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checkDurationsinSRT is now available: checkDurationsInSRT.exe checkDurationsInSRT.cpp This Win/console program scans a directory for .srt files, reporting on each in turn. It warns about those subtitle phrases(aka messages) that are potentially too short or too long in time, or that seem to require too high a reading rate, expressed in characters per second (cps). It also looks for within-file subtitle messages that overlap in time. Invocation: checkDurationsInSRT -l lowerBound [default is 1.0 sec] -u upperBound [default is 6.0 sec] -c maxCPS [default is 17] -d dirWithSrtFiles [default is current dir] -o output file [default is stdout] For more, run with -h or ? options, or see comments in the C++ source code file. EDIT: The above links now access a May 6, 2023 update, that corrects a significant error in character counting for the cps calculation. In addition, if a given subtitle's cps is too high, the warning now includes a suggestion: "try x.xxx seconds". That says what longer duration would be needed to achieve the target cps. How or whether than longer duration could be achieved is left up to you.

@stgatilov, I started to apply the inline "-x" option for extra time to a vocal set, but then realized that I needed to know better how it worked, in order to choose appropriate values. So some questions: 1) Does the inline -x work... a) the same for "story" and "speech" verbosities b) differently If (b), the next questions will need to be answered twice. I'm going to state these in mathematical terms, summarizing the behavior of the algorithm and reflecting the order in which values are combined. All variables are in seconds. c = length of a given sound clip x = inline -x value for extra time. Should be positive. Zero if not given. d = calculated length of subtitle duration L = global giving a lower bound on subtitle duration. Default is 1.0 X = global giving an extension to subtitle duration. Default is 0.2 U = global giving an upper bound on X. Default is 5.0 2) When there is no value of x, which equation describes the algorithm's behavior? a) d = max(c,L) + min(X,U) b) d = max(c+min(X,U),L) 3) When there is a valid value of x, the equation becomes... a.1) d = max(c,L) + min(X,U) + x a.2) d = max(c+x,L) + min(X,U) a.3) d = max(c,L) + min(X+x,U) b.1) d = max(c+min(X,U),L) + x b.2) d = max(c+x+min(X,U),L) b.3) d = max(c+min(X+x,U),L) Thanks for help with this.

The real St. Alban was a pagan who became a celebrated religious personality, this All Saints Day 2010 The Dark Mod places its own spin on this mythical figure. Screenshots: Intro: "'Business' has been slow lately, even more so after most of my gear got snatched during a Watch raid... I've since been forced to hit the streets and pick pockets for a living. But my luck was about to change, last night I was approached by a red hooded figure with a proposition... As we sat down in a dark corner of a nearby inn, he told to me that the Builders of St. Alban's Cathedral in the Old Quarter had recently unearthed a discovery that might lead to the final resting place of some saint." " But before I do anything, I need to get my tools and stash from the evidence room at the local watch station." "with the hawks, doves will congregate they will drop honey from the cliffs wine will surge over the earth the sheep will wander harmlessly with the wolf then the wicked will rise, but to retribution" - 'scripture of St Alban' There is a new version out now, see the following thread St Albans Cathedral version 1.6 Build Time: about 2-3 months. Thanks:- Huge respect to the Dark Mod team for such a great mod and for all the hard work they put into it and continue to put into it. Special thanks to Fidcal, Serpentine and others for their help on the forums and to Testing:Ugoliant, Baddcog, Grayman, Lost soul, Bjorn and Baal (for doing all the Vp work in the town. Readables: Ungoliant and Mortemdesino for all awesome work on the readables. Resource: Fids, Grayman, Ungoliant - guis, models & images. Misc: Loren Schmidt - the author of the map I based the cathedral on. Info: # Like Thief2, some things are climable, pipes, wall vines etc.. You can also drop some of the keys, some door that are frobbabe mean there is another way inside - explore u taffer! # Due to TDM being a lot more of a resource hog than T2 I have been forced to limit the number of Ai in the mission, but they have better placement than my last mission. # On all difficulty levels the player starts with vertualy no tools/weapons, there are weapons to be found - read, read, read! # For the love of all that is holy, read the briefing otherwise you will problems completing the mission. Known issues:- # This mission will have less than optimal fps at a few points on the map, mid range DX9 card(X1900/GF7800) or higher required. # On low end PCs I recommend, V-sync is off, AA is off, Aniso is 4x or lower and that any and all background apps are closed.

