Health Display Concept

[Darkness_Falls]

If we go with the uncompressed then I'd just rather have the weapon icons moved back to the corners where they were before. It does little good to put them into the middle of the screen at that distance apart like that. There's no cohesion and it's therefore distracting. And also remove those frilly wires from the gem.

 

I was trying to find a way to make better use of the area that those frilly wires currently take up (to the left & right of gem). But if the compressed version isn't utilized, then I feel it's wasted space to putting any unnecessary graphic there at all, like those frilly wires. They look pretty, but they serve no purpose except to take up screen real estate.

[Darkness_Falls]

I think it's a good compromise.

Sorry I disagree. It would be less distracting to just put the small weapon icons back to their respective corners of the screen.

[Fingernail]

I think you're finally getting there, guys.

 

 

You can, and will, reach the truth with little of my intervention.

 

I do, however, like the uncompressed version more.

 

And worry less about wasted space, DF. We're not cramming half the screen up with interface with any of these designs. Barely even 20% of the space is being used for the HUD.

[Darkness_Falls]

I'm a worry wart Of course the font sizes would need to be bumped up a little (north, 12, 3), but I still like the Swiss Army Knife version:

[god_is_my_goldfish]

Deinfitely the uncompressed, but the healthbar should be moved up to the gem, so it can pop out when the player is injured.

You have to remember that the vast majotiry of time, it'll only be the gem construction with the compass you'll see.

  You also have the whole thing way too big in that image.

I post the full size here so you can see the scale properly.

I find myself agreeing with odd on the design, but i am wondering one thing, how will this scale with various resolutions, or will it remain the same size no matter the resolution. If the latter, then there are going to be problems with the clarity of many parts of the hud on lower resolutions.

Edited March 14, 2005 by god_is_my_goldfish

[sparhawk]

Deinfitely the uncompressed, but the healthbar should be moved up to the gem, so it can pop out when the player is injured.

I like this version best. Only thing is that I prefer to have the numbers below the icons. IMO that's more logical. As Spring did it in his shot.

[sparhawk]

I'm a worry wart Of course the font sizes would need to be bumped up a little (north, 12, 3), but I still like the Swiss Army Knife version:

Nobody can force you to use it. It is just a small tweak so you can use your version if you like, that's not really a problem. But we should decide for the official release version and it seems that most agree with the version from Spring and Odd.

[oDDity]

I like the number on top becasue the take up less space that way. When you put the icon on top of the numbers it pushes them up to much. I like to keep them as near the bottom of the screen as possible.

 

Still, I hope we're goign to make it so the weapon icon only comes up while you're selecting weapons and then disapears very quickly again, as with the item icons and the health bar.

99% of the time it'll just be the gem/compass combo on screen.

[Darkness_Falls]

Excellent, I like being able to tweak things if I want.

 

After the bulk amount of discussion subsides, however, we should still do a poll regarding this. This swiss army knife approach all came to light within the past 12-16 hours, so I'm sure there are a few others that might not've seen or chimed in yet; thus it would be premature to poll today. Granted, it may be reasonable to assume, Sparhawk, that most will want the uncompressed version -- and I'm fine with that, if the poll says so -- but I'd like the poll to actually be between 3 versions. 3 versions to create the poll for. (Note: Gem size should be equal between the 3 versions and there should be relatively equal details, to not taint the survey):

 

1) My version (fix the size of the font before posting a gameplay screen)

2) oDD/Spring's version

3) Light gem and health bar in middle, with left-mouse weapon in left corner of screen and right-mouse weapon in right corner of screen.

EDIT: And maybe a 4th one that is like mine, but remove the thick curvy wire things poking out on the left/right. The end result would be a cross between mine and oDD's - with no frills.

 

As with other threads, just because 3 or 4 people quickly say they like something doesn't mean the whole team prefers it that way and that the discussion should end.

 

PS: I think it would be cool to also build the classic Thief 2 HUD into DM and make it an option to enable ("Thief 2 Classic HUD"). Some peeps may not like our new HUD.

Edited March 14, 2005 by Darkness_Falls

[Darkness_Falls]

Still, I hope we're goign to make it so the weapon icon only comes up while you're selecting weapons and then disapears very quickly again, as with the item icons and the health bar.

99% of the time it'll just be the gem/compass combo on screen.

This is contrary to my suggestion. Man, I wish we could all easily create animated mockups so there's no confusion in these discussions

Darkness Falls Wrote - Side note: The big weapon/ammo quantity icons would still initially be in the left and right corners (for a few seconds) while you're making your weapon selections, but after you've decided on your weapon, have that big weapon/quantity populate to the center of the screen as small icons by the light gem, as my mockup shows.

After thinking about this more, as you're making your weapon selection, BOTH the large icon in the corner and small icon next to the gem should update real-time. It's just that the large icon would go away after a few seconds whereas the small one won't.

 

oDD - It is helpful for me to have a continuous display of what items I have loaded to my left- and right-mouse buttons. Thus, the icons wouldn't go away. This is why I prefer my compressed version, because the icons will always be there. I'm okay with the health bar hiding, but not the weapons. I'd hate to want to toss a flash bomb or use a health potion, but forget that I had a gas bomb loaded there and then gas myself to death.

 

PS: IMO, the health bar should slide out when changing weapons or items. Otherwise there would be no way to see how much health you have left.

Edited March 14, 2005 by Darkness_Falls

[New Horizon]

If we were to use the approach oDDity suggested, there should be no need for the larger icons to appear in the corner. I believe that would be pulling the players focus for no real purpose, especially when it can be done in the same area.

