Why Windows Vista Is Evil

[Springheel]

I actually had my first Vista experience yesterday. A friend of mine got a new computer last month, and it came with Vista already installed (he's not happy about it but isn't computer savvy enough to erase it and install XP).

 

I found the experience of trying to install a couple games on it so frustrating that I actually had a nightmare last night that it somehow got onto my computer!

 

The interface was highly unintuitive and looked cheap. I had to wrestle with it to do basic things. And it was slow as hell on a faster system than mine. Windows kept popping up for programs I hadn't started, and it wanted me to confirm basic operations like starting a program (I thought all the talk about that was exaggerated, but nope!). I actually tried to download the D3 patch 4 times, and first it simply tried to deny me the ability to do it, and then it kept moving or deleting the file when it was finished downloading! I downloaded the patch four times, and each time a little window flashed up briefly that said something about moving the file, and I wasn't able to find it anywhere. I finally gave up!

 

I can't imagine what incentive I'll need to install that piece of crap on my machine.

[oDDity]

It did take them 6 years to squeeze that much crap into it though.

[ascottk]

MS violated some of their guidelines in vista:

http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default....pViolations.asp

 

That's a list of what not to do & here's what they say about what not to do with notifications:

Notifications

 

* Use notifications for events that are unrelated to the current user activity, don't require immediate user action, and users can freely ignore.

* Don't abuse notifications:

o Use notifications only if you need to. When you display a notification, you are potentially interrupting users or even annoying them. Make sure that interruption is justified.

o Use notifications for non-critical events or situations that don't require immediate user action. For critical events or situations that require immediate user action, use an alternative UI element (such as a modal dialog box).

o Don't use notifications for feature advertisements! Exceptions can be made only when the feature is crucial, it applies to the user's current activity, and there is no other way to make the user aware of the feature. If any of these factors don't apply, use another way to make the feature discoverable or do nothing at all.

* Don't try to force users to see your notifications. If users are so immersed in their work that they don't see your notifications, your design is good.

I think a UI for an operating system should be nearly invisible to the user. Are you using the application or the operating system? If you're using the operating system, then the focus is in the wrong place. I'm using Windows 2000 on my PC & that's pretty non-intrusive. My G3 mac is running mac os 10.3 & I really don't think about the operating system the applications are on.

[New Horizon]

I found the experience of trying to install a couple games on it so frustrating that I actually had a nightmare last night that it somehow got onto my computer!

 

That's pretty seriousl I've gotten to the point where I'm only in windows if I'm doing work on the mod or for the folks I design ads for. It's Ubuntu linux for anything else.

[sparhawk]

I heard that vista didn't bother supporting any wireless network protocols prior to G. Another case of laziness, demanding people buy new hardware rather than actually supporting things people still use.

 

It's not laziness it's a marketing decision. When people want to use their "old crap" they get told that this is to old and will not be supported anymore, and they should get an upgrade. Vista is a modern OS so it shouldn't support all this old stuff.

[sparhawk]

I found the experience of trying to install a couple games on it so frustrating that I actually had a nightmare last night that it somehow got onto my computer!

 

 

BTW - there is an easy way, if you don't want to bother installing Vista for testing, but still want to get it's experience. If you have more then one CPU remove all but one. Remove all RAM until you only have 256MB left. 128MB is even better. Then load Xemacs in the background and MS Office 2007. Every now and then press randomly on the reset button. And lust but not least, make your Swapfile so big that 200MB are left to work with on your HDD.

 

I actually tried to download the D3 patch 4 times, and first it simply tried to deny me the ability to do it, and then it kept moving or deleting the file when it was finished downloading! I downloaded the patch four times, and each time a little window flashed up briefly that said something about moving the file, and I wasn't able to find it anywhere. I finally gave up!

 

Sounds like a very secure and protective operating system. If you can't find your files, because they are hidden away or deleted, then you can not run accidently some malware.

 

I can't imagine what incentive I'll need to install that piece of crap on my machine.

 

Windows Vista was not designed to be installed on ones own system. It was designed to be installed on other's systems. That's why it contains so many DRM features.

[Crispy]

Windows Vista was not designed to be installed on ones own system. It was designed to be installed on other's systems.

