyle he still flys off the scaffold, halfway across the room and of course dies. I guess I could leave him alone but thought I would check it out to see if the same thing still occurred.

Will try and write some more when I finish up. Thanks again for all your hard work.

Edited by Thiefette

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*The first one is PranQster choice! :D

(radioactive fungi -> why not radioactive spiders!).

 

*The second one is a known problem.

Edited by lowenz

Task is not so much to see what no one has yet seen but to think what nobody has yet thought about that which everybody see. - E.S.

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#1:

 

I was trying more for bio-luminescence, but will accept radioactive. :)

I also kept it a small spider, up and out of the way...trying not to scare anyone, but add some life to the cave.

 

#2:

 

I thought I had fixed Pyle from going Peter-Pan on us. The last couple times I KO'd him, he just dropped to the platform. Maybe I could add an aas_flood on his platform to see if that clears things up.

 

Edited by PranQster

Linux pranqster 5.6.3-desktop-2.mga8 #1 SMP Sat Apr 11 14:38:22 UTC 2020 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux

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Not a happy bunny

 

can't complete the mission as the objective which appears part way through which in my case was after I had achieved all the objectives except for the 5000 loot so I was on a loot hunt - pick the pocket of your old mate Bentley - I had already black jacked him and taken his purse

As a side issue I am really struggling with the loot objective so I resorted to using the show loot command and quite a few items which are showing aren't there because I have already got them I assume

 

Update - not as bad as I thought - see spoiler

I completed all the other objectives and went back to the campfire and it triggered the mission complete despite the objective not being triggered as being done

Edited by Oldjim
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I figured that would come up. lowenz and I talked about that scenario.

I kind of shrugged it off since it was an optional objective.

I should have put '(optional)' on that objective line. I thought the game would do that automatically since I specified that objective to be not mandatory.

 

As far as loot already picked up still showing when you showloot... I've seen this in a few maps before. Does it seem to occur with loot which is in jewelry boxes, maybe chests? It might be the frob control box being highlighted, even though the loot which was in it has already been picked up. If I learn how to fix that, I will.

Edited by PranQster

Linux pranqster 5.6.3-desktop-2.mga8 #1 SMP Sat Apr 11 14:38:22 UTC 2020 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux

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Overall impression - the changes and improvements from the previous version are really impressive and I enjoined playing it except - and this may be just me - some of the loot was just too hard to find.

I went through using my normal look everywhere routine and I only collected about 3,700 which wouldn't have even met the medium difficulty.

I suggest relaxing the loot requirements a bit

A few comments

 

At the start - playing on the hardest setting without a rope arrow - it took me ages to find the rope arrows as the quiver just showed up a a black shape and the arrows really blended into the background :blush:

Finding the key to the wardrobe was very challenging as I hadn't black jacked the person whose note referred to it - I was trying for a no kill option and black jacking him killed him - and even then you needed to pick him up to identify him and hence know where to look for the key. I suppose the reference to Brother Pyle should have given me the required hint but I didn't think of it

Entering via the moat - I used this for a change - was very good but made things much easier (perhaps too easy as it bypassed all the difficulties of getting into the workshop) and this was why the optional objective was a problem as I worked upwards from there.

Regarding the optional objective - to achieve that you actually needed to pick pocket all the guards until you found the correct one which would have been a bit of a pain. Perhaps a readable giving some guidance as to where he could be found would be useful

The jewellery box in the wardrobe was a bit odd as opening it seemed to be linked to opening the wardrobe doors and it kept closing on me for no obvious reason. Also I was totally unable to frob the ring inside it

Regarding the show loot problem these are screenshots of two of the areas if it is of any help

post-8491-0-01409600-1383739253_thumb.jpg

post-8491-0-07552000-1383739258_thumb.jpg

 

Edited by Oldjim

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Overall impression - the changes and improvements from the previous version are really impressive and I enjoined playing it except - and this may be just me - some of the loot was just too hard to find.

I went through using my normal look everywhere routine and I only collected about 3,700 which wouldn't have even met the medium difficulty.

