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Deadlove

Reverb on sounds

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without reverb:

https://soundcloud.com/plastikmusik/tdm-ai-zombie01-alertdown-to-1

 

 

with reverb:

https://soundcloud.com/plastikmusik/tdm-ai-zombie01-alertdown-to

 

 

I was working with some slight verb on the sound FX. If you guys think this sounds better, I will start to add mild small reverb on other sounds to give the TDM sounds a bit of verb like the original Thief sounds, which all have a bit of reverb.

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I also am looking for a sound of worms crawling around / mushy / nasty sound to layer in to give the zombie the sound of worms crawling around in its dead but animated corpse. Haven't found something suitable yet, but an idea I have to make it sound more horrific / scary.

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drunk guard

 

no fx:

https://soundcloud.c...monish-friend01

 

fx:

https://soundcloud.c...-friend01cmpvrb

 

Verb is at -15.0 dB, on separate aux channel, comparing to Thief sounds, I think it's about right with the amount of verb. Also, verb is set for small room, if my memory serves me correctly that was the same setting for the Thief sounds. I doubt I'm using the same reverb processing unit as Eric B did. Do you guys think this is too much verb for the human voices?

Edited by Deadlove

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https://soundcloud.com/plastikmusik/admonish-friend01cmpvrb21

 

Same drunk guard, this time reverb is set to -21dB. Maybe this is a little more tame?

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Hard to tell just listening to it raw like that. I'd have to see it in a video or in-game to know for sure. Are you considering doing this to ALL our sounds? Do you have a batch process? There are literally thousands.

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If you go to : https://soundcloud.com/plastikmusik and listen to them in order you can hear the subtle differences a bit better.

 

Yes, I'd very much like to do it to all the sounds. But I don't want to start unless I have a good balance that the team agrees on. I have a batch process, but I'd still have to top and tail the individual files.

 

Also, I'd prefer to work straight off the WAV files as the conversion messes a bit of the file up, even if its not too noticeable. But that's a call on whoever has the WAV files stored up and can upload them.

 

So I'd say I'd do it one character / voice set at a time, and then that way it wouldn't be too overwhelming.

 

After listening, I think the -21 dB is a bit more tame compared to the -15dB. Thinking in advance that once many sounds are playing in the game, the reverb shouldn't be noticed crossing from one sound to another. It will stack up with many sounds, so best to keep it lower.

 

If you or whoever wants to get me hooked up with the WAV files to a given character, I can make a sample, post it, and if the team agrees, then I'll run them all.

Edited by Deadlove

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Well, there's a problem there...not every character has .wav files for every vocal set. While the original files are wav files, those original files aren't always cut up the same way and don't always have the same filenames (for example, there might be a .wav bark that contains two takes of the same line, and only one of them is saved as an .ogg). And there are lots of sounds for which we don't have the original wav files, unfortunately. Is there a noticeable degrading if you run it on the .ogg files?

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I started on the grumbler, and am about halfway done. I loaded the sounds in game (kept the same file names) and the difference is marvelous. I used "Business as usual" as the grumbler is patrolling the street right outside where the player starts.

 

Who did the voice to the grumbler? Sounds like the same person who did the voice to the zombie.

 

Hopefully I can manage to get this one character done before I retire tonight, and I'll post a link to a zip so others can load it in if theyd like to and share what their opinion.

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IMO i would not do this, but wait for the engine with EFX support to become ready, because if you give all the sounds reverb now then it will sound very strange when you also apply the EFX reverb on top, then you will need to remake all the sounds again or lose the ability to give location based reverb to the sounds with EFX.

 

Remember a cave has different reverb to a cathedral to closet or a small corridor.

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If we did this we would keep the originals for the fabled day when we have EFX support.

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If we did this we would keep the originals for the fabled day when we have EFX support.

 

Ok but i do hope that day comes relatively fast. :D

Edited by HMart

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We've only ever had one person talk about working on it, and no indication of significant progress that I'm aware of, so I wouldn't hold your breath.

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IMO i would not do this, but wait for the engine with EFX support to become ready, because if you give all the sounds reverb now then it will sound very strange when you also apply the EFX reverb on top, then you will need to remake all the sounds again or lose the ability to give location based reverb to the sounds with EFX.

 

Remember a cave has different reverb to a cathedral to closet or a small corridor.