 

One day we'll find out that Bill Gates actually runs Linux. Then I will laugh so hard that my brain will shoot out of my nostrils.

[thelvyn]

At this rate one or two more versions of windows and everyone will flee screaming to Linux.

When will they learn that users neither want nor need all this DRM crap for instance. They are selling out to the media conglomerates that want to have a steady stream of our cash as they not only overcharge us for music/videos but continually RECHARGE us for the SAME media we already paid them for.

 

If only game companies would all target Linux as well you would have probably millions of more linux users almost overnight.

 

Games are the only thing that keeps me running windows at all.

 

A funny thing happened to me. Years ago I was big into Linux and stayed away from windows if I could help it.

Some friends of mine in the IT industry convinced me that the money was to be made with windows and not Linux (or Unix in general). This was before windows 95 actually. Dos/Linux and OS/2 were my bag,

Now most of them are Unix Administrators. Go figure.

[sparhawk]

LOL. It's similar with me. I switched to Linux completely a few years ago. The biggest problems where the games though. And since I started to work on the mod, I use Windows now mostly again, because this is what I mostly do at home. Well, I could work on the mod on Linux as well, but the problem is, that I haven't found any good programmers IDE. K3B has some disadvantages, but I guess I will try Eclipse next time. Developing is much easier and comfortable on Windows. Maybe it just needs consequently getting used to, I don't know.

[OrbWeaver]

K3B has some disadvantages, but I guess I will try Eclipse next time. Developing is much easier and comfortable on Windows. Maybe it just needs consequently getting used to, I don't know.

 

I guess you mean KDevelop -- K3B is a CD burning application. I use Eclipse because (1) it is fairly full-featured and polished, although the C++ support is not as good as Java (no real command-completion, lack of proper indexing/refactoring setc), and (2) it is cross platform, so I get exactly the same interface on both Linux and Windows.

 

It's not perfect, but I haven't found a better alternative so far.

[sparhawk]

I guess you mean KDevelop -- K3B is a CD burning application.

 

Uh! Yes, of course.

 

I use Eclipse because (1) it is fairly full-featured and polished, although the C++ support is not as good as Java (no real command-completion, lack of proper indexing/refactoring setc), and (2) it is cross platform, so I get exactly the same interface on both Linux and Windows.

 

No autocompletion? Not even for data structures and such? That sucks.

 

It's not perfect, but I haven't found a better alternative so far.

 

I have only used it for java so far, and it's great to work with. Never tried it for C++ though.

[OrbWeaver]

No autocompletion? Not even for data structures and such? That sucks.

 

It's supposed to, but it doesn't always work. It seems to be totally random whether it finds a completion or not, even if you are typing a variable name from the same file.

[Maximius]

All this techno terror talk has me trembling with trepidation...

 

In a boiled down way, can someone tell me how hard it would be to go over to another OS or a dual system. This Vista sounds bad. Is this something a pro should handle or could I do it?

[sparhawk]

It mainly depends on what apps you want to have. If you use Linux Kubuntu, the initial installation is pretty complete with office and everything. Blender is also available for Linux, if you want to switch to that.

[SneaksieDave]

Possibly more fuel for the fire? Someone at worked linked this:

 

http://www.trnicely.net/misc/vista.html

[sparhawk]

Don't knof if this is really a big deal. If it is ONLY for gcc, it might be suspicious. If it is indeed because of DPMI then it should affect other programs as well. In that case I would say "Isn't it time to upgrade a little bit?" DOS compatibillity shouldn't really be a problem anymore, and if you need such an app, then wy run it under Vista?

[Order of the Hammer Bureaucrat]

You likely have already seen this, but here's another Microsoft OS:

http://www.mslinux.org/

[Nyarlathotep]

I'm glad that's just a joke. *Shudder*

[thelvyn]

Its not the upgrade process thats at fault. What I mean is there are some legitimate reasons for using this type of code. If it has to run on older machines for example. Fact is its just another contrived reason to force people to upgrade. Microsoft is good at doing that. Introduce incompatibility's so older software wont work.

They revise the software to work on the new os. Guess what now it doesn't work on the older ones anymore.

Now people have to upgrade to use their software.

Hope this makes sense im really tired.