I suggest relaxing the loot requirements a bit

A few comments

 

At the start - playing on the hardest setting without a rope arrow - it took me ages to find the rope arrows as the quiver just showed up a a black shape and the arrows really blended into the background :blush:

Finding the key to the wardrobe was very challenging as I hadn't black jacked the person whose note referred to it - I was trying for a no kill option and black jacking him killed him - and even then you needed to pick him up to identify him and hence know where to look for the key. I suppose the reference to Brother Pyle should have given me the required hint but I didn't think of it

Entering via the moat - I used this for a change - was very good but made things much easier (perhaps too easy as it bypassed all the difficulties of getting into the workshop) and this was why the optional objective was a problem as I worked upwards from there.

Regarding the optional objective - to achieve that you actually needed to pick pocket all the guards until you found the correct one which would have been a bit of a pain. Perhaps a readable giving some guidance as to where he could be found would be useful

The jewellery box in the wardrobe was a bit odd as opening it seemed to be linked to opening the wardrobe doors and it kept closing on me for no obvious reason. Also I was totally unable to frob the ring inside it

 

  • Arrows: Hmmm... I know they are not really easy to see, but this issue didn't arise during testing. Have you adjusted gamma lower? On the other hand, I'm also glad that a search for them was required ;)
  • Blackjacking the dude had apparently been fixed during beta testing. But this is the third report of making Pyle fly and die when KO'd. I'll experiment with an ass aas flood entity where he stands and see if that changes anything. Also, I figured the players would realize that guy is Pyle since he is holding a note addressed to Pyle, from the smith...and he's not the smith.
  • lowenz ran into the issue of playing the map 'backwards' and not getting the benny loot objective. Frankly at that point I was fucking burnt out and had no desire to fix it, though I should have added 'optional' to the description. Yes, I should have made some reference to which guard was Bentley. Seeing how I have several things to fix, I'll add this to the 3.1 bugfix release list.
  • The jewelry box: Hmmm. Sorry for any issues you had. It must have been an unfortunate frob timing thing. The jewelry box and cabinet are set up kind of special. Bentley interacts with both, so both auto-close. That way, the next time Bentley goes to his cabinet, both it and the jewelry box are closed and ready for him to interact with them. The jewelry box must have been frobbed at a critical moment when it was closing or about to close. Then the ring was set un-frobbable though the lid was open. Sorry for that, but it was the only way I could get the AI interaction to work well.
 

Regarding the show loot problem these are screenshots of two of the areas if it is of any help

post-8491-0-01409600-1383739253_thumb.jpg

post-8491-0-07552000-1383739258_thumb.jpg

 

That's the frob control I was referring to. I've seen this happen in other missions...no idea how to fix it. Since it is only an issue when using showloot, I'm not concerned about it.

 

* Correction: That was all caused by a newb mapper error. I think I had tried taking a shortcut to making the scroll by converting an already-existing loot item (gold nugget) to using a scroll model and inventory icon.

Edited by PranQster

Linux pranqster 5.6.3-desktop-2.mga8 #1 SMP Sat Apr 11 14:38:22 UTC 2020 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux

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Well got the rest of my loot

should always remember to look carefully in some of the more obvious places - stream bed :blush: . Have to say I really liked the 2 ways in(or out) scenario. The changes that you made are positive ones - the archers having to practice, the rooms being less spread out. The grass was incredible and I liked that the balloon could go both ways. I sent it back down as I'd already found the other way in and wanted an easy way to get back to the top if needed. I missed a couple of readable's - one in the desk (mixed in with other frobable scrolls) and the one on Pyle (first couple of times I'd snuck up on him I just never saw it - too bright in the area maybe?). Besides my earlier discussion of Pyle, thought I'd mention that his stool was half off the platform but not falling and I never made a shadow even when I was directly in line with the lantern and should have. There was also a couple of nails floating (with shadows) beside some boards at the tunnel entrance near the rabbit.

All in all I enjoyed this revision. Thanks again for your hard work.

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:blush:

Task is not so much to see what no one has yet seen but to think what nobody has yet thought about that which everybody see. - E.S.

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That's the frob control I was referring to. I've seen this happen in other missions...no idea how to fix it. Since it is only an issue when using showloot, I'm not concerned about it.

