Idea: Electricity Arrows

[Kurshok]

Fire Arrows and Water arrows are a thing. So, what about Electricity arrows that activate machinery and can activate or deactivate robotic enemies like Steambeasts?

[demagogue]

You can use them in T2X if you want to see how they play.

[Filizitas]

I thought about this arrow too, it would certainly need to have some good logic behind it.
I would more think of it as an EMP arrow for small lamps and to temporally disable robots!

[wesp5]

In my TDM Unoffifial Patch I changed the flash mine, which makes little sense to me, into an electrical mine which will knock out humans. I'll have to check what it does to robots.

P.S.: Anybody knows of a mission where you have some robots right at the start to do some tests?

Edited August 19, 2021 by wesp5

[demagogue]

You could probably make a room with robots in Dark Radiant much faster than finding a mission like that.

[MirceaKitsune]

Semi-but-pretty-related:

 

[Petike the Taffer]

On 8/19/2021 at 8:07 AM, Filizitas said:

I thought about this arrow too, it would certainly need to have some good logic behind it.
I would more think of it as an EMP arrow for small lamps and to temporally disable robots!

Precisely. The tricky thing is how to justify it technologically, from an in-universe perspective.

We don't need to overthink it, of course, but TDM has a very grounded setting in many aspects. I think one of the best ways to "explain away" the existence of electric arrows in TDM would be to have an arrowhead that includes some conductive material on the inside and some sort of made-up gobbledygook alchemical substance that would act as a trigger to the conductive material. Once the arrow arrives at its target, the alchemical substance in one of its compartments is triggered and the substance itself then acts as a trigger for the conductive material in the arrowhead, creating an electric discharge of some sort.

Maybe electric arrows would be easier to implement in the setting of your Delightfyl game project. It seems a fair bit more modern technology-wise, especially when it comes to harnessing electricity and various electrical devices and electrical appliances. Not impossible in the TDM setting, but your own setting seems even better-suited to that, including something as advanced as EMP arrowheads.

Edited February 1, 2022 by Petike the Taffer
typo

[Oktokolo]

22 hours ago, Petike the Taffer said:

I think one of the best ways to "explain away" the existence of electric arrows in TDM would be to have an arrowhead that includes some conductive material on the inside and some sort of made-up gobbledygook alchemical substance that would act as a trigger to the conductive material. Once the arrow arrives at its target, the alchemical substance in one of its compartments is triggered and the substance itself then acts as a trigger for the conductive material in the arrowhead, creating an electric discharge of some sort.

In real life, graphite bombs are a proven surgical tool. You can use them to short-circuit whole transformer stations, a single overland power line, or a power plant connection station. Just be sure to detonate a single one above the target, so the cloud of graphite-coated filaments gets optimally spread over all the conductors.

Carbon-coated filament might sound a bit hightech. But small-scale, just spreading coal dust might work fine in a steampunk game...

Water arrows for torches and coal arrows for electric lights, steel for humans and silver for monsters...

[Zerg Rush]

Good idea, but on the other hand I don't see any real use in a mission. If the task consists of deactivating a transformer, it would be much simpler to put a switch on it. Having an arrow to deactivate circuits should work on all transformers on the map, which implies a lot of change in the plot.
It is a problem similar to that I put some pages back, to use normal arrows, shot at a wall, to be able to climb with the help of these, as was possible in the Turok game. But this also complicates the creation of maps a lot, to avoid going out of this to the great nothing.

[Oktokolo]

23 hours ago, Zerg Rush said:

Good idea, but on the other hand I don't see any real use in a mission. If the task consists of deactivating a transformer, it would be much simpler to put a switch on it. Having an arrow to deactivate circuits should work on all transformers on the map, which implies a lot of change in the plot.

Yep, rope arrows suffer from that problem as well.
You generally have to design missions with player tools in mind.

So obviously any new stuff would only be available after explicit inclusion in missions by their authors. The TDM devs wouldn't just add some gameplay alteration to existing maps.

[Zerg Rush]

In theory even a simple water arrow can cause a short circuit and therefore disable a generator.