 

You are aware the all the raw Thief sounds have reverb on them? Not too mention many other games?

Edited by Deadlove

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I don't really know about thief but i'm certain not all games have reverb on the sounds at lest not that obvious like yours above, but i'm not really a sound guy so perhaps they all include a subtle reverb to their sounds and i don't really notice. Can you tell me about a game with obvious reverb in all sounds, apart from thief like you said (always though EAX was the one giving that effect on thief games tho).

 

We've only ever had one person talk about working on it, and no indication of significant progress that I'm aware of, so I wouldn't hold your breath.

 

I don't mind waiting :) if the original sounds will be safe guard or is true that reverb on top of reverb like Deadlove more or less said is not a problem them go for it, you don't need my approvel so. ;)

Edited by HMart

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EAX was giving the environmental reverb similar to what is created with a convolution reverb processing unit.

 

All the individual sound effects that I'm aware of to Thief have reverb on them before they were put in the game.

 

Quake is another game that has obvious reverb on sound effects.

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Hi guys, first post here, hi to all you sound nerds! I've got some audio for games experience and experience with EAX. As tempting as it is, I would not apply any environmental effects to assets. You want them nice and dry unless it's processing for creatures or a specific voice but anything like verbs and delays and that kind of stuff, I would let your audio engine handle.

 

A commitment like that made now could have dire consequences down the road. Just some friendly advice.

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sonic_sig2_zps436bac19.png

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As tempting as it is, I would not apply any environmental effects to assets. You want them nice and dry unless it's processing for creatures or a specific voice but anything like verbs and delays and that kind of stuff, I would let your audio engine handle.

 

A commitment like that made now could have dire consequences down the road. Just some friendly advice.

+1.

 

I would definitely want to have software-powered (e.g. OpenAL) delay and reverb. That project, however, has been swapped from front burner to back burner many times.

 

As I'm certain Deadlove knows well, there are many games whose SFX had a bit of reverb baked into them, and generally sounded okay when EAX was piled on top. But you are absolutely right that the generally-accepted practice nowadays is to keep them dry. That is also my personal preference.

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yay seuss crease touss dome in ouss nose tair

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Yes, for the majority of the sounds, I feel the same way about the dryness, and letting the EFX handle the processing.

 

I agree some sounds should have verb, at least those which aren't necessarily human sounding. I'm also a sucker for the Thief atmosphere, which was achieved with verb on quite a bit of the raw sounds. Not everyone had EAX when Thief came out, but the audio design allowed for even people without it to get a very atmospheric touch with verb built into the assets. So for EAX users of Thief, we were indeed hearing double verbs. I had a Diamond Monster Sound card back then, A3D was great. I remember the difference when I first got it and was amazed!

 

I just have no idea when this will actually happen. As Mortem said, it's been on the plate to achieve for a long time, but is a long way off.

 

With the new code that was mentioned in another thread, it seems the tweaking of the BFG edition of DOOM got the EFX built in. I hope that this code can be implemented into TDM, and we can FINALLY have EFX.

 

I'm taking this road because I just want to hear the sounds get a little more love from a dimensional perspective than they have. Of course I'd be thrilled if we got the EFX implemented in, not only would it be a great achievement, but it would save me from having to do thousands of sound effects of work.

 

:-)

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A commitment like that made now could have dire consequences down the road. Just some friendly advice.

 

Also, Springheel has mentioned that all original dry files will be kept on hand. So once EFX does makes it way in, that the sounds will have a back up so that there's no need to worry about anything like that. Planning ahead.

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It's too bad. I've never worked with a game engine that didn't have some sort of fx in it and I've worked with quite a few. Even if they're half crap, it's better than nothing.


sonic_sig2_zps436bac19.png

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If I remember correctly, Doom 3 did have reverb built in, but it was only one type of reverb (the one that echoes good for military complex / metal buildings) because that was what most of the game of D3 was, so it was internally configured that way to save resources.

 

Since TDM uses a broad range of environments, that programming just didn't work out, so the team opted for dry sounds till EAX/EFX was worked out corrrectly, and to this point there's been noone to complete the restructuring. I'm not a programmer, so don't take my word as final say, but this is the way I remembered it being explained.

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Doom3 came with EAX support but only for Creative Cards that supported it (and even that might not work in TDM anymore, as it's unsupported by the devs who don't have the right cards).

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