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Heheh. But T2 has better performance on the real complicated stuff,

 

Yeah, if you leave of bumpmapping, the particle system, the sophisticated lightgem, the advanced AI, and a ton of other features, you get more performance.... *facepalm* *sigh*

 

TDM needs its killer missions. Missions like

 

You know that: No Honor Among Thieves is a TDM mission? *confused*

 

Btw, play "Glenham Tower", you will enjoy it. :)

 

http://www.thedarkmod.com/missions.php

 

As for "needs more content", the editor is free, you can start here:

 

http://wiki.thedarkmod.com/index.php?title=DarkRadiant

 

Nobody will hold you back except yourself :)

"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man." -- George Bernard Shaw (1856 - 1950)

 

"Remember: If the game lets you do it, it's not cheating." -- Xarax

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Yeah, if you leave of bumpmapping, the particle system, the sophisticated lightgem, the advanced AI, and a ton of other features, you get more performance.... *facepalm* *sigh*

 

...

 

As for "needs more content", the editor is free, you can start here:

 

http://modetwo.net/d...tle=DarkRadiant

 

Nobody will hold you back except yourself :)

 

Sure you get more bang for your buck, but if FPS is low it's low... simply put you can make more visually stunning and expansive missions on T2 without worrying about hardware (as much as TDM).

 

You know what, I think I will check out DarkRadiant. I tried it a couple versions ago but got scare.

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You know what, I think I will check out DarkRadiant. I tried it a couple versions ago but got scare.

 

Great! Another possible mapper to our ranks! Here is a link to a tutorial which will help you start on the right track:

http://wiki.thedarkmod.com/index.php?title=A_-_Z_Beginner_Full_Guide_Start_Here!

Clipper

-The mapper's best friend.

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I think the "T2 should get off the stage already" sentiment that sometimes crops up here can come across as incredibly condescending to those that enjoy T2 missions. Hobbies also do not work that way. People will do what they enjoy, and if they enjoy playing 10 years old games (or 30 years old ones), they can keep going with it as long as they get something good out of it. Not to mention how a mission - both from the author's and player's perspective - is a lot more than technology. In the computer game scene, especially since it is chock full of programmers and other technically savvy people, there is a huge emphasis on technology, while they are only one component of what makes something great. IMO it is even more the case with Thief fans, who seem to be demographically different from the typical computer gamer, and focused on different parts of the play experience. But I have said this before, so I will stop for now

Edited by Melan

Come the time of peril, did the ground gape, and did the dead rest unquiet 'gainst us. Our bands of iron and hammers of stone prevailed not, and some did doubt the Builder's plan. But the seals held strong, and the few did triumph, and the doubters were lain into the foundations of the new sanctum. -- Collected letters of the Smith-in-Exile, Civitas Approved

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I love T2 but cannot agree with this:

simply put you can make more visually stunning and expansive missions on T2 without worrying about hardware (as much as TDM).

In Thief scenes, mappers try to keep poly counts below what, 750? TDM scenes can contain hundreds of thousands if not into the millions of dynamically lit polys. If you're talking about assets, the community needs to step up and add 'em. A small team of part timers can't do the work of a community of thousands. And the skill of designers working on maps for either game does not determine the capabilities of the engines.

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I think the "T2 should get off the stage already" sentiment that sometimes crops up here can come across as incredibly condescending to those that enjoy T2 missions. Hobbies also do not work that way. People will do what they enjoy, and if they enjoy playing 10 years old games (or 30 years old ones), they can keep going with it as long as they get something good out of it. Not to mention how a mission - both from the author's and player's perspective - is a lot more than technology. In the computer game scene, especially since it is chock full of programmers and other technically savvy people, there is a huge emphasis on technology, while they are only one component of what makes something great. IMO it is even more the case with Thief fans, who seem to be demographically different from the typical computer gamer, and focused on different parts of the play experience. But I have said this before, so I will stop for now

 

I don't disagree with you - I am just sometimes annoyed that people come from Thief to TDM, then expect something from it (it should be like Thief, but better, and of course, not different than Thief - but better!), get somehow disappointed,and then go on and tell us what we should have done differently - all the time completely negleting that TDM is not thief!. It draws from it, it inspires from it, but it improves, it makes possible, it changes, it evolves, but it is not Thief. But I said that before, so I stop now :)

 

I don't go to a dark chocolate fabric and tell them I love white chocolate and that they should make their chocolate more white instead - esp. when all they do is to provide me with a MakeYourOwnChocolateInAnyColor kit ;)

"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man." -- George Bernard Shaw (1856 - 1950)

 

"Remember: If the game lets you do it, it's not cheating." -- Xarax

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Definitely!

