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Hey another post by my dumb ass. lol j/k ;)

 

but hey i was checking out the new screens and they look sweet.

 

i have a question about quake 4.

quake 4's is suppose to be the same engine as doom3. just more optimized for game play. better lighting sound, quake 4 will be a better game all around in my opinion. but will you guys make the jump?

 

and also i was think while looking at your screens. that you guys have prolly started you campain. bits and peaces here and there. little things you want in you campain. but have you guys planed far enough a head to even have a name yet? from what i have been told another year till this might be ready to roll. and that would set you guys at the least another year a head for a campain. by that time a thief 4 maybe out and the engine outdated. but id still play it. lets face it i play the dark project more than thief 3. not becouse of the looks but becouse of the game.

 

peace till latzzzzzzz

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Hey another post by my dumb ass. lol j/k ;)

 

but hey i was checking out the new screens and they look sweet.

 

i have a question about quake 4.

quake 4's is suppose to be the same engine as doom3. just more optimized for game play. better lighting sound, quake 4 will be a better game all around in my opinion. but will you guys make the jump?

 

I suspect we'll stay with Doom 3, unless there are outstanding reasons to switch to the Quake 4 engine. I would guess that there will be things that the community will mod into Doom 3 one way or another through the SDK. The community is resourceful like that. :)

 

and also i was think while looking at your screens. that you guys have prolly started you campain.

 

Nope, the campaign will not start in earnest until we have finished or nearly finished, the toolset. We need the tools to use ourselves. I think we'll see plenty of maps released shortly after the toolset is finished though. They just won't be campaign related.

 

bits and peaces here and there. little things you want in you campain. but have you guys planed far enough a head to even have a name yet? from what i have been told another year till this might be ready to roll. and that would set you guys at the least another year a head for a campain. by that time a thief 4 maybe out and the engine outdated. but id still play it. lets face it i play the dark project more than thief 3. not becouse of the looks but becouse of the game.

 

We've had plenty of discussion about the campaign in the early days but now isn't the time for us to focus on that. The toolset is our priority as without it, there is no campaign and there would be no new FM's. I also don't think the doom 3 engine will look too outdated anytime soon. It's very well supported and will really only see its true potential in a few years when PC's are better able to run it to its full extent.

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It's possible that in a far future release, we might be able to merge our code with the Quake4 SDK source if the game source is similar enough to D3. I'm pretty sure for the first release though, we will be sticking with D3 since we can code and test using D3 right now and have already put almost a year's work of worth into coding and testing for D3.

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i have a question about quake 4.

quake 4's is suppose to be the same engine as doom3. just more optimized for game play. better lighting sound, quake 4 will be a better game all around in my opinion. but will you guys make the jump?

 

If Q4 is similar enough, we might. Of course we can spend our time with upgrading to the ever next best engine, instead of implementing what is required. The we will always be on top of the mose 7331 cewl new engine, but we never will finish TDM, because we only have limited time.

 

and also i was think while looking at your screens. that you guys have prolly started you campain. bits and peaces here and there. little things you want in you campain. but have you guys planed far enough a head to even have a name yet?

 

No name yet. We have planned the campaign and laid out the plot so far, though. So we have planned ahead.

 

from what i have been told another year till this might be ready to roll.

 

The toolset. Yes. This might be realistic. Though this most likely will not be the finished product, it is more likely a public beta test.

 

and that would set you guys at the least another year a head for a campain. by that time a thief 4 maybe out and the engine outdated. but id still play it. lets face it i play the dark project more than thief 3. not becouse of the looks but becouse of the game.

 

Don't know where this crap comes from. I guess it may just be wishfull thinking. It is very doubtfull that a Thief 4 is coming, and even if it comes it most certainly has nothing to do with Thief as we know it, from what I read. As for the D3 engine being outdated in 2 years, that's just hilarious, because by this time the games will appear using that engine. Only this year the Q3 engine was released as GPL because it was still in use, so this may give you a good hint at how long it will take until D3 is really outdated.

Gerhard

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I don't understand why people care whether an engine is "outdated" or not.

 

If it looks good now, it will still look good even if there are newer games on the market. The appearance, performance and playability of a game or mod do not just disappear the minute something "better" comes along.

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Games take at least 3 years to make, so in the time between any big mod or TC being started and being finished, some other engine with more bells and whistles will have been released.

