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@HMartI am not sure that is correct - you can even seen in your screen that the green or "y" areas of the normal map are not shadowed correctly in game relative your point light. They are in shade when they should be lit and the appear illuminated from the bottom when the light source is above. Here is another example: OpenGL: DirectX: Notice in DX how below the light source the light hits the tops of the tiles and shadows the bottom - where as this is the opposite in openGL which makes no sense given the light position. It is very confusing given the legacy of the game, but I have learned from (painful) experience that directx formatted normals are what look physically correct in the game in my opinion.

For the FM? For beta 1 it's here: https://drive.proton.me/urls/H1QBB04GA0#oBZTb1CmVFQb I've already done around 100 fixes though, so you might want to wait for beta 2 which should be ready in a couple of days hopefully. All links are in the first post of the beta thread here: https://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?/topic/22439-the-lieutenant-3-foreign-affairs-beta-testing/

I just need the download link

You mean Discord? That's fine, you are more than welcome to use the forum if you want to help test

I let my account lapse a while back biker dude used that app a very long time ago

Seems to be OpenGL I tested right now. See how light cyan is top, the middle two small lines, look like they come out of the surface, like they should, the left circle, should also look like it is coming out and the right one going in, like the two big vertical line on the sides. Btw the normal map was something I just made on a hurry on paint.net so quality is not good but did it's job.

This topic is going in different directions and it is difficult to tell if we all are in the same page. Facts: Stgatilov wants to change (improve, I guess) something and while implementing the change he realizes he will break some mission in the process. Mappers have been including (now obsolete) core files in their missions and the developer wants to know why these files were included in the first place, as in: the purpose. Changes in two mission are unavoidable, unless the authors go back and revisit the entire logic of their missions. Changes in eight missions are avoidable, in the sense that missions remain essentially the same with or without these changes. Regardless, if the improvements are to be implemented ten missions need to be reviewed and updated. Now my opinion: Considering how the topic is going the next time Stgatilov wants to improve something similar he might think it twice (we all lose because of ten missions). If these same improvements were to be implemented in the future chances are not ten but fifteen missions would have to be reviewed and updated which begs the question, does the inclusion of core files in missions put the present and future development of some areas at risk? No, as long as things remain under control: preserve what must be preserved, encourage and support innovations, identify and address trends. This requires an effort by all parties involved.

So, that's how it was explained to me. Even though it seems counter intuitive, using Direct X maps has worked for me. I was recently trying to import a bunch of textures from Polyhaven.com (they offer both OpenGL and directX normalmaps) and I used the OpenGL version at first, but when I put it in-game there was an inverted green channel. I then used the directX version and the normalmap worked just fine I'm happy to be corrected on any of this though. Maybe Polyhaven does something different with their normals, or I'm doing something wrong

Is that really correct? Unless TDM team changed stuff from Doom 3 times, if you use Doom 3 as example, normal maps that represent outward surfaces, use OpenGL system, those that represent inward surfaces, aka holes, use D3D system. On real DirectX renders, outward surfaces, use the D3D system instead and the OGL one for inward, is inverted. And to reinforce this the original example by idSoftware, looks to use the OpenGL system see here cyan for top, purple for the bottom, in d3d is inverted. Thou like I said maybe the TDM team changed all of this by now...

I just learned this recently too, it should be Direct X

Texture normal map type: does TDM use opengl or Direct X?

That's a very valid question. Personally, I'd say the key is to watch what the otherwise-disengaged fringes of the community are saying. If first time posters or long time lurkers start coming out of the woodwork about well made new missions, praising them for their geometry and story but saying that innovative parts of the gameplay felt frustrating or off, that's probably the first sign that the innovations are starting to get out of hand. For a more concrete example, re-read the comments on Hazard Pay. As much as I and many others love that mission, it's clearly a case where the author strayed further than many people were comfortable with. It also points to the likely endgame if authors do take their customization too far. After getting the negative feedback, kingsal made adjustments, and now the mission is much more friendly towards player preferences that don't match the author's original vision. You don't need to restrict the mapmakers' tools to stop them from straying too far from the traditional formula. When people start speaking up, the authors will rein themselves in on their own.

Ok but, at what point do we consider *it* relevant, if ever?

Plan B in case Joebarnin cannot get it right with immobilizations. By Any Other Name: attached to this post are the Bow/Arrow, Blackjack and Shortsword scripts updated to 2.12. I didn't take any liberties. Blame snatcher if something isn't right. @joebarnin, @stgatilov z_byanyothername_212_scripts.pk4

I can only speak for myself, but I think option 2 would be fine. This will at least allow the missions to be playable on the dev builds for now, and we can see if any other issues pop up

Speaking of actions for the missions which only tweak zoom delay. What would you prefer right now? Mission broken on the latest dev build (as it is now), but working as intended in the latest release. Mission working as intended on the latest dev build, but working without customization on the latest release.

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Just wanted to say thank you for this install script. Made life easier! I'm new to the dark mod (but not to thief) and have just set up my steam deck to try it whilst away for a few days. Looking forward to some portable sneaking!

Alright, you convinced me that this convo is no longer productive. You clearly just wanna be right, so I'm not gonna spend anymore time on this. EDIT: I cant help myself, I'll end on a more thoughtful note. I care about all the feedback I get from all players, however there is a difference between "caring" and "catering to". Just because one person says they don't like X doesn't mean I'm gonna make a change, especially when other players do like X. I'll always hear out beta testers and players and listen to their feedback, but I am by no means beholden to that feedback

I could take your reply much more serious, if you wouldn't call my valid objections "whims". If you don't care about what players think about the decisions you made in your missions (or your "whims"?), then I wonder why you make your missions public at all. Seriously, I'd recommend to get off your high horse.

Any news about this project? I really like those changes for the Main Menu.

Well, I actually found that initial folder in the HiRes SVN repo. This is different from the TDM assets repo as it has a bunch of source files for textures, fonts, etc, but they aren't really game-ready assets. This is where I found the tga image files for the fonts I thought you were looking for. I haven't uploaded Tels folder yet, but I was thinking of uploading them in the HiRes SVN repo, just for the sake of backing it up

That may be where @Amadeus got the folder provided to me earlier. Tels folder has - - .xcf files, not found in earlier work - for any given system font (stone, carleton, manon) and size(particularly 24 or 48), often more .tga/.dds files than earlier work (which originally had just ASCII characters). (You can open the files in GIMP to be even more definitive).

In our SVN under the devel folder we have a font source sub-folder. Do we know for sure that these are all newer?

Arrows are a core part of TDM. They should be moved to C++ and have dedicated Cvars for both players and mission authors. Plan: 1) Implement Arrows in C++ ( evaluate changing some old defaults ) 2) Make associated Cvars "non-archived" 3) Mappers add mission.cfg to enforce their customizations 4) Players can alter mission.cfg to their preference Along the way, reduce some of the performance impact of the weapon script constantly invoking "raise torso" and other nonsense due to using scripts rather than C++ https://bugs.thedarkmod.com/view.php?id=4203