Newbie DarkRadiant Questions

[Goldwell]

Ok thanks for your help everyone the problems solved.

 

The problem was with some brushes that had odd shapes. I re-sized them or just added extra brushes to the outside of them and now the visportals work great. I guess it would be an internal leak that caused the problem? but either way its fixed!

[Melan]

What are some good values for sound_loss across portals? I am thinking of the following examples:

• a doorway
  
• an opened window
  
• a narrow passage
  
• a very small gap
  

[Springheel]

You can't go much higher than 3 without there being a noticable jump in volume for the player, so if it's something they can go through, keep that in mind.

 

The default for doors is 10, so you can use that to gauge approximately.

[Obsttorte]

Is it possible to execute a console command via script?

 

Is it possible to partly overwrite the players key binding for the time a FM is installed?

[AluminumHaste]

Yes for both.

Not sure how to do the first, but the second you should be able to call bind <command> <key>

[Digi]

Newbie Objectives questions:

 

So my mission is fairly straightforward. Steal {X} loot, then return to the start. I might add in a "no kill" rule for the hardest difficulty, but one step at a time.

 

So I set up both objectives according to Fidcal's tutorial here: http://wiki.thedarkm...ge_6#Objectives

 

The problem came with the ending location, the "exitLocation" entity. My first objective entity was a mess, so I deleted both it and the "exitLocation" brush and made new ones. But then I got a message when I tried to make another "exitLocation" brush, saying it already existed. I hit 'J' in DR and pulled it up, and it highlighted almost every damn brush on the map. Now if I create a new brush it's named "exitLocation" by default, and if I try to rename it, it renames every brush, so I can't create a unique brush for the objective entity to point to. Needless to say, I haven't been able to get the objective to trigger in the mission.

 

My last backup save wouldn't kill me to reload, but it would set me back maybe 30 minutes. But I'd rather figure out how I screwed up. Any help is appreciate, as always.

Edited June 9, 2014 by Digi

[grayman]

Select one of your world brushes.

 

If you find that its "name" spawnarg has been changed to "exitLocation", delete the spawnarg.

 

All world brushes are named "world". You might have overwritten that accidently.

[demagogue]

You need to convert the brush to a func_static or whichever kind of entity the tutorial says so it's an entity and no longer a brush. Then rename it. Entities and brushes are different things.

[Digi]

You need to convert the brush to a func_static or whichever kind of entity the tutorial says so it's an entity and no longer a brush. Then rename it. Entities and brushes are different things.

 

The entity I was referring to is the Objectives entity. The brush isn't an entity. At least I don't think it is, but I'll double check to be sure.

[Obsttorte]

Yes for both.

Not sure how to do the first, but the second you should be able to call bind <command> <key>

I want to do the latter from script, too.

 

Do you know where you've may read that the first one is possible and especially how. I can't seem to figure it out.

[demagogue]

The entity I was referring to is the Objectives entity. The brush isn't an entity. At least I don't think it is, but I'll double check to be sure.

 

I think you might have misunderstood me. Yes you create that brush, but you *must* convert the brush into an entity so it is no longer a brush! The brush must be an entity; the fact that it isn't an entity like you say is precisely the problem. I mean the entity you mention is supposed to actually *be* the (converted) brush, not a separate entity in addition to it. To quote from the tutorial:

You need to create a brush at the exit location and give it the texture common/clip. Then assign to it the entity info_tdm_objective_location.

By "assign to it the entity" it means you convert the brush you made into that entity. IIRC when you right click on a brush you can convert it into an entity through the pop-up menu. There should be no brushes used for this or you get the problem you mentioned when you rename it as the tutorial says. I hope that clears it up.

 

That is if I understand your problem right. The way you worded your reply could also mean you get that the brush has to be an entity & want to double check to make sure it is.

Edit: And lol, I hope I didn't overexplain it. I just wanted to be precise even at the risk of overkill.

[SteveL]

I want to do the latter from script, too. Do you know where you've may read that the first one is possible and especially how. I can't seem to figure it out.

 

From a quick browse of the script ref, I can only see sys.setcvar(). That probably can't be used to set a key bind, but even if it can I think the problem will come when the FM exits. How would you ensure that the cvar gets changed back again?

 

Alternatively, could you package a config file with the pk4 so it gets read as well as the normal user config, and overrides/adds just one line? No idea whether that's possible, I'm just throwing out ideas here.