Rather than bundled subtitling themes, I'd like to see more flexible offerings, namely two new Settings for Subtitle Font Size Subtitle Font In the .gui, Subtitle Font size would directly tell the .gui how to scale the font. Together, the two settings could allow the .gui to intelligently adjust the backing fields; some .gui code experimentation would be needed. How about this? This optional parameter, in units of seconds, should be the last one in a line, preceded by a space. Probably doesn't need enclosure in double quotes, but that would be OK if you find it makes parsing easier. Specifying an amount of extra time, rather than the amount of total time, seems safer to me. An ideal format would be 1 digit before the decimal point, up to 3 after it. So typical: 0.1, 0.25, 0.125

Yeah it would be cool to see some more detailed statistics and it’s a shame they aren’t really captured. Since we are talking about fan mission platforms, where players also make the content for the game, I feel like the best thing we’ve got is you can look at the number of content releases for the games. Keep in mind the graph counts campaigns as single missions - so for example NHAT and TBP both count as 1 mission. A good year for TDM has has approaching maybe 50% - mostly we’re 25-30%. https://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=152494 You could also look at the number of ratings thief missions get on https://www.thiefguild.com/ vs TDM ones, but that is pretty iffy in that you could chalk that up to more awareness of the site in the thief community than TDM Out of curiosity is there a reason a thief player can’t be a new player? I kind of think a player is a player and new players would be ones who are playing the dark mod who weren't? Is there disagreement the base of players most likely to pick up the game are fans of the thief games? They are certainly the most fruitful place to find feedback on the game beyond the sphere of this forum that I have seen. When we were trying to finish up SLL there was a lot of discussion on the forums about how long it had been since there was a release for the game. I am thankful that the stats show at least some stability over the years in terms of releases for TDM, but the trend for all of the games is decline. Not doing anything is a valid response if that’s what the devs want to do - it is not possible to provide evidence that any effort will slow that inertia. As a player and content maker I would just prefer trying to find feedback where it is offered from players who were willing to try the game but ultimately could not engage with it and see if there is anything that can be done within reason to ease them into the game. The game has a lot to offer imo. All those players are potential contributors - contributions in turn attract players - it’d be nice to see the cycle go on as long as it can.

I'd like to get back to the request for the ability for the subtitler to extend individual subtitle durations, because that will be affecting how I create my subtitle content. Maybe the previous ideas on this were a bit too code-intensive (e.g., for inline & srt lines in .subs, having an additional parameter; or doing calculations based on wpm). Let me propose yet another, more limited/simple possibility... no new parameters, and no change to inline, but with srt, it would be OK for the last phrase to specify an endtime that exceeds the end of the clip, and the subtitle would be extended to that endtime. (For sanity, there can be a limit to that extension; I believe there's already a proposed global for that purpose.)

I wasn't proposing ever changing the font itself from Carleton, which I agree would be problematic. With respect to scaling the fontsize, if the adjustment process also carefully scales the field dimensions to match, it should not affect (or at least affect little) where auto-wraps occur. And this would further help with low-vision, which seems to me the whole point of the similar size adjustments in the HUD. So "fixed forever"... nah. But "fixed for the next bunch of official releases"... sure. For now, what I very much want is a policy on the maximum number of characters on a subtitle line. Then, a fontsize and fieldwidth can be determined that support that nicely, while minimizing corner overlap. As a first draft, I proposed: 42 characters max current fontsize: SUBTITLES_TEXT_SCALE 0.25 fieldwidth of 320 This would need more fulsome testing. It may be a slightly smaller fontsize or slightly larger fieldwidth is needed. As to the maximum character limit, if you google "subtitle character limit", you'll see that "about 42" seems most popular, with a range from 37 to 47. It would not be hard to write a program that, for a given FM, looked at all the subtitle lines in the .sub and .srt files and reported any that exceed any maximum number of characters. The FM author could then adjust those strings accordingly. Sure, it's more work, but kinda trivial in the big scheme of getting an FM out. And it is a one-time fix. I'm willing to write such a program, if I knew it would be used. (My Excel template provides the similar functionality that I use at the moment.)

@stgatilov, another problem area is the complete overlap between the inventory pickup message field (just above the breathe bar) and the subtitle fields, particularly the lowest. I think when both a subtitle and pickup message appear, both will be very hard to read. I can think of many solutions. Here's two of the easier ones: when subtitles are on, pickup messages are suppressed, i.e., as if you had set cvar tdm_inv_hud_pickupmessages "0". do away with the pickup message field, and just show pickup messages in the objectives/saved-games message field at top. A variation on (1) would be, when subtitles are on, show pickup messages just as a subtitle with "story" priority e.g.: [acquired 80 in jewels] A variation on (2) would be, keep the pickup message field, but reroute its messages to the objectives message field when subtitles are on. (Hmmm, I forget where trainer messages appear. Is that also a problem?)

