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OpenGL perf. on AMD/ATi gpu's: WIP fix.


Bikerdude
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Uhmmmmmmmm, I must say that Amnesia TDD (OpenGL engine) was unplayable with SSAO (High quality - 32 samples).....now is really well playable.

Task is not so much to see what no one has yet seen but to think what nobody has yet thought about that which everybody see. - E.S.

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gave this one a try (still running on R9 270X dualX) and no big improvements detected.. it was round 40 fps as it is now with new driver installed :mellow:

 

So I guess it goes in line with what AMD rep told me - no resources for indies (which also means no resources for OpenGL since no engine except of id Tech 5 uses OpenGL; and I am betting id Tech 6 will be DX11/12 only).

 

Time to implement Direct3D wrapper or add D3D rendering path ;)

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What R9 models people ran TDM on ? I am fixing to buy R9 285 for my programmer to see if he can determine whether something can be done to the engine to make it run on AMD as fast as on Nvidia. Looking at the specs http://www.amd.com/en-gb/markets/r9 Isee that R9 285 has different architecture compare to 280X and below. So I wonder if 285+ R9 models run with TDM fine. I wouldn't want to spend money on the GPU that already works fine.

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Just got an email from my contact and replied, would we say my reply is a fair assesment..?

 

Hi

 

I’m getting a mixed response from my users, but the overall response is we are seeing a slight improvement. But not significant enough to be called a fix.

 

Also there was no mention of the fix or our game listed in the driver release notes, so that along with the incremental perf. increase above would suggest the fix never made it into the driver.

 

I currently don’t own a R9-290 anymore, but can borrow one when I know for sure the fix is mentioned in the driver release notes.

 

Kind regards

 

From: amd
Sent: 30 March 2015 21:39
To: b1k3rdude
Subject: Darkmod

 

Hi

 

Just following up if the 15.3 Beta release addressed any/all of your performance issues ?

Thanks

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So here is another real life story happened to my coworker a few days ago. He bought AMD 280X, played H1Z1 with it at 30-40 fps. Swapped it for Nvidia 970 and was running the game at 90-100 fps (in both cases he was using ultra settings).

 

So does it even make sense to jump through hoops as a developer to support AMD, when Nvidia makes sure drivers do the job and allow games run at max performance ?

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So does it even make sense to jump through hoops as a developer to support AMD, when Nvidia makes sure drivers do the job and allow games run at max performance ?

On the face of it no, but if the possibility exists of AMD coming through with a 'fixed' driver I would say wait until I get a definitive answer.

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So does it even make sense to jump through hoops as a developer to support AMD, when Nvidia makes sure drivers do the job and allow games run at max performance ?

 

IMO Yes, has the second gamer worthy GPU's on the market, you are shooting yourself in the foot by not supporting AMD, even tho i comprehend you are frustrated about the performance, IMO for a indie developer like yourself losing such a big potential market can be a danger and AMD gpu's aren't only the new Rx based cards, on the HD5000 and up family (and also past ones like the HD4000) there's still enough performance to run your game, and the drivers are much more mature. You can say what about intel, ok they are becoming a potential market, has the GPU's are improving, but i wouldn't rely on them for a game of mine and for the time being.

 

Btw IMO you are also very fast at blaming only AMD, don't you find strange to have that big of a performance gap between AMD and Nvidia? I'm saying this because Doom 3 nor games based on the engine like Quake 4 and prey, and even Rage suffer from so large a gap, and it seems to me only idtech 4 suffers from so big problems, Penumbra and Amnesia engines are totally OpenGL and they don't have that big of a gap, if they add everyone would be complaining about it and screaming at AMD has those were very popular games, especially Amnesia.

Don't know what John did to idtech 4 to make it so unfriendly to AMD, it seems resentment between the companies (about the alpha doom 3 leak) made him say, screw you to AMD.

 

Don't take me wrong I'm not here to apologise for their incompetence or unwillingness on supporting OpenGL has Nvidia does, for them this API is indeed a second thought, and now with volkan on the making (based on Mantle) it will be even more i'm afraid, i just think you are losing by not supporting them, and even if AMD users get less performance compared to nvidia, imo 40 fps's is still very much playable, so saying no AMD support is wrong imo, is like you are blaming the users from their GPU choice, not because their GPU can't run the game.

Edited by HMart
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My games runs extremely well on Nvidia, very decently on Intel (for Intel) and horribly on AMD. It's not the content, it's the driver or engine or both. But now that I see AAA games running poorly on brand new AMD cards, I can see it's more driver than anything else.

 

I can only support one line of AMD, as it's not feasible to me to spend $1000 to buy several GPUs and have our programmer debug each GPU with every new driver version. Note that HD4000 and around that are not supported in the new drivers. So any improvements made in recent drivers require gamer to purchase new GPU. So why support old junk? I couldn't even find more recent cards online. Either out of stock, or cost as much as R9. Maybe it's a good strategy for free 100% FOSS games to support every piece of hardware out there, but for indies it is not. Indie business implies less money spend on development, because it's hard to even break even nowadays. So going with Nvidia/Intel and ditching AMD (at least for release time) only means losing 28% of market. Potentially someone who wouldn't even play my game. Although 28% is sizable, it's not critical at this point.

 

I wish 40fps was the case. I wouldn't even raise the subject. But it's 60fps on NV vs 18fps on AMD (about equal hardware specs). The worse this is the AMD market is so fragmented, it's not even funny. Steam stats show more mobile AMD GPUs than desktop being used. I can't afford to buy a laptop just to get a hold of AMD 8800 for example :/ I wish there were aggregated stats showing how many desktop systems use AMD, and what are the most popular GPUs are out there. Based on Steam stats R7 and R9 are the model lines that have most users with AMD. The bad thing about R9 is that 280X and 285 are supposedly vastly different models (architecture wise; so I'd have to buy both to make sure R9 line fully tested and supported, if it's even possible) :/

 

No AMD support means if it doesn't run well, then I told you so in the minimum specs - no strings attached. If I say AMD is supported, then I will be facing unsatisfied AMD users who I can not help.

 

I am still hoping to get to the bottom of performance issues to eliminate engine from the equation.

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