 

EDIT: Another thing you could check out. The script ref mentions an idTarget_SessionCommand class. It needs a "command" spawnarg with the command to be run. idTarget_SessionCommand is defined in the game code but not in the .def files, so you'd have to make your own entity def for it to try it out. I just did that, copying from target_null and adding "spawnclass" "idTarget_SessionCommand ", and I managed to start up a map containing one of those targets. Unfortunately I didn't get it to work with either of the following commands: "noclip", "r_showprimitives 1", but I put a breakpoint in the game code and can confirm the entity works right: idTarget_SessionCommand::Activate is indeed called when I pulled the lever, and it picks up the command spawnarg. Maybe I misunderstood how you're supposed to use it, but it would be worth checking out.

[Obsttorte]

There is also a script function for that, but the amount of session commands is limited and has nothing to do with console input it seems.

[SteveL]

Dammit. Well, that would explain why I couldn't get it to work. Any idea what commands it's for?

 

Adding a config file to the top folder in the pk4 might still be an option.

[Obsttorte]

No, doesn't work either. This was my first approach

[Goldwell]

Could someone please check out this footage of a home I just finished building for my map. I feel like I have done a lot on it but I also just feel like some things are wrong. In this video I noticed a couple of mistakes but I would love to have another set of eyes on this.

 

People say that screenshots can be deceiving so I figure why not a video.

 

To give context to this video this is the home that your player starts off in. Basically you are seeking refuge in this house before you get transported elsewhere so it needs to feel like your home but not a permanent place a Thief would live. This is at the start of my map before the player ventures out into the city.

 

Any advice and criticisms would be greatly appreciated, thanks! Watch in 720p for best results

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eRSgnzcGTs0

Edited June 9, 2014 by Goldwell

[Obsttorte]

• The texture scale on the wall is too high
  
• the geometry good need some break-ups, also I would suggest to use several textures for the walls (panel, wall, ceiling)
  
• overall the detail level is pretty low for an inside area, I suggest relying more on models.
  

[Goldwell]

• The texture scale on the wall is too high
  
• the geometry good need some break-ups, also I would suggest to use several textures for the walls (panel, wall, ceiling)
  
• overall the detail level is pretty low for an inside area, I suggest relying more on models.
  

 

Texture scale: good point

Geometry: the floor, wall and support beams are different textures so i'm unsure what you mean. Do you mean say different textures for each room? And the ceiling yeah could probably do with a change as its the same as the floor

Detail level: that's sort of my point for posting this video, are you able to be more specific or have any suggestions? because when I look at the level I know that its missing something but I just can't seem to figure out what. I've been opening other peoples maps and i've found that my mission is either the same level of detail or is in a different area to what they have. I can't think of what else extra to put in the house but I do know it needs more clutter

 

Also thanks for checking it out!

Edited June 9, 2014 by Goldwell

[Melan]

I think that wood texture you are using for walls is the main culprit. It does not look natural. It is certainly scaled too big, but I would also rotate it 90 degrees, or use a different one altogether.

[Goldwell]

To remedy the oddness I have replaced the wood texture for the walls. I think it's a bit better now, but I still have to figure out what clutter to place, off to google images!

Edited June 9, 2014 by Goldwell

[Digi]

I think you might have misunderstood me. Yes you create that brush, but you *must* convert the brush into an entity so it is no longer a brush! The brush must be an entity; the fact that it isn't an entity like you say is precisely the problem. I mean the entity you mention is supposed to actually *be* the (converted) brush, not a separate entity in addition to it. To quote from the tutorial:

 

By "assign to it the entity" it means you convert the brush you made into that entity. IIRC when you right click on a brush you can convert it into an entity through the pop-up menu. There should be no brushes used for this or you get the problem you mentioned when you rename it as the tutorial says. I hope that clears it up.

 

That is if I understand your problem right. The way you worded your reply could also mean you get that the brush has to be an entity & want to double check to make sure it is.

Edit: And lol, I hope I didn't overexplain it. I just wanted to be precise even at the risk of overkill.

 

No worries. Thanks for taking the time. I'll get the chance to fix it this evening.

[RJFerret]

Any advice and criticisms would be greatly appreciated, thanks! Watch in 720p for best results

 

This is hard to do without sounding like a critical jerk, but here's a bunch of brainstorming suggestions that come to mind as I go through it, feel free to disregard as much as you want, or just stick some tidbit of useful design info into your head for future creations...

 

Bedroom:

 

Rug for floor in bedroom, that looks cold on bare feet, nevermind splinters.

 

Anything on chest of drawers beside candle: coins, book, hat, cards, dice, etc.

 

Dirt in corners, litter, whatever didn't get sweeped up. Speaking of cleaning, where's a broom/bucket (aside from privy pail).

 

Oh! Chamber pot.

 

Pictures on walls/flat surfaces? Curtains on window?