I actually tested multiple subtitle editors before sticking to this one. Btw. with the scrollwheel you can move back and forward on the track. With Ctrl + scrollwheel you can zoom in. Also, when you want to edit a subtitle, you first have to click inside the edit subtitle area before you can type, otherwise you get a warning.

Here are the just-made subtitle files. All needed files included in this post as downloads. The first subtitle shows up directly after mission start, so the rest should work as well. I don't know if the debriefing works, but I have to finish the mission to be able to see if it shows. Would be nice if there's a cheet for that. I didn't check the subtitles fully for errors, or misaligning, but they seem good for the most part (needs a bit of editing). Ignore my earlier uploaded srt. Edit: I figured out why the subtitles for the intro video didn't work. Some info in the wiki is explained incorrectly. I reuploaded a correct fm_root.subs . Now the subtitles show up in the intro video. fm_root.subs debrief_audio.srt Voice_009.srt hits_intro.srt

Welcome to the forums Ansome! And congrats on making it to beta phase!

We didn't make the holidays (such a busy time of year) so here's a New Year's gift, an unusual little mission. Window of Opportunity Recover an item for a regretful trader out in a wilderness setting, and discover more! Available within the in-game mission downloader or: Download: http://www.thedarkmo...ndetails/?id=79 Alternative: https://drive.google...WTMzQXZtMVFBSG8 Some unorthodox gameplay on regular/ghost difficulties. (Arachnophobes might prefer short mode...) Please expect to need your lantern in regular and ghost modes! Short ("easy") mode is a smaller map, so if you are looking for areas others reference below, or 100% of the loot, you'll need to play on another mode. I wanted to create my first mission before I became influenced by too many others' ideas, and limited myself to what has been done before. As such, this mission is not set in a city/town, and has some features that are likely to be provocative. There's a section some really like, which others don't, either way I kept it short to not last too long. That being said, I hope you do find it fun! :-) Special thanks to those who provided valuable testing and feedback: Goldwell, Kyyrma, plotzzz, 161803398874989, PPoe & Bikerdude (who also contributed a sound). (Please remember spoiler tags to not expose things meant to be discovered by playing.) Like so: [spoiler]secrets[/spoiler] If you are having trouble finding the main objective, here's what to pay attention to in the mission for hints: There is a spot it's possible to get stuck on the ground in the corner by the cliff/rockfall where there's a rope laying on the ground, please take care if you poke around there!

I have implemented the extension, and seems to work fine (6262). Inline subtitle for a sound of duration = T lasts for max(T + 0.2, 1.0) seconds. This is configurable: 1.0 second minimum taken from this thread, and 0.2 addition was taken from hardcoded delay between actions in conversations. Also I noticed that while I planned subtitles to not move between slots, they indeed do move sometimes. Also, as noticed here, high-level subtitles are not guaranteed to be displayed in presence of many low-level messages. So with 6264, fixed this and I passed more information from sound engine. For instance, now subtitle slots can be reused by having same "emitter"... which is supposedly very close to the concept of "who says this". Also, the original Doom 3 has the following rules which affect subtitles. Every "sound emitter" has a bunch of "sound channels". Conversation sounds go into SND_CHANNEL_VOICE channel, but ordinary barks usually occupy any free channel. One channel can only play one sound at a time. If new sound is started on the same emitter and same channel, then the old sound is stopped and replaced with the new one. The consequence is that no matter how long subtitles show after the sound is over, you'll never see two subtitle messages from the same actor at once: the newer one would replace the older one. But in case of barks it is well possible, since new mesage can take a different channel.

Here's my understanding. There are 3 stacked non-overlapping "slots" for a subtitle field to appear in. You can see this in the testSubtitles FM if you hit any of the buttons fast enough. (Granted, this is all in the same voice, not different voices.) When a sound is about to play, the sound system looks for the lowest unused slot to put its field in. And it keeps that field until the sound clip ends (e.g., across multiple srt phrases). If a sound starts playing and there's no slot free, then no subtitle appears for it. Because the sound system currently doesn't know who/what emits a sound, it can't "reserve" a slot for a particular AI or other entity across separate .ogg files. Even without knowing the emitting entity, what the subtitle system could do now (but doesn't currently) is look at the standardized pathname of the sound file, and determine what vocal set it comes from. It could then "reserve" a slot for a while for future utterances from the same voice. Is that a good idea? Unclear to me. (There's a broader issue here about giving priority to "story" phrases over "speech" phrases. I'll move this to the Future thread.) Later in the year, when more bark subtitles for different voices are in 2.12dev, it should be possible to just drop your player into a room of miscellaneous AI and fill up those 3 slots big time.