In general, I think that it is not so necessary to create new weapons, it may be enough to expand the possibilities of existing ones, such as short-circuiting a generator with the Water Arrow, whose efficiency with holywater can also be somewhat higher, often insufficient with certain skeletons. and ghosts. Using ropearrows for horizontal use or to attract objects, things like that.

Edited August 31, 2021 by Zerg Rush

[wesp5]

9 hours ago, Zerg Rush said:

In general, I think that it is not so necessary to create new weapons, it may be enough to expand the possibilities of existing ones, such as short-circuiting a generator with the Water Arrow, whose efficiency with holywater can also be somewhat higher, often insufficient with certain skeletons. and ghosts. Using ropearrows for horizontal use or to attract objects, things like that.

I completely agree!

[Filizitas]

Extend the possibilities then, i am listening and open for new ideas

[Zerg Rush]

In winter missions, to create ice with waterarrows on streets and stairs to bring down or slow down guardians and others.

[wesp5]

1 hour ago, Zerg Rush said:

In winter missions, to create ice with waterarrows on streets and stairs to bring down or slow down guardians and others.

You can do something like this in Dark Messiah of Might and Magic, it is so much fun to have enemies slide to their death :)!

[Zerg Rush]

In Dark Messiah you can also do it by simply kicking them. This would also be desirable in TDM, the ability to push an enemy or kick, like in other games, open a door with a kick, like in The Suffering or inPostal 2

Edited September 1, 2021 by Zerg Rush

[Filizitas]

I oppose aggressive action like kicks, however the ice thing sounds more like something cool.
Pushing a door open by force, was a topic already, i will debate this internally.

[Zerg Rush]

I am equally against violent acts in TDM, I think the philosophy of the game does not go this way, although a kick to open an old door can be useful at times. It is more credible in situations where Garret is in front of an old, half-ruined cabin with a half-broken, creepy door, and cannot enter as an experienced thief with the picks because he does not have a key.

Using kicks as a fighting item anyway does not apply in TDM, nor does it make much sense to attempt it with the sword against a guard.

Edited September 1, 2021 by Zerg Rush

[MirceaKitsune]

Kicking doors isn't an idea that would have come to my mind, and I suggested quite a few things recently. I'm neither for or against it, but IMO it would introduce more complexity than is perhaps justified. As far as doors go, I'd spend the effort on fixing the peek feature and adding it in existing FM's (looking through keyholes).

[Zerg Rush]

Well, in the first line it is a matter of expanding functionalities, making better use of the available tools and the ability to also use elements of the environment as tools. In some missions it has already been done, such as replacing lockpicks with a lever in March of Rahena, or using a knife to escape from a cell (and apart from using a removed fire skeleton as a torch, which I have already done in another mission, I don't know the name now).

[wesp5]

13 hours ago, MirceaKitsune said:

Kicking doors isn't an idea that would have come to my mind, and I suggested quite a few things recently.

I think kicking in a door would make little sense in the TDM setting, because it should be incredible loud, thus alerting anybody nearby...

[Zerg Rush]

Only in the case if anybody is arround, not the case in abandoned mansions or huts in the wood. For example in the mission Blackgrove Manor or A Night to Remember, steaslth is very irrelevant the most time. But yes, not so important feature.

Edited September 2, 2021 by Zerg Rush

[Oktokolo]

7 hours ago, wesp5 said:

I think kicking in a door would make little sense in the TDM setting, because it should be incredible loud, thus alerting anybody nearby...

Even in the city, kicking in doors can be appropriate. In the slums of Bridgeport, only the gangers will react to you doing such things. So if you time it right, you can do whatever you want.

Immersion can be improved by rarely used game mechanics too. Having the option obviously doesn't count as much as actually doing it - but it still counts.
The only question is, whether there is someone who implements it and makes it easy to integrate in missions.

[Zerg Rush]

As I mentioned earlier, throwing objects can still be a bit more optimized. A normal adult throws a stone at 50-60m, Garret by far at 20m, even as a small child I was better at throwing a ball.

[MirceaKitsune]

Gotta say: I do find it a bit funny that some are thinking of kicking loud doors into AI's noses as being more immersive, yet ideas like implementing microphone support precisely for more unique immersion seem to be regarded as a useless idea.