2.0 Buggers Up Patrol Routes

[Sir Taffsalot]

While testing my WIP under 2.0 I've noticed what one of the patrol no longer works. The AI gets to a certain point and stops moving. His feet are moving but there is no motion. It's like an invisible barrier is in front of him. In 1.08 this is not an issue. As 2.0 is coming out any time now I want my WIP to be 2.0 ready. Please advise on how to fix. Thank you.

[Sir Taffsalot]

Would dmapping under 2.0 solve this? I just copied my pk4 from 1.08 to 2.0.

[Springheel]

Dmapping shouldn't be necessary. However, I haven't seen a problem like this in any of the 60+ missions tested under 2.0. More details are necessary. Is he approaching a visportal? Is it level ground?

[Obsttorte]

Check the monsterclips, maybe the ai has hung up somewhere.

[Sir Taffsalot]

There is no monsterclip or visportal anywhere near him and it is level ground. There is no pathfinding issue in 1.08. I just went in game to look. This only occurs under 2.0.

[Springheel]

Is there any way to look at that part of the map? I doubt we're going to be able to solve it by description alone.

[Sir Taffsalot]

 

Here's a DR screenie with a red arrow pointing to where the AI gets stuck. I can't think of how else to be helpful without uploading my actual map.

[grayman]

I need to see the map.

[Bikerdude]

@ST, is there a Vizportal at that location..?

[grayman]

The problem was that the path_corners were sitting 40 above the street.

 

As the path entities wiki says, path_corners should sit on the ground. In 1.08 that didn't seem to matter, but 2.00 is more picky as the result of my having fixed a particular bug.

[PranQster]

Whoa! This is good to know.

A similar issue (possibly related???)...

In siegeshop, under 2.0, I found that the default properties for all of the "chancenotice_*something*" do not work at all. The AI are completely dumb until I select the needed property, say for chance notice blood, and then click the check to use that spawnarg. Even if I do not modify the value at all. Person, Weapon and Blood should all be active by default, but they're not. This sucks having to select each AI, one at a time, and click on each of the 'chance' properties to make the AI function.

[grayman]

Whoa! This is good to know.

A similar issue (possibly related???)...

In siegeshop, under 2.0, I found that the default properties for all of the "chancenotice_*something*" do not work at all. The AI are completely dumb until I select the needed property, say for chance notice blood, and then click the check to use that spawnarg. Even if I do not modify the value at all. Person, Weapon and Blood should all be active by default, but they're not. This sucks having to select each AI, one at a time, and click on each of the 'chance' properties to make the AI function.

 

These spawnargs are all active by default, otherwise none of over 70 published maps would work correctly.

 

I don't know why you're experiencing this problem.

 

Perhaps you can give a specific example?

[PranQster]

lowenz is helping me test siegeshop. I recently upgraded to 2.0, but before that lowenz was testing on 2.0 and I was on 1.08.

Anyway, All mine is upgraded to 2.0 now and everything seems good except lowenz pointed out that the AI were not reacting to KO'd bodies. I tested and saw the same problem. After selecting the default spawnargs in the inherited properties list, the AI then worked. But I need to enable each spawnarg needed in order to make each AI notice things... blood, person, weapon, lights, etc.

I do have a few AI with some of these spawnargs disabled on purpose. But those should not affect the other AI's ability to notice things, should they?

Maybe some more testing needs being done with AI with custom chance-notice spawnargs, such as 'blood' or weapon set to '0', then some default AI dropped into the map. Then see if the default AI have problems noticing things...?

[grayman]

AI not seeing KO'ed bodies was a temporary problem that I caused and which I subsequently fixed. There's no way your tinkering with spawnargs would have suddenly allowed a KO'ed body to be seen.

 

If you test with the latest 2.00 package, you'll find that it works again.

 

If you alter the chance* spawnargs on a particular AI, it will not affect anyone else.

 

Edit: Oh, and could you explain what "enable each spawnarg" means?

[Springheel]

I think he means just adding it to the AI entity specifically, rather than leaving it in the "inherited" list. It's highly unlikely this would have any affect on anything.

