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You are assuming way too much, and you're creating artificial pressure. Nobody in the public forums knows whether TDM team even considered including this feature in TDM core, regardless of its completion state or quality. Obviously you have right to have a personal opinion on the modification itself (which I think is cool too). Sorry for the offtopic here Jivo, you're doing great, and don't let this little side note distract you from your work

@stgatilov Even better news! The following commit fixed this issue regardless of r_tonemapOnlyGame3d setting. r10930 | stgatilov | 2025-01-25 | 7 lines Clear background during main menu. This fixes the issue e.g. with AT1: Lucy and tonemap disabled. The briefing there does not use any backgrounds, and no-clear policy results in HOM-like effects. Originally reported here: https://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?/topic/22635-beta-testing-213/#findComment-499723

Keep it simple, yet descriptive: Stick to a hidden "Normal" Hold-Frob duration, at least for the first release. Collect feedback. Adjust or add options when required, not before.

One of the first things I did when 2.12 was out was to code shouldering on hold-frob here, locally. I have been using my ad-hoc executable ever since with zero issues. What troubles me to this day is that you people never got to test other shouldering alternatives. Sure, @stgatilov provided the double click but it was quickly discarded because this approach is rarely found in games. In the end, we were forced to choose between Thief-like or nothing: no wonder this topic quickly turned into such a heated discussion. The second thing that troubles me is how easily body manipulation was discarded. Sure, not many games have such fine control over bodies but, doesn't that alone make body manipulation unique and special in our game? Body manipulation is unusable in its current version, in my humble opinion. Such a loss. We were told further changes might make it into 2.13 and I have been patiently waiting but months went by and I haven't heard anything therefore please find attached to this post my game/Player.cpp. It was made for 2.12 but can be easily ported to newer versions of TDM. I have just added some comments to the file. Look for my name for the changes. Please note I will not be providing an executable. This isn't the purpose of my post and you need to build the solution yourself if you want to try it. The purpose of my post is to say that nothing is impossible and we can have everything, and I remain available to assist if there ever is the will to complete this, half-baked initiative. Player.cpp

TDM Modpack v4.2 Introducing Fragile Bottles and the Ring Helper mods. -:- FRAGILE BOTTLES MOD -:- What can I say, no stealth game is complete without some good bottle smashing! There are hundreds and hundreds of bottles in our mission catalogue: go to your nearest kitchen, take a bottle and throw it to distract AI, extinguish fires... Please note the Fragile Bottles mod is tightly integrated into the Core Essentials. Availability: All mission except for few items in A Reputation to Uphold and Shadows of Northdale ACT I & ACT II. Topic: Breakable throwables Thanks @MirceaKitsune for bringing this good idea back! Please note this mod has been possible thanks to the previous efforts by other community members. -:- RING HELPER MOD -:- The official Frob Helper becomes active when small objects are within range and this new modded Helper expands the functionality to objects of all sizes, large and small. In addition, the default white dot has been replaced with a ring-shaped aimer, which I find more suitable for exploration games. The Ring Helper is by no means perfect but instead of explaining/justifying each little detail I leave it to you to experience it first hand and determine what works and what doesn't. Let us know your opinion here or in this topic: Frob Helper discussion. The Ring Helper respects the options available in Gameplay > General > Show Frob Helper but there are some changes: Always: Pointer and Ring Hover: Ring delayed by zero seconds Fade In: Ring delayed by one second Fade In Fast: Ring delayed by half second No: Off As you can see, Hover, Fade In and Fade In Fast are essentially the same thing, the difference lies in the delay before the Ring appears. Oh, the mandatory screenshot The download can be found in the opening post. I hope you have fun with these new mods. Full change log: • v4.2 New release - CORE ESSENTIALS - FRAGILE BOTTLES: Initial release. - RING HELPER: Initial release. - SKILL UPGRADE - COMBINATION: New shadow effect for the dark arrow. - SIMPLE SUBTITLES: Fonts updated to version 20240520 (Geep). - Modpack: Minor internal adjustments. Cheers!