 

Actually I think only the construction plans are highlighting in show_loot even after having been taken. So perhaps you defined some loot properties to the plans and that might be the solution to change this? Just an idea of a non-mapper ;)

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Actually I think only the construction plans are highlighting in show_loot even after having been taken. So perhaps you defined some loot properties to the plans and that might be the solution to change this? Just an idea of a non-mapper ;)

I'll look into that entity first then :)

Now the deja vu is starting to hit..I think I need to re-check the process about which I made that item go to inventory.

 

Edit: Aaah yeah. Newbie error I think.

It appears that I had started with an gold nugget loot item, which I modified to be the scroll :blush:

Edited by PranQster

Linux pranqster 5.6.3-desktop-2.mga8 #1 SMP Sat Apr 11 14:38:22 UTC 2020 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux

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...Besides my earlier discussion of Pyle, thought I'd mention that his stool was half off the platform but not falling and I never made a shadow even when I was directly in line with the lantern and should have. There was also a couple of nails floating (with shadows) beside some boards at the tunnel entrance near the rabbit.

All in all I enjoyed this revision. Thanks again for your hard work.

 

Nails: fixed for 3.1. Thanks for pointing this out. I forgot to adjust them after the last move of the table they were attached to. I had also forgot to re-hang a handsaw on one of those nails.

Stool: That little bastard has been problematic. It shouldn't have been off the platform at all because it had been set as a non-movable, non-solid entity, so as not to interfere with Pyle getting knocked out. I wrapped it with player_clip so the player could climb over the stool. Why did it move??? The plot thickens!

 

Ummm... I just checked. I had made those changes, but for some reason I reverted back to a movable chair and no player clip. I must have re-loaded from an auto-save after one of those occasional DR crashes.

Also, it appears that the lantern in question defaults to no shadows...fixed.

Edited by PranQster
  • Like 1

Linux pranqster 5.6.3-desktop-2.mga8 #1 SMP Sat Apr 11 14:38:22 UTC 2020 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux

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I'll look into that entity first then :)

Now the deja vu is starting to hit..I think I need to re-check the process about which I made that item go to inventory.

 

Edit: Aaah yeah. Newbie error I think.

It appears that I had started with an gold nugget loot item, which I modified to be the scroll :blush:

OK. I replaced the first of the scrolls with a proper scroll entity. As a newb, I had created a loot item first, then converted it to a scroll :)

I just tested it and that is now fixed. The loot box now no longer shows in showloot after picking up that first scroll. I'll fix the other two (obviously).

Will post update maybe this weekend.

Edited by PranQster

Linux pranqster 5.6.3-desktop-2.mga8 #1 SMP Sat Apr 11 14:38:22 UTC 2020 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux

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I think I also fixed Pyle's swan-dive-of-death. He was standing awfully close to monsterclip, so I moved him and his seat back a few units. I KO'd him 3 times last night and each time he simply slumped unconscious and fell next to his stool.

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Linux pranqster 5.6.3-desktop-2.mga8 #1 SMP Sat Apr 11 14:38:22 UTC 2020 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux

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Perfect :D


Task is not so much to see what no one has yet seen but to think what nobody has yet thought about that which everybody see. - E.S.

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http://jdchoate.mcn....d/siegeshop.pk4

Give this one a try. In addition to what I mentioned above, I also fixed a few more things.

 

  • Bentley objective now says '(optional)', and includes such wording as 'if you haven't already' and 'his old City Watch uniform'
  • Bentley wears City Watch uniform
  • Pyle KO's properly, I think/hope/wish
  • Floating nails in workshop near a table were re-positioned and the hanging hand saw re-added (was in original map)
  • Pyle lantern casts shadows
  • Patrolling guard in workshop/cave area changed uniforms and weapon
  • More grime added to 3rd floor walls near elevator
  • Glowing mushroom added to skeleton in entry cave, to help those with darker gamma see the arrows
  • Fixed frob peer problem and render issue on the wine barrel pour valve
  • Salted the fish
  • Custom smoke particle added to the second pan on stove... that oil's getting awfully hot!
  • Replaced steam particle on the other cook pot
  • Fixed texture scale of the water in Albert's dish tub next to the stove and added a couple dishes in it
  • Replaced the brass alarm horn on top of the drawbridge portcullis motor. I had used a bell model, but a custom patchwork thingy looks better
  • Also added a stupid little decorative light/button thingamajigger to the portcullis motor (where an on/off lever would go), to make it look more shiny and fanciful
  • Replaced some wooden posts on floor 2...the ones in the room corners with the arch-work sprouting out of them
  • If there was something else, I've forgotten it