This is not the same for commercial developers who make ther own engines, since they can plan now for what cutting edge graphics will be like in 3 or 4 years time. Oblivion for example.

Civillisation will not attain perfection until the last stone, from the last church, falls on the last priest.

- Emil Zola

 

character models site

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I don't understand why people care whether an engine is "outdated" or not.

 

If it looks good now, it will still look good even if there are newer games on the market. The appearance, performance and playability of a game or mod do not just disappear the minute something "better" comes along.

 

That's not entirely correct. Nobody would consider a C64 game looking good anymore. I know that I was amazed at that time what it could offer, but that was because it was the best that you can get at that time. Hardware has moved on, and what was consider to be a good looking engine a few years ago, is today outdated. In your mind it would still look good, because you remember it the way it was back then, but if you actually see it with todays knowledge you will see the difference. Of course performance and playabillity will even increase, because of the faster hardware, which is a benefit.

 

Anyway, the argument that the D3 engine will be outdated when we are able to release is not really my major concern. I know that the engine will most certainly NOT be outdated even by commercial standards, simply because we are currently at the start of the D3 period. Most games, which will feature it, will come out not much earlier then TDM, so TDM will still look good compared to other games.

Gerhard

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Although, that's not TOTALLY true. Sure, C64 games hardly look good any more.

 

However, Little Big Adventure for instance still looks fine because the graphics are quite suffiecient, detailed and stylised enough, even for today. It was made in 1994.

 

Likewise, Thief still works because the atmosphere is still there, and the graphics can be quite engaging, even today.

 

Others like Fallout, or Half Life, are still perfectly fine to look at.

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As much as I like Thief, I would never think that it's graphics can be compared with todays games. That's simply over the top. Of course Thief excells in many areas, which makes it an excellent game, but it was already not considered to be up to standard when it came out, much less today.

The only thing this proofes is, that a game does not need flashy graphics to have a high replay value. I still play C64 games every now and then, and I immensly enjoy it. As a matter of fact I finshed my favourite game from the C64 not on the C64 itself, but on an emulator a few years ago. Not because I could better cheat there or because the emulator offered some advantages, but because it was fun to replay it. The experience was exactly the same as it was back then.

Gerhard

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I believe that artistic style and correct use of an engine is more important than just getting any engine as long as its the latest spiffy one. For instance, I played System Shock 2 (Dark Engine), and Undying (1st Unreal engine) last year for the first time, and those 2 immersed me more than the other titles newly released that year. Of course that may be due to the great gameplay and stories inherent in both :unsure:

Loose BOWELS are the first sign of THE CHOLERA MORBUS!
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I certanly won't care what engine the game uses as long as it's drawn good, and I personaly put the line between bad graphics and good graphics on Quake III and Heretic II - everithing higher is great to me, everything lower is bad, and DooM III is way ahead - a lot of people say HL2 looks better, but I can't agree with that. If the game is colorful, with DooM III shadows and bamp and stuff it would terrific quality. You say game looks bad because of new engines higher than it. If we take old games doom, heretic, war2, heroes1 - they are painful to look at. THe graphics is pixelated and stuff. Thief, Q3, Heretic II are not painful to look at at all, but they look worse than todays engines. Personaly, the farcry and d3 don't look too different to me. They are on the same level. And just because q4 will have a slightly better shadow won't make me thing the games is outdated. If a game can last only as long as it's engine is the best, it's not a game. Just some rubbish to play a while and throw into the trash can a month later. I'm glad you chose d3e. It's a great engine, and outdated or not, the game will look GREAT.

May the Abyss rule!

 

Shadow of the Serpent Riders fan.

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Well, Far Cry and D3 are not THAT far away from each other. At least not compared to how far D1 and D3 is. :)

Regarding HL2 I also think it looks better. But you are right insofar as HL2 only looks better because it has a completely different environment and this is due to the textures, not the engine itself. If I would compare HL2 and D3 on a technical level, then D3 beats it hands down. The environment is of course also very subjective. I liked HL2 a lot because it reminded me of my youth when I was going for fun in the canal from Vienna. The canal where you have to drive with that floating boat reminded me remarkable at it, whereas I considered D3 rather boring. Always the same technical Sci-Fi mars station. Only the hell level I considered rather cool. But there are enough people who liked the environment and the gameplay, so this is subjective and is not really related to HL2 or D3 as an engine.