 

And is that really a joke ? Isn't that basically what novell and microsoft getting into bed together portends ?

Embrace, extend, destroy.

[Domarius]

Possibly more fuel for the fire? Someone at worked linked this:

 

http://www.trnicely.net/misc/vista.html

What if you run the same app under DosBox instead? It's an emulator, which is actually a Windows app, and what it does under its guise, windows couldn't possibly know.

 

It's the only good way to run any DOS apps anyway.

[SneaksieDave]

Just ran into this on digg and thought I'd link it here. A huge conglomerate post of references on current opinions (consumers, tech media, etc.) of Vista (I must admit, from using it at work it's not that bad; I still like it better than MacOS, which I pretty much loathe, though some portion of that is surely a familiarity thing):

 

http://www.microsplot.com/news/2007/12/any...t_windows_vista

 

Ouch!

 

XP's not going away anytime soon. So Microsoft, about that DX10 support...?

[Domarius]

People forget that the same thing happened for all the other major OS upgrades - DOS to Windows 3.1, and from there to Windows 95 - each time, the OS had no use until a year or so later, when bugs were ironed out (and bad design desicions changed), and finally things started making use of the extra functionality.

 

It's no surprise people will be using XP for a while yet.

 

I definetly refuse to upgrade untill it becomes absolutely nessecary - when the stuff I want to do, requires Vista - but that makes it no different from any other OS upgrade I've done in the past.

[jdude]

I'm not sure what exactly MS is hoping to accomplish with their latest software packages [MS office 07 and Vista]. All my profs use MS office 03, because 07 runs to slow, and they don't understand the weird way everything is setup. The layout was easier in my opinion in 03 than in 07, I don't like having all these drop down lists and tabs ect ect. As for Vista, my brother switched to vista, and he actually switched back to XP, he isn't one to be persuaded to do something like that to easily, but after going back to XP he said everything runs far better.

 

It almost seems as if MS's marketing team only wanted to attack Apple's good looks, so they sacrificed everything else in order to do so. I think they should have released something like XP plus, that looks just like Vista, but doesn't have the performance kills in it like Vista. Isn't the goal of an operating system to do basic functions and get the job done, EFFICIENTLY? And what's with Direct X 10? Why bother?

[Crispy]

Trouble is, WIndows Vista isn't a huge paradigm shift like the previous OS upgrades you mention. Windows 3.1 added a graphical interface on top of DOS. Windows 9x added a usable graphical interface on top of DOS. Windows XP leveraged the now-mature Windows NT technology while still being mostly compatible with Windows 9x (esp. for games and so on), making it more stable, and it eventually delivered improved security with SP2.

 

Windows Vista isn't particularly more secure than Windows XP with SP2, adds extra shiny, and more than compensates for the shiny by being a slow, incompatible monstrosity with way too much DRM, and a EULA that actually manages to be more restrictive than XP's. Even if/when the problems are fixed (and you can bet the DRM and EULA won't be going anywhere), what have you gained on top of Windows XP? Shiny is not exactly unwelcome, but it hardly justifies the price tag, and Windows XP isn't actually ugly. Especially if you theme it (which is, guess what, free!). And I personally find Windows Vista's interface much harder to navigate than XP's, though this might just be because I'm familiar with XP.

 

Admittedly there are other benefits in Vista - there are a couple of features which look pretty nice. But they're hardly earth-shattering, and could easily have been delivered as a service pack to XP. In fact, some of them are already being backported.

 

DirectX 10 is weird. It was supposed to be a Reason To Upgrade, but Vista is so unpopular that DX10's exclusivity has instead become a reason to not develop for it. AFAIK there's still only one DX10-only game, Halo 3, and it's a Microsoft game, so file that in the "of course they'd do that" bin. Everyone else is at least providing a DX9 option, and that's not likely to change for some time. Anyone developing for DX10 only right now is shooting themselves in the foot.

[STiFU]

The only thing really new in Direct x 10 is afaik the geometry deformation. Everything else can be done with dx 9 and it's also faster. Like I said in another thread already, my fps in Crysis under XP nearly doubled on the same level of visual quality compared to Vista. Also there are many operations that simply aren't possible anymore under vista, but thanks to its customizabilty probably will be in the future. Let's hope for the best...