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Fan Mission: Iris by WellingtonCrab [TDM 2.10 Required] (2022/02/13)


Wellingtoncrab
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Iris - Connections Contest Scoring  

48 members have voted

  1. 1. Story Quality and Theme (Stars)

    • 5
      33
    • 4
      11
    • 3
      4
    • 2
      0
    • 1
      0
  2. 2. Gameplay Quality (Stars)

    • 5
      40
    • 4
      7
    • 3
      0
    • 2
      1
    • 1
      0
  3. 3. Visual Quality (Stars)

    • 5
      45
    • 4
      3
    • 3
      0
    • 2
      0
    • 1
      0


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this was one of the best 'densely populated area' FMs I've played, including TG/T2, and I absolutely love it!

the tag of a location name and non/hostile helped me orient myself in a district the character should know, which was very helpful (though people on the street got mad at me for being in my own house 🤨). One thing I would have liked to have was a map file I could print and make notes on. I've got Mirkway Quarter, Hightowne, and Stonemarket on my wall right now.

I really liked discovering elements as I progressed, collecting items and memories, getting gossip and reading people's opinions of me as an old man!

I did find some bugs, though:

Spoiler
  • I found my main character voice overs to be too quiet; I was afraid I had missed something important each time. Subtitles would have helped.
  • Some vertical elements seemed like I should have been able to climb them, but I fell and took damage (the apartment elevator chains, the vines in the decrepit manor fountain area). Speaking of climbing, when coming through the wall from the basilica the chain down just disappeared when I frobbed it. I reloaded and it dropped correctly.
  • On the balcony over N Sloughgate, and the E Grimskirk "watchers the lostmen" books have text hovering above the page
  • Found some clipping: I walked through the low wall with a lamp in the Corpsegrinder's lair. Same with the low wall by the stairs next to the brewer's in N Slough.
  • Had some LOD issues: the wooden elements of the ruined building housing Newt pop in and out. A light pops in the home in E Grimskirk with the "watchers the lostmen" book.

I really enjoyed this experience, and just from a brief skim of the thread it seems I've missed quite a bit I'll need to go investigate!

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@hightidethanks for playing and glad you enjoyed it! Thanks for the bug reports as well - I will take a look.

8 hours ago, hightide said:

One thing I would have liked to have was a map file I could print and make notes on.

Here are high resolution versions of the in game maps if you would still like them:

Red Rook: Southbridge & Brewbower

Spoiler

Hollowbrook: Brewer’s District

 

Edited by Wellingtoncrab
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14 hours ago, Klatremus said:

I could no longer enter Cloak & Dagger's top floor window without a level 1 alert for example.

Interesting - since the area outside the window is neutral on my end I have no issue making this move from the townhouse into the blacksmith window as long as Ian is sleeping. The sitting/sleeping ai seem quite hard to roust, even on the hardcore ai acuity settings but I don't how consistent this really.

12 hours ago, hightide said:

though people on the street got mad at me for being in my own house 🤨

Hmm ... this should not happen unless the player is brandishing a weapon or something. Do you recall anything that might have occurred prior to the ai becoming hostile while you were in the starting location?

12 hours ago, hightide said:
  Hide contents
  • Some vertical elements seemed like I should have been able to climb them, but I fell and took damage (the apartment elevator chains, the vines in the decrepit manor fountain area). Speaking of climbing, when coming through the wall from the basilica the chain down just disappeared when I frobbed it. I reloaded and it dropped correctly.
  • Found some clipping: I walked through the low wall with a lamp in the Corpsegrinder's lair. Same with the low wall by the stairs next to the brewer's in N Slough.
Spoiler

I was able to fix everything on your list that wasn't related to the asset from the core mod itself or the voice acting (as that will need to be redone at some point) with a couple of points:

Vines are plentiful in the mission and are not typically climbable so for consistency sake I would not change this - though I agree the elevator chains should be and I will add this.

I was not able to replicate the clipping issues you mentioned - there is only one low wall with a lamp in that area so I am pretty sure what you are pointing out but this was world spawn and I could not clip through it - I put a large clip volume around it just to be certain. I could not find any low walls in sloughgate with clipping or collision issues either - would you be able to point out specifically which one had the issue?

Updated beta branch of Iris have been pushed to link including key drop, LOD fixes and more!

 

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3 hours ago, Wellingtoncrab said:

Interesting - since the area outside the window is neutral on my end I have no issue making this move from the townhouse into the blacksmith window as long as Ian is sleeping. The sitting/sleeping ai seem quite hard to roust, even on the hardcore ai acuity settings but I don't how consistent this really.

It's the drop from the sill onto the floor inside Cloak & Dagger that gives the alert. It doesn't wake him up, so it's technically not a Supreme bust, but if you use the stealth stat tool it shows that he hears it as a level 1 alert. I'm just comparing to the first run without your new script which didn't give this alert. Yeah outside the window nobody alerts, as it is not hostile territory.

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Thanks!

One thing I noticed is that the weapon shop owner doesn't react to any sounds you make in the back of the shop. Naturally, he is friendly to anyone entering the front, but I still imagine he would react to activities elsewhere in his establishment. Perhaps that is difficult to script, I'm not sure.

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40 minutes ago, Klatremus said:

One thing I noticed is that the weapon shop owner doesn't react to any sounds you make in the back of the shop. Naturally, he is friendly to anyone entering the front, but I still imagine he would react to activities elsewhere in his establishment. Perhaps that is difficult to script, I'm not sure.

I’ll definitely take a look at that - theoretically since the back of the shoppe is a hostile area it should work just like that but in this case where he standing at the counter might still technically be within the weapon shoppe proper so he is not getting covered by the new script.