 

Coat rack or hooks for hanging cloaks that don't fit well in drawers.

 

Spare set of shoes lying around?

 

Ring, jewelry, trinkets?

 

Base molding to trim where the floorboards and wall boards meet.

 

 

Hallway:

 

Trim/molding

 

Can't see, is there a threshold piece where the two different floorboards meet exiting the bedroom? Why do they run perpendicular directions? (Usually floor joists supporting the floorboards run one way, so floorboards run perpendicular to those, aligned throughout.) If the hallway floorboards are turned 90° to run the same way as bedroom, no need for a threshold. That would also look more natural, as floorboards are usually laid out to run the length of a space, and walls are usually built perpendicular to joists so they don't fall between down below.

 

Candle holders on wall? (Can be empty/unlit if you intend for it to be darker up there.)

 

Both spaces look very bland/flat from lack of lighting, it'll get a lot more dimension/depth if there are some lit sources.

 

There's a big problem with the glow from the windows, it's going in to different directions, perpendicular to each other! You can see this at 0:13 seconds drastically, as the glow coming in the bedroom is being cast from the right and shining toward the viewer and left, while the glow coming in the hallway window is casting to the right!

 

To correct that, the light falling in the bedroom window should angle toward the drawers and the light falling in the hallway should angle onto the left wall. Alternatively, keep one straight and remove the other so they don't conflict with the viewer's subconscious expectations.

 

A table and vase at the end under the window maybe?

 

I like the urn tucked in the odd corner.

 

 

Stairs:

 

Handrail perhaps?

 

Copy those downstairs candleholders to upstairs? Add soot behind/over them first though?

 

 

Downstairs:

 

Again, floorboards are all willy-nilly. I'd rotate the hallway boards ninety degrees to run the length instead of interrupting the visual flow of it.

 

The opening off the candle hallway to the left at 0:35, I'd put a different wood texture with grain running vertically on the end of the wall, rather than having matching paneling style wrapping around. If you add trim, something that complements that.

 

A shelf with perfume in the privy? Scrolls/reading material? Spilled coinage? Dark moisture/mold stains in the unfinished wood?

 

Is it just me or does the seam of wood panel through the middle of the seat over the bucket makes it appear like it would break in half if anyone sat on it!?

 

The lighting and accessories downstairs make upstairs feel like an afterthought.

 

Kitchen:

 

Chimney over fireplace or that room's filling with smoke, perhaps a soot decal above on the wall or ceiling. (Then match the chimney on the exterior for simple visual interest if you haven't already.)

 

Fireplace tools next to it, a pile of logs or that fire'll be going out in a few minutes, a bucket for discarding ash.

 

I'd move the flammable sisal rug from in front of the fire where it's ready to ignite from an errant spark to the other room where you'd more desire quiet/warm floor insulation.

 

Instead of one big wrapped package propped up in the corner, perhaps a more reasonable size for a small home? And think in sets of threes (or other odd numbers). So replacing with a small package, with a basket sitting on top and one of those tied cloth bags adds visual interest.

 

Maybe a candlestick or two on the table? How do they clean? Broom? Where does waste go? Pail?

 

Duplicate the window to use up more wall space and let more light/air into the kitchen? It looks awfully hot/stuffy in summer.

 

General:

 

Water source? People need water more than food. Basin? Barrel? Spigot? Bucket? Sink? Ladle?

 

The fact that the light coming in through the kitchen window is perpendicular to the light coming through the window over the stairs isn't as objectionable because they are further away and not seen together, but it seems the planet you are on has four moons, one in each cardinal direction!

 

Also, instead of centering/squaring everything, if you rotate things a couple degrees, and position things following the Golden Ratio, it's more aesthetically pleasing and natural feeling.

 

PS: I like that it appears that you adjusted the chest to only frob the top lid, instead of entire chest to ease players collecting stuff.

[Obsttorte]

the floor, wall and support beams are different textures so i'm unsure what you mean. Do you mean say different textures for each room?

See this post

 

Detail level: that's sort of my point for posting this video, are you able to be more specific or have any suggestions?

Supports for example. In addition, the wall does not have to have the same level of depth everywhere.

[Digi]

.{edit}

Edited June 9, 2014 by Digi

[Goldwell]

<snip>

 

Wow thank you very much for your effort and help! Btw I don't see it as egotistical because I really need pointers like that when it comes to things like this. This time around for my new map I am doing all of the mapping side of things myself (others are helping with models/animations of course) but I want to really learn how to be a better mapper and you only learn by doing. So I spent the most part of today working on this and now with your advice I think it has really turned around for the better.

 

Check out how everything looks now!

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OAJ6NgC_O6E