 

 

Edited by PranQster

Linux pranqster 5.6.3-desktop-2.mga8 #1 SMP Sat Apr 11 14:38:22 UTC 2020 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux

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Most fixed/tuned FM ever :D

Your dedication is admirable PranQ ;)

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Task is not so much to see what no one has yet seen but to think what nobody has yet thought about that which everybody see. - E.S.

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Playing through again

 

All looking good including black jacking Brother Pyle and the mushroom near the arrows is a great help in directing one where to look

Phantom loot is fixed

One thing - changing the uniform for Bentley seems to have made him immune to black jacking - at least I failed miserably after numerous tries

 

Edited by Oldjim
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Playing through again

 

All looking good including black jacking Brother Pyle and the mushroom near the arrows is a great help in directing one where to look

Phantom loot is fixed

One thing - changing the uniform for Bentley seems to have made him immune to black jacking - at least I failed miserably after numerous tries

 

Ok, I'll check again. I might have to downgrade him to a lesser CW guard. Or tweak settings to make him KO'able again. He defaulted to elite guard, non-KO-able. Will fix tonight.

The timing on this release is actually working in my favor. Since TDM 2.0 was released and everyone is playing all of the maps, Siegeshop v.3 was not swamped with people playing it after release. I can treat this time as public-beta :)


Linux pranqster 5.6.3-desktop-2.mga8 #1 SMP Sat Apr 11 14:38:22 UTC 2020 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux

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Most fixed/tuned FM ever :D

Your dedication is admirable PranQ ;)

History of siegeshop, in a nutshell...
  1. Installed DR and followed the newbie tutorial with map name 'john01', quickly renamed 'j1' when I started dmapping.
  2. After doing most of the newb tutorial, I made 'j2' through 'j7' maps, all small temp maps to work on individual experiments. For instance, 'j4' was nothing but a chain model wrapped around a windlass drum with levers and rotators to get the windlass to turn in opposite directions when levers pulled (later scrapped due to technical issues...was too easy to screw up the drawbridge).
  3. I built the drawbridge in 'j1' and used it as a starting prefab for map 'j8'...'j8' became an experiment to build a map around the working drawbridge.
  4. 'j8' became two hallways with an arch between them. These later became the workshop and drawbridge areas and doorway between.
  5. I decided to build a catapult in the back hall...for the hell of it. Walls were put up and the concept of a siege workshop in a small fortress was born...the map suddenly had somewhat of a purpose and I realized it would become a real mission, maybe.
  6. Copied map 'j8' and named it 'siegeshop' with intent of making a mission.

So, this essentially an offshoot from my WIKI tutorial A-Z map. I have no qualms about upgrading, fixing, experimenting and improving upon this mission. I am working on about 4 or 5 other maps, but always return to siegeshop to tweak it further. :)

Edited by PranQster

Linux pranqster 5.6.3-desktop-2.mga8 #1 SMP Sat Apr 11 14:38:22 UTC 2020 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux

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http://jdchoate.mcn.org/games/darkmod/siegeshop.pk4

  • Bentley fixed. Now a regular CW guard with chain coif, not elite with helmet.
  • Bentley idle bark intervals greatly reduced. He is now much more drunkenly vocal, as he should be.

 

BTW, this mission gives a small glimpse into Bentley's (aka Benny) personal life. If he is not KO'd, the player might see that :)

 

I have a few other things in this map which may take a long time before anyone notices.


Linux pranqster 5.6.3-desktop-2.mga8 #1 SMP Sat Apr 11 14:38:22 UTC 2020 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux

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