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Damn, what a crazy mission. One issue with missions like this is that sharing screenshots that would accurately represent it would ruin the experience. So if anybody is reading this and considering whether to play it or not: this is very much not a standard city/mansion mission. Obviously I was blown away. My favorite moment was wondering "Are these just decorations or will I be able to jump onto them? Surely it's just a decoration." And it wasn't. I bet I wasn't alone in this. The story was a bit confusing in places (the details like family issues, not what was overall happening), but what's important is that the mission was not. It was huge and there was a lot to do, but it flowed well. What helped was that finding stuff in "act one" helped me understand the layout of things in "act two", that in turn helped me find which areas I likely missed in "act one", and I was then free to take my time and return to them. That's a concept that worked really well because the added context made revisiting the old areas interesting again, something that I don't believe any other mission has achieved to do for me. I did have to go through this thread to find some of the secrets, but that's because I generally don't replay missions and wanted to get the (mostly) full experience from my one playthrough. It did seem at one point that the mission could be completed when the player has seen maybe 50% of it, which was a bit strange, but I guess most people here would not do that anyway.

I don't recall a system for noise masking. It sounds like it'd be a good idea, but when you get into the details you realize it'd be complicated to implement. It's not only noise that that goes into it, I think. E.g., a high register can cut through even a loud but low register rumble. And it's not like the .wav file even has data on the register of what it's playing. So either you have to add meta-data (which is insane), or you have to have a system to literally check pitch on the .wav data and paramaterize it in time to know when it's going to cut through what other parameters from other sounds. For that matter, it doesn't even have the data on the loudness either, so you'd have to get that off the file too and time the peaks with the "simultaneous" moment at arbitrary places in every other sound file correctly. And then position is going to matter independently for each AI. So it's not like you can have one computation that works the same for all AI. You'd have to compute the masking level for each one, and then you get into the expense you're mentioning. I know there was a long discussion about it in the internal forums, and probably on the public subforums too, but it's been so long ago now I can't even remember the gist of them. Anyway the main issue is I don't know if you'll find a champion that wants to work on it. But if you're really curious to see how it might work, you could always try your hand at coding & implementing it. Nothing beats a good demo to test an idea in action. And there's no better way to learn how to code than a little project like that. I always encourage people to try to implement an idea they have, whether or not it may be a good idea, just because it shows the power of an open source game. We fans can try anything we want and see if it works!

it's worth trying whatever you want to try and then see what the beta testers think. Just have a plan B ready to implement in case it goes over like a lead balloon. If there is no loot goal, the first thing people are going to ask is 'where is the loot goal?', so you just need to have an explanation that makes sense and provide that in the release thread, or even in the mission briefing (e.g. don't rob innocent people or something). The only reason I make loot goals optional is to make players like myself happy, who are terrible at finding loot and don't want to spend hours searching everywhere before the mission completes.

Sounds like this is exactly what the guy in the other the thread asked for! But why the skeleton in the screenshot? Do you have an x-ray spell now ;)?

Please give us more examples in this thread. You gave one (noclip) and it wasn't even correct! Have a look at the release notes for each release. You'll see a lot of bugs are fixed in addition to new features. Sometimes these features are imperfect, sometimes there are regressions, but fixing bugs is a core part of the game's development. Here you can look at what's currently being worked on for 2.12: https://bugs.thedarkmod.com/changelog_page.php?version_id=108

Makes sense as the mission (at least the first work on it) seems to be pretty old. I found a thread from 2011 about it.

I'm using the version from kcghost. I just tested and I can't see any difference inside the inventory. On the stats itself it doesn't show the different loot types (still seen in the inventory), but instead gives more info on stealth score. Edit: I see Dragofer made an updated version of his script. I have to check that out. Edit2: That version works: https://forums.thedarkmod.com/applications/core/interface/file/attachment.php?id=21272&key=02755164a3bed10498683771fe9a0453

@Dragofer does your version work in 2.12? I'm confused about what to download. I tried one z_addon_stealth_statistic_2_07.pk4 that I found somewhere in this thread, but it didn't work. I tried out @kcghost's version (it works on 2.12), but I found that it interferes too much with my usage of inventory items, so I'd like to try out yours to see if it's more comfortable to use. I think I've seen a youtuber use it before.

I looked but didn't see this video posted in these forums. It's pretty cool.

I mentioned this in a similar thread on TTLG. If there's going to be a new Thief game, my vote is for a remake of the original Dark Project.

Well, maybe we can skip the public flogging this time. Just wanted to say that there already is a System Shock Remake thread. Having a lot of fun playing it at the moment, by the way. It gets better and better. I was a tad underwhelmed by the first level (which I already knew from the demo) for some reason, but, the second level suited me much more.

It wasn't a "sacrifice", it was a deliberate decision. People wanted the game to be as close as possible to the original, including pixelated graphics. If you ask me, the former version based on the Unity engine looked and felt better. But, hey... I guess I'm not the right person to judge that, as I never played the original, and always found that the art style of System Shock 2 is much better anyway. This also illustrates the issue with community funded games: Too many cooks spoil the broth. In game design, you need freedom, not thousands of people who want you to do this and this and that. Just take a look at the Steam forums and see how all those wimps complain again about everything. Hopeless.

