Keepers?

[Slash]

one thing i realy havent heard about or talked about is the keepers. obviously the most important character other then garrett in the series. he does missions for them and was trained by them. what are your plans for them? will you make them dark and misterious like in the first game. you never realy lay eyes on them but you know that they are vary important. and when you do there blackend by the shadows. vary dark indeed.

 

the keeper is the most powerfull character in the story i think. there so compelling.

[Gildoran]

TDM does not take place in the Thief universe, as that would violate intellectual property rights. As such, our mod doesn't have Garrett or the Keepers in it. However, TDM's world is inpired by the Thief universe and will have many similarities and parallels. The sorts of FMs that would fit into Thief's universe would probably also fit into TDM's just fine.

 

I don't know of any plans for a faction equivelant to the Keepers, but I suppose it would be possible for you to use our assets to create a level with Keepers in them. However, we cannot advocate doing such, as it is illegal to use TDM to make a Thief FM.

[Slash]

TDM does not take place in the Thief universe, as that would violate intellectual property rights. As such, our mod doesn't have Garrett or the Keepers in it. However, TDM's world is inpired by the Thief universe and will have many similarities and parallels. The sorts of FMs that would fit into Thief's universe would probably also fit into TDM's just fine.

 

I don't know of any plans for a faction equivelant to the Keepers, but I suppose it would be possible for you to use our assets to create a level with Keepers in them. However, we cannot advocate doing such, as it is illegal to use TDM to make a Thief FM.

yes i know this is not thief and the hammers you are makeing will not be called hammers. its copy right. illigal. but since your createing a spin off hammer class, why not a spin off keeper class. inspiered by keepers. they where only one of the most important classes in the thief series. there should be some sort of class like this in the dark mod.

[ZylonBane]

Keepers were only important for the plot. In actual gameplay you never interacted with a single Keeper (unless you consider the TDP training mission).

 

Also, the concept of Keepers is dangerously specific to Thief, unlike the relatively generic city guards, religious fanatics, and tree-huggers that TDM is creating.

[OrbWeaver]

I don't know of any plans for a faction equivelant to the Keepers, but I suppose it would be possible for you to use our assets to create a level with Keepers in them. However, we cannot advocate doing such, as it is illegal to use TDM to make a Thief FM.

 

It wouldn't be illegal to create an FM that just used the names, as long as you didn't try to cross-import any Thief series assets into the mission. Mere names are not substantial enough to be protected by copyright, they have to be trademarked which requires registration and a fee - something Eidos almost certainly haven't done with "Keeper" or "Garrett".

[Fingernail]

Ultimately, however much they try, I doubt Eidos would be able to stop anyone who made a mission that did violate IP rights and put it out on bittorrent.

 

I'm not encouraging any illegal activity here. You'd be working at your own risk.

[OrbWeaver]

Ultimately, however much they try, I doubt Eidos would be able to stop anyone who made a mission that did violate IP rights and put it out on bittorrent.

 

No, but whether they would be able/willing to enforce and whether they have anything that they CAN enforce are two different questions, and I believe it is important to understand where the line is drawn.

 

I would never intentially violate copyright or advocate doing so, but in many cases you can do things that people assume you can't without violating some IP right or other. IP companies have been very successful at stirring up a cloud of FUD around anything IP-related so that people genuinely believe that even using the word "Garrett" in conversation would be actionable (even if your name is Garrett, it is a fairly common surname after all).

[sparhawk]

Any discussion of copyrights is futile unless specified where it applies to. Don't know why I have to repeat this again and again.

[Dunedain]

Well, what TDM team can "officially" include and what fans will make are two different things.

It's understood that the team has to refer to things in certain ways and such. Just put in a

couple good models of men with long dark flowing hooded cloaks (you don't even have to

name them) and some animations for their movements, etc. and the fans will take care of

the rest. Situation handled in a way where there will be no problems.

[Vadrosaul]

Eidos is only going to care if someone is trying to make money off of it. They won't waste time or money going after someone who made an FM using TDM with all the Thief IP stuff in it, especially during a lull period in the license's use.

[Dunedain]

If anything, FM's are a great help, as they give the Thief fans something to do while they wait

for Thief IV. It also brings in new fans that will then want to buy and play all the Thief games.

[Slash]

If anything, FM's are a great help, as they give the Thief fans something to do while they wait

for Thief IV. It also brings in new fans that will then want to buy and play all the Thief games.

 

lol yeah right. thief 4 is unlikly in the for sceen future. but who knows. eidos has taken the same road as EA. they dont give a shit about a game being good. just as long as its made fast and people buy it. they dont care if people dont like it. FUCK GAME COMPANYS. i cant belive how shitty games have gotten. HL2 even was short and sucked for the most part. lol thats why i love this game. made by the fans for the fans. cant wait for this.

[Dram]

made by the fans for the fans. cant wait for this.

 

"Cos we give a fuck!"

[OrbWeaver]

I think there should be a new rule that hooded faces for avatars are banned. There's what, 4 people using them now?

[Dram]

I think there should be a new rule that hooded faces for avatars are banned. There's what, 4 people using them now?

lol....

[Ishtvan]

I think there should be a new rule that hooded faces for avatars are banned. There's what, 4 people using them now?

 

Unless it is the actual person's face. Then that's okay, since we can make fun of it.

[ZylonBane]

Ook.

[Domarius]

Or if its done really well like the Thief 2 credits - all those otherwise dorky programmers and artists really looked like moody "Thief" characters

 

Otherwise its not much different than having an avatar of Luke Skywalker on a Star Wars forum. It's like "Hm... creative..."

[Garion]

I don't see why copyright would be much of an issue. Like Dunedain said, just add in mysterious guys in cloaks and there you go. Or, since this is essentially a fantasy world the idea of magic users or mages is not an uncommon one. We know the keepers use magical glyphs or runes to use magic and reveal prophecy. Why not simply have a class or cult of secretive mages that are similar to the keepers? It could also add more depth to the game if you were able to flesh it out. They could act like keepers and try to influence events by giving the player missions or hints from time to time for various (or mysterious) reasons. Or, if you have the time and ability, go even further and allow the player to actually join the mages as a free agent or even learn spells from them to enhance his arsenal like invisibility spells or 'silent step' spells.

[Ishtvan]

We're not actively trying to flesh out the setting storyline right now. Our first priority is on getting the toolset done sometime in the foreseeable future so that potential FM authors can flesh out their own storylines with a working toolset.

[ZylonBane]

How about instead of Keepers, you have the opposite-- Criers. They make sure there aren't ANY secrets!

[bob_arctor]

Mmm. Could call them anything. Keepers is just a vague word. Doesn't mean much. It's not actually much good anyway.

 

Just The Brotherhood. The Guild. The Assassins (change the theme to like the assassins in Oblivion). The Nameless even.

[Springheel]

Our goal isn't to make a carbon copy of everything in the Thief universe. We already have a mage model, and at least one AI model with a robe and hood. Any FM author that wants Keepers can simply use those.

[spix's circlet]

You don't even need to have Keeper-esque characters in a campaign. For instance, your thief could be a (ex-)member of a Guild / Faction. Maybe better perhaps as well: another city somewhere else in the Thief landscape. I've always have difficulty trying to understand copyright issues; esp. here, things get shadowy like the game itself. Nonetheless it is possible I think to have an alternative Thief world... kinda odd considering Thief is an über alternative of our own. I guess it demonstrates the depth of it all.

[sparhawk]

Understanding copyright (or right in general) is pretty simple. The one with more money wins.