Come the time of peril, did the ground gape, and did the dead rest unquiet 'gainst us. Our bands of iron and hammers of stone prevailed not, and some did doubt the Builder's plan. But the seals held strong, and the few did triumph, and the doubters were lain into the foundations of the new sanctum. -- Collected letters of the Smith-in-Exile, Civitas Approved

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Heheh. But T2 has better performance on the real complicated stuff, and more established content from the OMs and FMs.

 

TDM needs its killer missions. Missions like

 

No Honor Among Thieves, The Flying Age, CoSaS Mission X, Hammerite Imperium, Lord Alan's Factory, Dracula Reloaded, King's Story, Pirates Ahoy, Broken Triad, bla bla blah

 

They'll go a long way in proving what can be done with TDM.

 

It makes me sad that none of my maps made your killer missions list :( Although I did help out with Cosas. And you forgot Calendra's Legacy (helped with that too) lol.

 

Seriously though, T2 does NOT have better performance on anything, other than the fact that everything rendered HAS to be alot simpler so you can't help but get more FPS in it. (Not that I have got it running on my current machine yet).

 

If we were using T2 resources (smaller textures, fewer poly objects, no normal/spec maps, no real time lighting...) every map would probably be at 100 FPS for everyone. Max polys on screen in Dromed is 1024 (thats world polys, not objects). I've put over 60,000 in an area in TDM - in a test map and it was fine.

 

But you're right, would be sweet to have more 'No Honor' maps, just gonna take time, there will be some amazing maps no doubt. I think there are already quite a few that get an honourable mission, they are just small.

Dark is the sway that mows like a harvest

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Now now, don't start in on the my chocolate is better than your chocolate. All chocolate is created equal (except for that gross white stuff, and the green stuff which is just white stuff with green coloring, it's even worse 'cause you think it's something it's not)

Dark is the sway that mows like a harvest

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There are many I anticipate... BIKERDUDE'S LONG AWAITED InkyCavesAndMassiveCathedral IN PARTICULAR OCCURS AT THE MOMENT (did I just say that out loud, really loud?) might further spark & shift a few more of those builders from that tired old engine... ;)

"A Rhapsody Of Feigned And Ill-Invented Nonsense" - Thomas Aikenhead, On Theology, ca. 1696

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Now now, don't start in on the my chocolate is better than your chocolate. All chocolate is created equal (except for that gross white stuff, and the green stuff which is just white stuff with green coloring, it's even worse 'cause you think it's something it's not)

 

Chocolate Flame Wars! (Now with extra crisp grilled chocolate flavour!) :D

"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man." -- George Bernard Shaw (1856 - 1950)

 

"Remember: If the game lets you do it, it's not cheating." -- Xarax

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It makes me sad that none of my maps made your killer missions list :( Although I did help out with Cosas. And you forgot Calendra's Legacy (helped with that too) lol.

 

Seriously though, T2 does NOT have better performance on anything, other than the fact that everything rendered HAS to be alot simpler so you can't help but get more FPS in it. (Not that I have got it running on my current machine yet).

 

If we were using T2 resources (smaller textures, fewer poly objects, no normal/spec maps, no real time lighting...) every map would probably be at 100 FPS for everyone. Max polys on screen in Dromed is 1024 (thats world polys, not objects). I've put over 60,000 in an area in TDM - in a test map and it was fine.

 

But you're right, would be sweet to have more 'No Honor' maps, just gonna take time, there will be some amazing maps no doubt. I think there are already quite a few that get an honourable mission, they are just small.

 

I like to be wrong, just to remember what it feels like. Ahhh.

 

I mostly play missions from the most recommended list on TTLG and then the new ones that come out. I have not had the pleasure of playing Calendra's Legacy, but I will try it.

 

Let's go ahead and use all T2 assets. Then we can label the missions Thief Classic with that smooth FPS taste and make billions.

 

post-3727-128108876365_thumb.png

Edited by jaxa
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Can you believe today is the first day I'm playing a mission? It's been more than a month since I discovered Dark Mod. The graphics are so impressive that all I've done yet was to NOCLIP and NOTARGET around the maps. Now that I'm a little used to the graphics and game realism I can finally play and it's ever better.