Hopefully easy to fix by just tweaking the bounds between the areas!

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Ironically, if you edit that, it might be very difficult to get in there for Supreme, as you're not allowed to turn off cameras for that mode. There's no loot but there is a strange fable. But dont let that sway you, it'll be a nice challenge nonetheless.

Btw that makes me wonder, there is no way to steal the shop items without taking out the shop owner, right?

Edited by Klatremus
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Spoiler

Also I found a mistake in the tomb below Basilica Gate. On the flooded side where the vase is lying in the water, from above you can see a triangular rocky outcropping, but when you get down there, it disappears. It seems its still there though as you can mantle back up it, but there are no textures on the side of it, it's just transparent.

 

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@KlatremusYep - that is it - Calvin is technically standing in a neutral part of the weapon shoppe. I have this fixed it but yeah pulling off getting to the back without turning off the camera would be tricky. The timing is such that you can pass the camera but it would undoubtably spook the shoppe owner.

And yes the only way to loot a shop is to incapacitate the owner.

Thanks for catching that patch sticking out as well - go that fixed.

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Tested the shop and I can still get in without alerts, but it's not as easy as before and you have to place something soft inside first.

Spoiler

I also saw you added yet another secret from the void. Any hint on the third one? Just general part of town, no major spoiler please.

 

Edited by Klatremus
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Only the one .pk4. I've got 2 iris directories, one called iris (which is the normal v1.12) and one called irisbeta. I just edited the darkmod.txt and changed the title so that I could tell them apart in the game. But that shouldn't make a difference cause I got the stuck guards on the regular version also before I ever downloaded the beta version. In the fm directory I've got my savegames folder, consolehistory.dat, darkmod.txt, install_splash.tga, irisbeta.pk4, and readme.txt. That's it.

No the last version I didn't run into issues, but I didn't play more than Southbridge and the Stacks before I downloaded the latest one, as I wanted to test the shop and the key dropping.

Oh and I found all 3 void secrets. The last one was really cool! Obviously answered my own question about the loot when I found that also.

Edited by Klatremus
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@Klatremussee anything usual or relevant error wise popping up in the console? (ctrl+alt+~)?

I went ahead and deleted and then recompiled the navmesh and collision data for the map and reuploaded the beta just in the event I am somehow screwing up packaging the mission - this should happen automatically when the map is compiled but it the only thing I could thing of as so far I can't seem to replicate it. Seems like something sort of kicks the problem off as you mentioned in the last version it seemed like it became an issue after a certain amount of play time.

It's hopefully not related to additions made to the script, as it seemed to be inflicting AI in Hollowbrook where this would not even apply. I am just going to keep playing and see if I can eventually replicate it.

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I have tons of red script warnings in my console, and it seems like most of them relate to mission readables and missing textures, and they are the same every time. I even tried to delete the consolehistory.dat file and remove the stealth stat mod, but I get the same warnings in the console, so I doubt the mod has an influence. I'll try some more with the new beta and see what I find.

The first time I checked the console, I had warnings that several AI could neither sit nor sleep. I found one of them to be the guard outside Rodere's. He was just standing. But the next restart I didn't get those errors. Weird how they come sometimes and not at other times. Plus those were right from the start, not after me doing anything at all in game.

Oh and what is this "watchers the lostmen" books that Hightide was talking about earlier? I am worried than some readables haven't spawned for me.

Edited by Klatremus
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@Klatremus

Spoiler

That would be kingfisher’s journal - he is the pagan overlooking the forgotten house in the plague ward. I wouldn’t worry about any readables missing - those warnings are related to some stock guis I believe where are missing some graphical elements

I have clocked about 4 hours of playtime and more 10x speed observation of all the problem ai patrols since yesterday and so far haven’t been able to replicate the ai getting stuck. If you run into the problem with the newer beta we might have to try looking at a console dump and see if there is anything relevant in it - which we can generate by typing “condump [unwrap] irisconsoledump.txt” into the console for example.

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Got another stuck guard against a bucket on Rookbridge with the latest beta. Here is a console dump. Here is the last quicksave, if it works. I use the stealth tool but that's the only mod. I think it's something on my end, since you can't replicate it. I just don't know what.

I other news, I haven't found anywhere it can't be ghosted the same way as before. Some places are harder and you need to move slower, but nowhere is impossible or even extremely difficult. But the tension is much higher and more realistic.

Edited by Klatremus
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@Klatremusthe condump didn't have much to say but in better news I was able to load this save with the stealth tools mod installed and can see the guard.

image.thumb.jpeg.18b8d196b8bb601957f122e416f5ef70.jpeg

He seems to have gotten completely outside the nav mesh (the numbered boxes on the ground) and is attempting to get to this patrol point in the opposite direction (to the arrow). Clearly that is the problem as he cannot navigate without a nav mesh, but not very illustrative of the cause as he has effectively gotten completely encased in a clipping volume intended to keep AI out and it's very hard to say how that happens or why it is happening with such regularity in your playthroughs.

I did a fly through of the map in this state and couldn't find any other AI in this state - but given whatever is causing this occur has already started in this playthrough hopefully if I keep going I will run into some more along the way. 

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Well I am happy you managed to load my save, and also interesting that the condump didn't give any info. Keep in mind that when I Supreme Ghost I save and reload a lot. At the end of a Supreme run in a mission this size, it's not uncommon for me to have several hundred saves/reloads in the stats. If there is a miniscule chance each reload that a guard that is close to his nav mesh border might get stuck, this chance could get compounded by the amount of saves/reloads I do. I am just guessing here really, as I have no idea. I just know that happens in Thief, although of course it's a completely different engine.

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