This is false. The quick-press frob action never happens before or after the long-press frob action. The single-click action always happens before the double-click action. You stated the following about double-click: Long-press frob to extinguish a candle never moves it. Double-click frob to extinguish a candle always moves it slightly. Therefore, long-press frob works well for ghost players whereas double-click frob does not.

I'd hardly call it a mod, if the functionality is already there and it's merely about presenting the settings in a different way. Anyway, I already said that I basically concur and that I would ideally like to see an extra accessibility settings GUI for all related features: frob helper, head bob, more subtle mantle animations, you name it... Still, your reasoning is kind of wrong because the intention of the frob helper was not to detect frobably objects, but to help the player aim on small frobable objects. The "Always On" feature unconditionally helps the player aim, so this does not conflict with the intention of the frob helper at all.

I see this differently: When you short frob a candle, you can move it in the world. Then you do the special operation, long frob or use, to extinguish it. With a body it was the same: When you short frob it, you can move it in the world. Then you do the special operation, long frob or use, to shoulder it. Your current solution is counterintuitive to that and it also looks much too fast because of this! Can you add a variable to turn that behaviour around? Or could this be done by editing a script or something? Also wasn't long frob supposed to be used to unshoulder a body now, which again is counterintuitive to the short frob shouldering behaviour?

William Steele 1: In the North, Build 2.10 Can't frob a particular AI's loot, not sure if this is a known issue on map or engine error. Better safe than sorry.

I just tested the Windows version that was uploaded on the latest 1.12 rc, but I get confusing results. Like when I frob a candle with holder, short frob will take it and long frob will extinguish it. When frobing a body it's the other way around though, short frob will shoulder it and long frob will take it. Short frob on the latter also gives the impression that the body is shouldered very quickly! I suggest to swap this and fix both issues in one go.

I always tweak the tdm_frobhelper_ignore_size such that it is enabled for all object sizes as well because I prefer it that way. However, back when I implemented this feature, it was common feedback that it shouldn't be enabled for big objects like doors etc. because it was intended to help frobbing small objects, i.e., it was not supposed to be an interaction indicator, which we already had in the frob-highlight. The reasoning for this feature still stands today, so I don't see how this qualifies as madness. The "Always On" feature has indeed been added as an accessibility feature as it supposedly helps some people with motion sickness, and since there were now already multiple options, I also added the "fade-in fast"-option because I felt the delay of the usual fade-in was so long that the frob helper wasn't really that helpfull in more hectic situations. Accessibility features should by definition never be hidden, so I would not remove the "Always On"-option. In fact, I would actually like to see an extra options page only listing accessibility options. On that page, we could then of course also add a checkmark-option to enable frob helper only for small objects.

I'm thinking along the same lines. For the issue in the bugtracker here the solution is described as: To me it would make more sense to swap the two triggers for bodies. That way * "Frob" would mean "grab and hold object in front of you", and "Frob" again would mean "release" consistently for all three objects. * "Hold frob" would mean "interact" (="shoulder"/"unshoulder", "extinguish", "eat") consistently for all objects. And if "unshoulder" required "Hold frob" it would reduce the risk of unintentionally un-shouldering bodies when trying to operate doors. I may be missing something here...

Moved this topic from development forums, since it covers a potentially important behavior change in 2.13. Luckily, its important is countered by the rarity of such complicated materials. I hope that this change has not broken existing materials. And even if it had broken any, we will be able to fix them manually...