If I have to choose based on the game which game is "better" to look at I would definitely choose HL2, but if I have to choose an egnine for it's quality and modability, I would always prefer D3. Not would but do. :)

Gerhard

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Well, for me DooM looks better... I just don't like broken down walls an other, the game is too brown somewhat, no bright colors...

May the Abyss rule!

 

Shadow of the Serpent Riders fan.

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Games that used the classic Wolfenstien engine, Classic Doom engine, Unreal engine, Quake 2 engine, etc. etc. all kept appearing years and years after the original game was released.

 

The reason is these engines have had a LOT of work put into them, and have a lot of lastability and mod-ability in them.

 

Doom 3 is only brand new. You will see a lot of commercial games still using this engine for many years yet.

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and advantige to D3 is that its going to be realy cheap soon:). i already have it so whatever but for all of thos who dont have it at least they wont have to spend 30 - 50 $ on the game just to play TDM. its true that you still see alot of games with old engines like half life. so many still play 1.6. i do valve's new source engine has potential but they are greedy and lazy. they have abandoned CS:S and HL2. not fixing any bugs. and then they make more games to make more money and not fix the old ones. bunch of fucking panzys.

 

but are you guys going to be releaseing the dark mod realy early to a select few. ( not the full thing ) just what you have done. giveing it to sertine thief moding groups and updateing them with new textures and materials every month or so. that way when it is released we have some good campains comeing along. cause lets face it, even a good sp mission takes months. maybe a year. id hate to have it and have nothing to use it for. it would be cool to have a few missions at release. and some good campains on the way along with all the moders makeing FM's. just a little sugestion.

 

and have you guys used john P's high res textures in thief 3. shit it makes the game twice as good. along with the minimalist age it turned out to be a good game.

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dunno about campaigns by other people, but i believe that we were planning to release a mapper's version before the full version is complete so people can start making maps (this version would have all the things required to make a thief map, but the ai would'nt completely work) and then a while after the full version comes out with fully working ai/weapons etc, or something like that.

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that sounds cool. .. ive been learning the Doom ed for a while now. id love to start a FM if you guys realease a mapper version. its so hard to map a thief style map with bright lights and metalic textures. it just doesnt give the same effect. like ive mad qwite a few thing in the doom ed. but they all look to DOOMY.

 

 

got any links to some nice thief style textures or close to it that i can use. (wood brick stone EXC )

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sure, but you'll have to make normal maps/speculars for them yourself. Ok, here's a few links:

http://www.mayang.com/textures/

http://www.image-stock.net/

http://amazingtextures.com/textures/

http://www.texturewarehouse.com/

 

hope those help.

 

if you need to find some others, just google "textures" or something, thats how most of those were found.

 

also, when you make a decent looking level, post screenshots up so we can see them :)

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but are you guys going to be releaseing the dark mod realy early to a select few. ( not the full thing ) just what you have done. giveing it to sertine thief moding groups and updateing them with new textures and materials every month or so.

 

Certainly not every month, but rest assured that we are not doing our stuff in a scret chamber only release it when it is finished. We are well aware of the time it takes to do something with it, once it is finished, so there already mappers working on their own maps and include what we can give them at the time.

Of coruse we will release it to some "select view" as soon as we have a playable map. After all we need alpha and beta testers at that point. It would not a good idea to throw it in the public without going through a beta testing first.

Gerhard

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I have a question, and I really do apologize if it has been answered previously. Hpwever, the huge textures that the Dark Mod seems to have inherited by some means or another (Discussed in the news), will they be accessible in the toolset? Just out of curiosity. Also, as for map making, Slash discussed making a level in Doom Ed. If we were to say, experiment with that, is there a way to import the level into the toolset? I realize I'm horribly naive about these things, but if that is reasonable, I might have to purchase Doom 3 and start on one myself!

Edited by Ombrenuit
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Also, as for map making, Slash discussed making a level in Doom Ed. If we were to say, experiment with that, is there a way to import the level into the toolset? I realize I'm horribly naive about these things, but if that is reasonable, I might have to purchase Doom 3 and start on one myself!

 

anything you make in doom3ed you can easily open up in the toolset and change the textures around to make it look thiefy. so rest assured, any mansion you make now, you can retexture when the toolset comes out :)

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