 

I can confirm that AI are noticing lights, bodies, and blood without incident in the latest build.

[grayman]

I think he means just adding it to the AI entity specifically, rather than leaving it in the "inherited" list. It's highly unlikely this would have any affect on anything.

 

Doing that only has an effect if the value of the spawnarg is changed. If unchanged, it does nothing.

[PranQster]

Normally I would agree. But lowenz can confirm, I needed to enable the default spawnargs in siegeshop before AI would respond to bodies.

I thought it was possible that lowenz was reporting problems, unaware that several of my ai were "drunk". But I ran into the same issues, where the AI did not respond at all to their "chance" spawnargs, until I selected them in the inherited list and checked the button to enable them.

Edited September 1, 2013 by PranQster

[PranQster]

I think he means just adding it to the AI entity specifically, rather than leaving it in the "inherited" list. It's highly unlikely this would have any affect on anything.

 

I can confirm that AI are noticing lights, bodies, and blood without incident in the latest build.

Exactly. I left the values the same, but had to select the inherited spawnarg to "enable" it, before the AI would respond to the "inherited" property.

Basically, in siegeshop, for every ai, I needed to select each "chance" spawnarg and click the "ok"/"check"/"accept" button to apply it.

Again, it is possible that lowenz was seeing ai ignoring bodies because of drunk acuity and not waiting for them to behave properly..

Edited September 1, 2013 by PranQster

[grayman]

It's impossible for inherited spawnargs to be ignored.

 

I'd like to see an example of the map before you "enabled" the spawnargs you're talking about.

 

Something else had to be going on.

[grayman]

There is a spawnarg called "drunk_acuity_factor" which defaults to 0.5.

 

Each time an AI's acuity is checked, if he's drunk, his acuity is multiplied by this factor.

 

Once he's seen evidence of something wrong (body, enemy, something missing, etc.), his drunkenness is ignored, and his acuities return to normal.

 

So I would expect drunks to take longer to realize something's wrong.

 

But having to explicitly include a spawnarg in DR so that it's not ignored by TDM makes no sense whatsoever.

[Springheel]

It's far more likely that you were experiencing the recent bug that kept AI from seeing KO'd bodies and then updated your 2.0 build, at which point the bug went away. You can test this by removing those spawnargs from the AI again and see what happens.

[PranQster]

It's far more likely that you were experiencing the recent bug that kept AI from seeing KO'd bodies and then updated your 2.0 build, at which point the bug went away. You can test this by removing those spawnargs from the AI again and see what happens.

That's just the thing. I had updated TDM 2.0 after learning of that. Then lowenz complained about the AI not noticing KO's. I assumed it was the acuity (maybe it still was), but I saw 3 different AI walk right over a body in plain light... maybe their drunk chances prevented all 3 from noticing. I'm going to try removing those default spawnargs and let TDM handle the inherited ones. I increased drunk acuity on several of them already to 0.75, leaving a few less vital AI at drunk 0.5.

If they notice bodies then I'll chalk the whole mess up to the drunk factor (both the AI and FM-builder).

 

I noticed that the more of those inherited spawnargs I chose to manually enable, fps dropped accordingly. Hopefully setting the AI back to inherited spawnargs, the framerate will increase a bit.

Edited September 1, 2013 by PranQster

[grayman]

(both the AI and FM-builder).

 

[PranQster]

Yep, it was the drunk acuity more than anything. That caused confusion after the updated 2.0 to fix notice KO'd bodies. Now that everyone with drunk set has acuity greater than .60 (most are .75) they notice bodies much more readily.

I also had to remove several carried wine bottle props because the AI have a bad habit of dropping them in doorways when going on alert...then doors/portals don't close.

Another strange thing. After deleting the default spawnargs to let TDM handle the inherited ones, all my archers suddenly started having trouble at doorways. They'd stop and turn in circles. It turns out that all of them suddenly gained 'acuity_aud' '50', which I don't remember ever even selecting on any of them.

Edited September 2, 2013 by PranQster

[PranQster]

Also, I just noticed that AI arm animations don't seem to be happening. Their arms just hang at their sides in one position while they walk and they don't reach for doors.