And for some pointers, read the following topic: https://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?/topic/22533-tdm-for-diii4a-support-topic/

Cleaning Up the Neighborhood by some1stoleit, bikerdude Brief Description: A small-medium sized assassination mission, taking place in a bar and casino environment with streets surrounding the bar. Story: Crime is out of control in my neighbourhood, when thugs attacked my wife I decided I can no longer stand by idly. Unable to rely on the corruptible city watch and the aloof Builders, I must take matters into my own hands. My first target is a bar called the Scoundrel’s Rest which is not far from my home. It’s owned by a man named Godfrey and considered neutral ground to the various criminal factions inhabiting the city district. There is no doubt its presence attracts criminals towards my neighbourhood, contributing to the infestation of crime. Infiltrating the bar not only creates the opportunity to kill Godfrey and shut it down for good but also allows me to find information about the rest of criminal groups that inhabit my neighbourhood. I gave my thieving days when I met my wife, but for her sake I must take up the profession once more and prowl in the shadows again. Notes/Tips: Your lock picks are noticeably old, so you can’t rely on them to get you past every door. Examine the environment and keep an eye out for keys on pockets.If you see a pipe outside, chances are you can climb up it.On Rusty and Practiced difficulty settings there's a map available for the bar’s ground level and the street surrounding it.It should be possible to ghost the every area in the mission. A small amount of loot however may be difficult or impossible to acquire without knockouts.There are a few hidden optional objectives you can discover. Screenshots Download Mirrors: https://www.dropbox.com/s/rbiashq1c1k56ns/Cleaning%20Up%20the%20Neighbourhood%20v1.0.zip?dl=0 https://mega.nz/#!bMtgiSra!Y1KXGovfYfdtG1xxRkmPYndLxgq7wMNVr8oENnS2Qxg FAQ: I dislike when I get stuck on an FM and have to leave the game to scroll through forums to find out what to do. I think the mission should be straightforward enough to beat without answers, but I will provide a FAQ if it’s needed. Just be sure to give a good try working it out yourself before reading this. Thanks: I’ve found the TDM community very welcoming and helpful as a new member and would like to thank several people. Bikerdude, for allowing me to collobarate with him and showing me a different way to build maps from scratch in Dark Radiant, as well as many other mapping techniques.Resources:Springheel, for his Modules and his retroactive permission to use New Job street segments.Amadeus, for doing some proofreading of the briefing and readables.Obsttorte, for his objective checking script used for one of the optional objectives.Rsoul, for creating new internal version of architecture models.Beta Testers:Amadeus, Cambridge Spy, Abusimplea, Shadow, Boiler’s_hiss, nbohr1more, Springheel, JudithPeople who helped Answer my Questions:Destined, JackFarmerSpecial thanks to Sotha and Springheel whose video tutorial series give me the guidance and confidence to start using Dark Radiant.I apologise if I missed anyone, if I missed you please do contact me and I’ll credit you appropriately. About the Development: Initially this was a solo developed mission made by myself, upon some beta testing I agreed to make the mission collaboration with Bikerdude, with the intention to learn good mapping practices from the collaboration. The mission was redesigning using the same layout as the original but using Springheel’s modules instead of my very simple brushwork, and expanded in scope to include a more detailed street, a canal, a sewer and a rooftop segments. Bikerdude’s use of springheel modules and custom skins is mostly responsible for the beautiful visuals, with my contribution being the layout of areas and the writing. Known Issues: None at the moment.

Snatcher and myself argued for ages to make shouldering long frob, but as this was completely blocked and the issue for me at least is consistency, I now would like to have the other special actions fit to the shouldering scheme. As you said, from the new perspective of a new default, short frob should extinguish any lights and eat any food. - Bodies: short > shoulder, long > move - Lights: short > extinugish, long > move - Consumables: short > eat, long > move - Loot and items: short > take, long > multi take (this was always different to the others) This leaves all other physical items for which short frob means moving, which could also be helpful in the sense that if you short frob something and it is moved, it has no special action.