Beta 11 Fix finished-on state auto-update was unreliable Slighty improve scanner title/author detect Tags are now named some whatever regular-version-looking thing to force GitHub to put the newest at the top

Could well be, but there's lots of ways that could go. You had some good suggestions for automatically adjusting vertical locations and field widths, on the assumption that the subtitle font size remains fixed. But maybe that assumption needs to be revisited. Certainly the current subtitle font size is bigger than the fonts with the weapon and inventory icons, so maybe it doesn't need to made greatly enlargable to address needs of low-vision folks. The automatic adjustment you suggested would also be different from other HUD settings, that are (mostly) manual and independent of other elements. Maybe there should be subtitle positioning sliders. I dunno. I worry that moving the subtitles still further towards the center of screen (particularly when 3 fields are active) would make the game unplayable. Making the fields narrower than at present I can certainly see. Possibly only as wide as their text (another form of automatic adjustment), as I mentioned earlier. I expect most everyone would agree with you and wish HTML-style font markup was available throughout TDM. The problem is, it would be such a major effort, since the engine doesn't support such font markup (and underlying font attributes and rendering) currently. Still, maybe it's time to add that as an "aspirational" feature request to the bug tracker.

It would be nice if, from the main menu (presumably under Settings/Audio, where "Subtitles" currently lives), one could have an additional option, "Subtitle Font", with choices: Carleton Carleton, Wide Stone Stone, Wide where "Carleton, Wide" and "Stone, Wide" are the uncompressed fonts, and "Carleton" and "Stone" are the width-compressed fonts. All with the 0.25 scale factor, so in effect 12 pt. (This avoids the concern raised earlier than allowing an arbitrary scale factor to be user-set would result in raggedy-ass text characters.) Further, change the default from "Carleton, Wide" to "Carleton". This choice would be appropriately passed to gui's through a global string. EDIT: This relates to bugtracker 6283

My idea is that the game engine chooses box size automatically. It means that someone (e.g. me) will have to see where to take width calculate from in the C++ code, and add corresponding logic to subtitle integration code. It's not like we run some script once and then live with hardcoded settings in .subs files forever.

Here it is: calcStringWidth.exe - Oct. 11, 2023 Release. Calculates the display width of a input string, for 4 candidate subtitle fonts Carleton and Stone, uncompressed and compressed.

Utility program "calcStringWidth" calculates the display width of a single-line input string, in TDM logical pixels, when shown (e.g., as a subtitle) with TDM fonts Carleton and Stone with a 0.25 scale factor, and either uncompressed (as designed for a 4:3 screen) or width-compressed by 0.75 (for a 16:9 screen) calcStringWidth.exe - Windows executable calcStringWidth.cpp - C++ Source code Invoked in the console with: calcStringWidth -s <quoted input string> -o <output file> [default is stdout]

Suppose we had a system like this: "verbosity story" are small width=0 by default "verbosity speech" are small width=1 by default The default of either can be overridden on a per-subtitle basis by using new option "-smallWidth" or "-sw", e.g.: with verbosity story inline "something.ogg" "I've hid the gem in m'lady's knickers." -sw 1 srt "something.ogg" "something.srt" -sw 1 // sw affects all messages of this srt the same with verbosity speech (as an alternative to breaking into individual messages and using srt) inline "yetmore.ogg" "I need to cast that spell tonight after midnight,\nbut once again, my supply of eye-of-newt is sadly depleted." -sw 0 #define FIELD_MARGIN is not anywhere official yet, just in my prototype tdm_subtitles_common.gui, hidden in yesterday's post. The values I show are from my analysis and testing, earlier reported in this thread and/or AI Barks.

Here's a screen shot of an FM I've been building to help test/review subtitles for an AI, in reproducible order with 100% coverage. It uses the TDM-distributed .ogg files, but has custom soundshaders. Each such soundshader wraps exactly one .ogg file, and has a uniform naming that includes an index number. The collection of soundshaders is housed in a single file. The hope is that that (prior to embedment in the FM) this file can be easily generated from a directory listing of the .ogg files for a particular AI, and subsequent manipulation. There are 3 buttons to step through the file. After each button press, you hear the vocal and see the subtitle. Also, briefly the index number within the list appears (a floating "7" near the statue's shoulder in this screenshot.) You can also - using a custom CVar in the console - jump to a particular index number. Unsurprisingly, you can't edit the subtitle within the FM. Just note what needs changing and do it with a text editor. Also, this FM is not intended to evaluate TDM's stock soundshaders, nor AI lip syncing (so just a statue speaking here.) If you hit the buttons fast enough, multiple sound files play at once, and multiple subtitle fields appear (up to the max of 3 the .gui offers)

Hazard Pay has subtitles for in-game conversations. The briefing is a video with text, although its not using the subtitle system.