 

Basically, the weapon icon just needs to be a little bit larger while it is being cycled through. Once it has been chosen, it shrinks down to normal size as the player has made an association with the icon and can easily identify the smaller version.

[Ishtvan]

Just a side comment, not sure if it's helpful:

 

I'm all for condensing compass+lightgem+healthbar

 

However: Putting the items right beside condensed compass+lightgem+healthbar seems to increase the likelyhood that all of this will actual block out something on the screen that we want to see (meaning we'll have to angle down to see it... breaking teh immersion!!11 )

 

Would it be possible to either make the items fairly transparent, or move them to either side corners? I think at the side corners, they're less likely to create a gigantic mass of HUD in the lower middle that would block a significant part of something we're looking at.

[New Horizon]

Just a side comment, not sure if it's helpful:

 

I'm all for condensing compass+lightgem+healthbar

 

However: Putting the items right beside condensed compass+lightgem+healthbar seems to increase the likelyhood that all of this will actual block out something on the screen that we want to see (meaning we'll have to angle down to see it... breaking teh immersion!!11 )

 

Would it be possible to either make the items fairly transparent, or move them to either side corners? I think at the side corners, they're less likely to create a gigantic mass of HUD in the lower middle that would block a significant part of something we're looking at.

We'll really have to play test it to see what happens but that can be tweaked afterwards. For now we should probably assume that we will try this formation out and then iron out the wrinkles as they pop up. It's going to end up taking much less space than all the previous huds in reality....which is pretty cool. I think the weapons could fade to semi transparent after they shrink though. Anything we need to frob willbe in the center of the screen though.

[oDDity]

uhh..why would anyone need to have a weapon icon constantly on screen?

You mean the player might forget which weapon he's holding and have to look at the icon to make sure?? Or after seeig he had 5 water arrows left when he selected them, he might not be able to keep track of how many he used??

What kind of retards are you expecting our fanbase to be?

 

Lik I said Ishtivan, the vast majotiry of the time it'll only be the gem and compass on screen, you'll rarely if ever have the entrie HUD on display t once to obscure anything, unless you happen to be simultaniously selecting an item and weapon at the same time while taking damge and try to frob something.

It only looks a little cluttered there becasue it's all on display at the same time.

[New Horizon]

What kind of retards are you expecting our fanbase to be?

*scuffs ground*....I dunno. .....me no retards cause me like...think it guess

 

At any rate. They could disappear, or half fade out. It hasn't really been nailed down completely yet.

 

Tosses a porkchop and runs away in the other direction

[Springheel]

We already established we need the icons to stay. I don't want to have to switch weapons to find out if I selected broadheads or water arrows ten minutes ago. Nor do I want to throw my last flashbomb when I thought I had healing potions selected.

 

I'm sure it will be easy to remove them in the .ini files, but they should be there by default.

 

Ish: I'm starting to agree with you that moving them back to the corners might be better...we won't know for sure until we test it.

[Darkness_Falls]

What kind of retards are you expecting our fanbase to be?

We apparently don't all have an IQ level of 220 like you

 

I agree that so much stuff in the middle may obscure the scene when playing in-game. I think that's why I subconsciously wanted to put the icons back to the corner if we weren't going to have a "DF Army Knife", but I didn't realize this until Ish mentioned. I know it's why I want a semi-transparent HUD.

[]-UnderTOW-[]

What kind of retards are you expecting our fanbase to be?

Well, i like to be reminded of what arrow i have equipped (because you can't see it unless drawing the bow). Not that necessary for the sword or blackjack because you can see it.

 

We already established we need the icons to stay.  I don't want to have to switch weapons to find out if I selected broadheads or water arrows ten minutes ago.  Nor do I want to throw my last flashbomb when I thought I had healing potions selected.

 

Exactly.

Edited March 15, 2005 by ]-UnderTOW-[

[Domarius]

Well, I like where this is going. Looks like it's just fine tuning now.

 

I think that it could be made so that everything except the light gem hides untill you press something - select weapon, or get hit - then the extras (health, weapon icon) appear again... so they hide away and don't clutter, but you can press a button to bring them back at any time.

 

Also, if anyone is worried about the HUD being to small, in the future we should consider making a check box, that if it is checked, the HUD scales larger when you change to higher resolutions. Because if we're going to have small icons, they're going to get even smaller on high resolutions.

[Ishtvan]

Oh, if they fade to very transparent then I guess I coud live with having them up close like that. If they stay visible tho I'd prefer to have them in the corners, just because stuff you want to look at in detail is usually in the center, and putting HUD stuff there could be distracting (imagine trying to look down from a high place and follow a bunch of guards patrolling at different vertical levels on your screen)

[Springheel]

And the more things going on in one spot, the more distracting it can become. I guess we'll have to test it to be sure, but I have a feeling that I personally am going to find this area a little 'busy'. Instead of a half-second glance to get the info I want, I'm going to have to spend some concentration filtering out the information I don't want at that moment. Speaking artistically, there is now an awful lot of 'visual weight' in the center.

 

Moving the icons to the corners would certainly help spread things out. No reason to make them any larger, either.

 

But I guess we'll see.

[Darkness_Falls]

Yep, I agree testing may be the only way to decide on the best solution.

[]-UnderTOW-[]

Because if we're going to have small icons, they're going to get even smaller on high resolutions.

Um... Doom 3 doesn't do that, does it? Quake 3 didn't. The last game i recall to do that was Unreal 2.

[Domarius]

Yeah but I don't think Doom 3's icons are very small, so they probably didn't bother.

[]-UnderTOW-[]

Hold on, no they wouldn't change size, since the HUD is a GUI. GUIs keep a constant scale on the screen no matter what the res, right?

Edited March 15, 2005 by ]-UnderTOW-[