Hi, I finally had some time to get back into TDM, but encountered a bizarre issue in that I'm no longer able to pick up (frob) items. I can still open doors, toggle switches, but the items just never light up for me to pick up Specifically, the first mission I tried was "Shadows of Northdale ACT I", and after entering the shop I couldn't actually pick up anything to buy. Then went back to the home, behind the painting are several item that also cannot be picked up. See the attached screenshot from the save game. It might be a real noob issue, it's been a while since I last tried TDM, but played it a lot some years ago. Maybe it's a FM-specific issue, so I tried also "Dragon's Claw" but not sure if I've encountered any items I should be able to pick up yet. I'm trying to think of an old FM where there's some items at the very start I could test with. I use a custom controller config through XPadder, so my first idea was that it was broken, but the same happens using just RMB for frob. I run Windows 10 at 150% scaling, and some older games have problems with this, so I disabled scaling for the TDM exe, but no help. I also have a triple-monitor setup (TV, two regular screens), but that's never caused an issue in TDM before. I'm running TDM at 1920x1080 on the TV. I run "TheDarkModx64.exe" but I also tried the regular "TheDarkMod.exe". One thing I've not tried is a complete reinstall of TDM, I might try that later as well. Other possibly relevant information: OS Name Microsoft Windows 10 Pro (version 20H2) Version 10.0.19042 Build 19042 Processor Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-4790K CPU @ 4.00GHz, 4001 Mhz, 4 Core(s), 8 Logical Processor(s) Installed Physical Memory (RAM) 16,0 GB Adapter Type GeForce GTX 970, NVIDIA compatible TDM is installed at "f:\Games\Darkmod" Any ideas? I just hope I'm not being a total noob here...

Regarding a slider for the "Hold Frob to Use" setting, my main concern is that players would have trouble knowing what it represents and what a good value would be for them. Sliders are pretty good for things that require fine tuning to a small degree, such as mouse sensitivity or head bob. But the hold-frob delay doesn't seem to require that level of precision. For a while, I played with a display that showed how long I pressed frob. I very rarely went over 350 while trying to be slow on purpose. I was usually at 80-180. Sometimes I'd make a mistake and hit 230-280. With hold-frob delay, three values -- 200, 300, 400 -- are likely enough to cover most players. A delay of 300 by default, 200 for those who want it more responsive, and 400 for those who want it slower. Given that, how about using presets with descriptive names in the tooltip and UI options? Quick, Normal, Slow: the delay before performing an alternate interaction when holding down the (frob/interact) key. Disabled: Original TDM behavior. With hidden delay values: Quick - 200 Normal - 300 Slow - 400 This will save the player from having to overthink it. If they are having trouble, they can choose the slower one. If they are frustrated by it being slow, they can choose the faster one.