 

What you've done is not just a lot of work, but a work of art.

 

Something funny: a guard was coughing near me and I was so immersed in the game that I just took a few steps back not to get sick :))

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Can you believe today is the first day I'm playing a mission? It's been more than a month since I discovered Dark Mod. The graphics are so impressive that all I've done yet was to NOCLIP and NOTARGET around the maps.

Yikes mega self_spoilers? You should have just practiced on the trainer to get familiar. Still, your call. ;)
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Thanks - you're gonna need that training 6912. Better get busy practicing your stealth techniques, lockpicking, roping, mantling, blackjacking, etc.etc. you'll need 'em all. :ph34r:

 

It often happens to me when I'm trying to blackjack someone from behind, they only get hurt but not unconscious - didn't I aim for the head in the right way??

"Einen giftigen Trank aus Kräutern und Wurzeln für die närrischen Städter wollen wir brauen." - Text aus einem verlassenen Heidenlager

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Probably. The most common mistake I make is getting too close. Then you essentially hit his head with your arm, not the bj.

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Some here are complaining about FPS. What are you people using instead of computers? Mine is 3 years old and it's running smoothly all maps so far. I can even move around when the whole map is showing (NOCLIP). And it wasn't a top-level computer when I bought it.

 

I guess some people don't understand that you need processing power if you want quality and detail. I have a idea for them: try DOOM1, it will move great! Can we have a Dark Mod for DOOM1, please? :))

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  • 1 month later...

Time to resurrect this thread.

 

I just had my very own TDM Battle Royale.

 

I wanted to see what happens in my WIP map if I set half of the guards to team 0 and other half remain in their standard teams.

Then I hid in the shadows and marvelled the AI's great battle.

 

It wasn't a battle. It was carnage. It worked really well and the team 0 finally won since they had a slight superiority. The battle looked very realistic with fleeing wounded and bloodthirsty chases until the wounded ran into a dead end or got an arrow in their back. It was very chaotic as true battle should be. And very cruel.

 

It was also cool that after dispatching some team zero's, the standard team started spontaneously searching the rooms and found more zero's to be eliminated. It was especially hilarious when a lone standard team member stumbled in a room full of sleeping team zeros. He charged the nearest one and managed to hurt him pretty bad until he was hacked down by three zeros.

 

After a while of fast action the final standard team member resumed normal patrol route with no chance of encountering team zero's, who where hanging out in other area. I jumped from the shadows and let the last standard teamer to chase me all the way to the zero teams room. The standard team member got his ass kicked by my buddies and tried to flee, but got a sword in his back.

 

There were also some cool moments when:

I dodged a standard teamer's sword so that an escaping zero teamer got hit and killed instead of me.

A marksman archer in the zero team put an arrow right in between the eyes of standard team member.

 

The only buggy things I noticed where a few stuck characters, which mainly was due to somewhat incomplete monsterclipping in my map.

 

All in all, this battle royale of mine showed how nice the AI in the game truly is. It was quite impressive, actually. It would be interesting to see an FM which takes place during somekind of battle. The player is looting the local thieves guild house, when suddenly a citywatch raid breaks through the main door. :wub:

Clipper

-The mapper's best friend.

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There were a few classic FMs with battle scenes ... The start of the Winter mission in Calendra's Legacy and the end of Fortress by the Sea, but of course too many AI would inch the game to a stand still. I think it would be epic to see a massive, Mount & Blade-sized battle going on in an FM that you had to navigate through, or even participate in.

What do you see when you turn out the light? I can't tell you but I know that it's mine.

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I have thought about a similar mission featuring clashes in the streets. The idea was to have teams of AI roaming the place (controlled with the follow behaviour seen in TDP:Assassins) and putting down opposing teams on an encounter. Spawns would be set up randomly using the player as a trigger and a lot of destroy/teleport traps (hence if you followed the same path every time, you'd get the same teams - taking a slightly different way would mean different groups at different locales). This was to be my next major project after Disorientation, but I did not pursue it with TDM, although I've still got the sketch map and some architectural ideas. With the way AI are gobbling up polys, it is not something I'd undertake until hardware standards increase substantially.

Come the time of peril, did the ground gape, and did the dead rest unquiet 'gainst us. Our bands of iron and hammers of stone prevailed not, and some did doubt the Builder's plan. But the seals held strong, and the few did triumph, and the doubters were lain into the foundations of the new sanctum. -- Collected letters of the Smith-in-Exile, Civitas Approved

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