Light flickering

[waxhead]

Various lights in the dark mod has a flicker effect that is fairly constant "ramp down some, ramp up some, repeat."

When several lights does this in unison, it does not look very real and look very animated.

Would it be possible to consider adding some randomness to each light so they each flicker individually? I really think this would really help with realism and it ....here goes... sounds like a simple fix.

[datiswous]

1 hour ago, waxhead said:

and it ....here goes... sounds like a simple fix.

You could go to our wiki, read a bit, and implement it in an example map. Because it's such a simple fix.

Mission makers might disagree with you though and then it never gets implemented in those missions.

[MirceaKitsune]

It may or may not be a simple fix. Light flickering uses the ingenious method of making lights flicker based on the sound shader: The most logical way to get more realistic flickering is to look for a better electric sound, I believe you simply set it as the s_shader parameter of the light to replace the default one.

[OrbWeaver]

From the description it seems the problem is that several nearby lights are flickering exactly in unison, presumably because they are all using the same sound shader to control the flickering (and the sound shaders all start playing at the same time).

So it would seem the solutions are:

• Use a slightly different looping sound for each light (if available).
• Implement a feature in code whereby the looping sound shader can be started from a random position, rather than from the beginning of the loop.

[MirceaKitsune]

4 hours ago, OrbWeaver said:

• Implement a feature in code whereby the looping sound shader can be started from a random position, rather than from the beginning of the loop.

I'd suggest this too, there should probably be a simple sound flag to support it. Make it a feature for all looped sounds: I can see many situations where you'd have the same looped audio in multiple locations from which you hear it simultaneously, but because they all start playing at the same moment, you'll hear them in unison which will sound unrealistic.

[JackFarmer]

23 hours ago, OrbWeaver said:

From the description it seems the problem is that several nearby lights are flickering exactly in unison, presumably because they are all using the same sound shader to control the flickering (and the sound shaders all start playing at the same time).

So it would seem the solutions are:

• Use a slightly different looping sound for each light (if available).
• Implement a feature in code whereby the looping sound shader can be started from a random position, rather than from the beginning of the loop.

Yes, it would be good to change something here.
Would it perhaps be possible to implement a spawnarg called “start_delay” - “x.xx” with "x.xx" in seconds?

Wouldn't solve the problem for existing missions, but still very helpful for new projects.

[wesp5]

This should be fixed for existing missions too, has somebody already made a bugtracker so the core team is aware of it?

Edited August 17, 2024 by wesp5

[waxhead]

On 8/16/2024 at 10:55 AM, OrbWeaver said:

From the description it seems the problem is that several nearby lights are flickering exactly in unison, presumably because they are all using the same sound shader to control the flickering (and the sound shaders all start playing at the same time).

So it would seem the solutions are:

• Use a slightly different looping sound for each light (if available).
• Implement a feature in code whereby the looping sound shader can be started from a random position, rather than from the beginning of the loop.

Yup - this is the problem precisely. Good that someone understood it :)

[OrbWeaver]

"start_delay" rather gives the impression that it is leaving a period of silence before starting the sound.

I'd suggest "loop_start x.xx" if you want a specific start point in seconds, or "loop_start random" to let the game choose a random position within the loop.

On 8/17/2024 at 9:04 AM, JackFarmer said:

Wouldn't solve the problem for existing missions, but still very helpful for new projects.

I assume if the new property was applied to the actual shader in the .sndshd file, rather than as a spawnarg on an individual map entity, it would apply to existing missions without needing changes by the author.

[grodenglaive]

I just saw this while looking up something else: https://wiki.thedarkmod.com/index.php?title=List_of_shaderParm_variables

add the shaderParm4 spawnarg to the lights and vary the value between the lights from 0 to 1 to offset their flicker.  Seems like an easy fix for new missions.

Unfortunately, I just tested it and it doesn't seem to have any effect at all.

[datiswous]

54 minutes ago, grodenglaive said:

add the shaderParm4 spawnarg to the lights and vary the value between the lights from 0 to 1 to offset their flicker.  Seems like an easy fix for new missions.

Are you sure that can be set as a spawnarg? I think this needs to be specified in materials.

Sorry, didn't read the wiki page well.

 

Core light material:

lights/square_strobe
{
	{
		forceHighQuality
		map		lights/squarelight1.tga
		red 		( blinktable2 [Parm4 + (time * (6 * Parm3)) ]) * Parm0
		green 		( blinktable2 [Parm4 + (time * (6 * Parm3)) ]) * Parm1
		blue 		( blinktable2 [Parm4 + (time * (6 * Parm3)) ]) * Parm2
		zeroclamp
	}
}

 

Maybe you have to set it in a material and then modify it via a spawnarg? The spawnarg setting for that light entity would link the specified number (0-1) to "Parm4" in the material code. I mean that makes sense to me.

Or maybe that's how you meant it?

Edited March 14, 2025 by datiswous

[grodenglaive]

Ahh, maybe your right. I didn't read the wiki very well either:) I just assumed it would work to simply modify the light entity.

I don't think many fm devs would bother with custom shaders just to adjust the blinking lights. Oh well.

[datiswous]

Well if you can figure out how to make the material code work you can change the flickering on a per light basis via that parm4 spawnarg. I think it can be useful. I personally find it a bit complicated to wrap my head around though.