We do these things not because they are easy but because they are hard fun! TDM Modpack v4.5 We have a new skill in the family and in this new version of the Modpack I have split the skills into two categories: Adept: Peek, Blow & Ignite and Whistle Expert: Alchemy, Loop and Penumbra You may opt for one skillset, the other, both or none: Each skill is still delivered in its own standalone package and the pk4 have been renamed to reflect the actual name of the skill. That's for you, @uyvie ! --------------------------------------------------- LOOP SKILL Teleport on demand! The first time you use the skill it will remember your current location and nothing else happens. The next time you use the skill it will remember your current location AND it will teleport you back to the previous location. You can reset the Loop by holding the "Use" key for 10 seconds. Here are some ideas: Initiate the loop at the beginning of the mission in case you want or need to backtrack Explore two different areas in parallel Establish a point of interest you can quickly and easily go back to anytime: a safe room, a shop, high ground... Run away from AI, avoid the cool down period and carry on with your business Ambush AI Anything else you can think of Limitations I haven't figured out how to force the player to crouch and this means you cannot teleport if there isn't enough vertical space in case you teleport back in standing position. Forget about teleporting in tight spaces such as vents, at least for now. In this initial release I have been very conservative and in order to minimize risks the skill can get at times a little annoying: you cannot be too close to walls or any other potential obstacle. Depending on the feedback received we can take some risks and make the skill more responsive. We will see. Summing up, whenever you hear the "hmm", it is either because there isn't enough vertical space or you are too close to a wall or obstacle. Points of failure There are certain situations in which the loop may fail: If you try to teleport to a location that is occupied by AI the jump will be aborted. You can try again later. If you try to teleport to a location that is occupied by an object the skill will do its best to overcome the obstacle. Sometimes you must try a few times to clear the destination. There are some edge cases though that are unsolvable and you may very well get stuck. If you are unable to teleport you can break the loop by holding "Use" for 10 seconds. This action resets the loop and it cannot be undone. This new skill is far from perfect but it gets the job done and hopefully, it brings a fun new mechanic to the game and adds replayability value. --------------------------------------------------- STEALTH MONITOR Updated... The STEALTH MONITOR mod displays the stealth stats and it has been made persistent. This means that if you switch from Loot to Stealth it will never revert to Loot unless you trigger the action. --------------------------------------------------- DYNAMIC INVENTORY Revisited... When picking up loot the DYNAMIC INVENTORY mod displays the loot info in the inventory and shortly after reverts back to the last non-loot item selected. This old mod has now been rebuilt outside of a file often - wrongly - employed by mission authors [tdm_frobactions.script] and this means that the mod is now available in all missions. ...and Extended In the core game when unshouldering a body the inventory is cleared for good. This can break the flow in some situations and the functionality of the DYNAMIC INVENTORY mod has been extended and when unshouldering bodies the mod will now revert back to the last item selected. Just enable CORE ESSENTIALS and you are good to go. --------------------------------------------------- Speaking of... CORE ESSENTIALS For some reason few doors in the core game have, by default, a shorter frob distance than all the rest. What puzzles me is that we are not talking doors that one may consider "special", but perfectly normal, regular, standard doors. Do arms get shorter when manipulating some doors? Players get used to certain distances and this breaks the flow in some missions and it has been resolved in CORE ESSENTIALS. Mappers can change frob distances wherever they please (players shall judge their decisions) but I find it unacceptable that something like this comes by default. The subjects in question are: arched01_111x40_left arched01_111x40_right 3panel_104x56 door_96x48_2hinge02 6panel_104x56 stained_glass01_104x56 stained_glass01_118x52 Why do you make such a big point for seven doors, you ask? Because as of today there are more than a thousand instances of these doors in the mission catalogue. Please note this is also fixed in the Unofficial Patch but since there are no boundaries between the Modpack and the Patch it has been fixed here as well. --------------------------------------------------- I hope you have fun with this new version of the TDM Modpack. Cheers!

The latest dev build (dev16629-10139) contains some changes regarding frob highlight. The full explanation is given in 5427. Most importantly, the material stages are now generated by default if they are missing. The core materials will be cleaned accordingly in near future. Also we added new syntax for customizing frob-highlight in simple cases. First of all, you can set frob-highlight with custom texture (e.g. it can be specular map) and arbitrary coefficients: frobstage_texture textures/darkmod/sfx/whiteglass2 0.25 0.5 Since diffuse texture is used in most materials, here is a shortcut for it: frobstage_diffuse 0.1 0.35 The first number is the multiplier applied to texture, and the second number is the amount of white color added. You can also make non-white multiplier or addition by putting three numbers in parentheses, e.g.: frobstage_diffuse (0.15 0.35 0.15) 0.4 Of course, the most recommended approach is to not write any frob text, in which case frobstages are added implicitly as "frobstage_diffuse 0.15 0.4". The implicit frobstages are added only if there are no frobstages specified explicitly. If you want to suppress implicit generation of frobstages (not recommended), you can write: frobstage_none Finally, if you want to make something special and customizations listed above are not enough, then you can just write frobstages the old way via parm11 parameter. The old frob-highlight stages should continue to work properly. If you write frobstages manually, please follow the rules (or you'll get warnings): Start every frobstage exactly with if (parm11 > 0) condition. Do not mention parm11 outside frobstages. P.S. Here is previous discussion of frob highlight, in case anyone is interested:

Announcing the Release of 'Requiem' for The Dark Mod! Download Download the latest version of the Dark Mod here: http://www.thedarkmo...wnload-the-mod/ Download the mission here: Mediafire: http://www.mediafire...u89/requiem.pk4 Southquarter: http://www.southquar...ons/requiem.pk4 Fidcal.com: http://www.fidcal.co...ons/requiem.pk4 Create a folder in your Dark Mod install with the path "darkmod/fms/requiem" and place the downloaded .pk4 file inside. When you load up The Dark Mod, the mission will appear on the "New Mission" page. Requiem can also be found directly using the in-game loader. Gameplay Notes While this mission is playable in TDM 1.8, for an optimal experience please download and play in TDM 2.0 (or higher). Most inventory items in the game can be dropped, so no need to carry them around after they are no longer of any use. Note that If you use noclip or other console commands while playing, there is a good chance that you will break the intended flow of gameplay. Credits Mapping and Readables: Gelo R. Fleisher Voice Acting: Goldwell Additional scripting: Obsttorte Additional textures and assets: Flanders, Sotha, Grayman, Springheel, Bikerdude, Obsttorte Additional map optimizations: Bikerdude Testers: Bikerdude, Obsttorte, Gnartsch, AluminumHaste, Baal, nbohr1more, PPoe Custom Soundtrack: Leonardo Badinella - http://leonardobadinella.com/ Additional Music: Lee Rosevere - http://freemusicarch...c/Lee_Rosevere/ Marianne Lihannah - http://www.funeralsinger.net/ Vox Vulgaris - http://www.last.fm/music/Vox+Vulgaris/ A note from the author Hi all. While I've been involved in indie game development for a while now, I'm first and foremost a writer. My most recent project has been a novella that tries to capture the visual feel and tone of the Thief series (you can find the link below). As I was writing, I found myself playing a lot of Thief and Dark Mod fan missions, and got to thinking that maybe I wanted to make one myself, as a companion piece to the book. When I finished up writing, I had a bit of down time and decided to take the plunge. Having never done any serious mapping before, my plan was to make a small mission that I could bang out in a month or two and call it a day. Well, as sometimes happens, the project got a little bit bigger than I had planned. Ten months, and lots of elbow grease later, Requiem is finally ready for you to play. I'd like to thank everyone who helped pitch in to help make Requiem come alive, from those who took the time to answer my many questions on the forums to those who actively contributed to the FM. I especially want to thank Bikerdude who served as my mapping mentor, and Obsttorte whose clever scripts really turned what was in my head into the game that you are playing. Above all, I want to thank you for downloading and playing Requiem; I hope you enjoy it. Links of Interest Author's Blog: http://gfleisher.blogspot.com/ Companion Novella (Amazon): http://www.amazon.co...k/dp/B00BYEW02M Companion Novella (Smashwords): http://www.smashword...oks/view/298956

I played both test versions with "The Bakery Job" and as everybody could guess, I like stgatilov's version better because it is consistent. I don't see why daft's version should be more intuitive, especially as shouldering bodies and extinguishing lights are working in opposite ways. Still I believe that without a tutorial or key binding hint, no new players will discover either version on their own as double-frob and long-frob are not used elsewhere. stgatilov, is it possible to make both double-frob and long-frob work in your version? Also to really make this consistent, could you add eating food on double frob too, please?

That is incorrect. Multiloot is still click and hold to loot. It's a compromise, and that compromise is only for moveable light sources. It gives players a way to extinguish a candle without picking it up first, reducing steps. And, it gives players who ghost the ability to extinguish it without moving it. The point I was trying to make is that holding frob to perform an action is common. Multiloot happens while holding frob. Dragging a body happens while holding frob. Extinguishing a candle happens while holding frob. As another example, some missions have a wheel (switch) that opens a gate. While the player holds frob, the wheel turns, opening the gate more and more. I'm not sure if there is a TDM mission with one, but there are Thief missions that do. There's hold "attack" or "use" button to throw objects farther. There's hold "manipulate" button to rotate objects.

After some feedback, I changed the candle and lantern behavior to pick up on frob and extinguish on long-press frob. Candle holders without candles required a long-press frob to pick up. That didn't feel right. Pros of this change: More consistent: frob always picks up items, candles, and bodies. Long-press acts like a special action: drag for bodies, extinguish for candles. Bonus: long-press frob to extinguish feels like pinching out a candle. @AluminumHaste Could you please update the build again?