@gokudo Something wrong with the original thread?

So giving it none of those tags, but making the AI invisible, silent, non-solid, and on a team neutral to everyone would not work? Oh well, it was a horrible inelegant idea anyway.

What I understood is that the idea of TDM was born from that it was unclear if T3 would get a level editor at the time. Source: https://web.archive.org/web/20050218173856/http://evilavatar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=268

Functionality was broken between 2.10 and 2.12 dev. Currently you need 2.12 beta to make this work. Here is a test-mission with 4 possible briefing configurations with added Starter Location selection: text_mainmenu_briefing.gui - Standard text-based briefing nav_mainmenu_briefing.gui - Sotha's Advanced text + image based manual navigated briefing anim_mainmenu_briefing.gui - Sotha's Advanced text + image based auto-animated briefing vidintro_mainmenu_briefing.gui - Only Starter location selection briefing, for when video-briefing is used. The test-mission is set-up as a 2 mission campaign, where only the briefing for the first mission uses the location selection. This can also be used as a starter base for the functionally used inside your own mission. To test it, you have to rename one of the above gui files, so that the filename is: mainmenu_briefing.gui To make it work, you have to unzip the 7-zip archive inside tdm's fms folder. After that, you have to navigate to subfolder gui and unzip the file assetz.7z in it (I had to do this because of filesize restriction). Would be nice if someone could test it. Edit: I linked to it on the wiki: https://wiki.thedarkmod.com/index.php?title=Briefing#Controlling_Where_the_Player_Starts starterlocation_test.7z

This one is really essential: https://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=138607 Should work fine with the GOG version.

https://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=152224 There is a new mapping contest over on TTLG for the Thief: Deadly Shadows 20th Anniversary and the organizers were kind enough to include The Dark Mod along with all of the Thief games as an options for making a mission to submit as an entry. The deadline is a year from yesterday and the rules are pretty open. I recommend going to the original thread for the details but I will summarize here: Rules: - The mission(s) can be for Thief 1, Thief 2, Deadly Shadows or The Dark Mod. - Collaborations are allowed. - Contestants can use any custom resource they want, though TDM cannot use the Deadly Shadows resource pack. - Contestants can submit more than one mission. - Contestants can enter anonymously. - The mission(s) can be of any size. Using prefabs is allowed but the idea is this is a new mission and starting from an abandoned map or importing large areas from other maps is not allowed. Naturally this is on the honor system as we have no way of validating. Mission themes and contents: There is no requirement from a theme or story viewpoint, however contestants might consider that many players may expect or prefer missions to be celebratory of Thief: Deadly Shadows in this respect: castles, manors, museums, ruins inhabited by Pagans and the like, with a balance of magic versus technology. This is entirely up to the authors, though, to follow or not - it is just mentioned here as an FYI and, while individual voters may of course choose to vote higher or lower based on this on their own, it will not be a criteria used explicitly in voting or scoring. Deadline: May 25th, 2024 at 23:59 Pacific Time. See the TTLG thread for details on submissions and the voting process. Provided I can make the deadline I hope to participate. It would be nice to see the entire community do something together, and expressing our complicated relationship with this divisive game seems as good a pretext as any.

quite a bit more life in the old hardware than most would imagine, new features are mostly good but not allways as was seen over the years (example intel started using TIM internally in there cpu's instead of soldering the chip to the IHS the result was way worse thermals and subsequently the chip could not reach higher clocks) they finally got the hint but it took about 10 years and now all the higher end intel cpu's are soldered again. example from UEFI while mostly a nice change it turned out corsairs ICUE would break some UEFI bioses (i had that unfortunate experience with a PC i built for a friend). My old intel 3930K is still happily chugging along with an OC of 5.2 ghz on air newer hitting 80 " which is an OC of 2 ghz it runs 3.2 ghz when not overclocked by comparison my devils canyon 4790k which is a good deal newer can barely do an OC of 200 mhz before it hits 95 " with a liquid cooling system... by comparison the devils canyon runs 4 ghz standard so a bit faster than the old sandy bridge but even at stock the devils canyon only beats it in single thread applications despite having a higher clock and not by a lot.

>Processor: AMD Ryzen 7 2700X Eight-Core Processor (16 CPUs), ~3.7GHz; Intel i5 7000 series Intel i5 7000 series = 4-core, 4-thread Kaby Lake CPUs. So no, your 5600X or whatever will be just fine. These companies can write whatever they want as minimum/recommended specs and it doesn't have to make any sense. But you've also misinterpreted it.

Thanks for the Vicuna link. I need to do more research on open source chatbot solutions. I have a couple of projects in the works that would benefit from a home grown language model, plus it would be good experience. Seeing what others have done with modest resources is good inspiration. Also I must admit I was wrong earlier in this thread about open source not being able to compete with big tech. It did not occur to me that big industrial model builders would be incentivized to gift their own models into the public domain in order to gain mind share with open source ecosystems that can out-innovate them on the application side. The upside for them is that they can effectively crowd source the R&D to turn their fancy tech demo into actually valuable products for the open market and for their own internal consumption. Google at least is taking that concept seriously. Lastly: The results of a couple of gpt-4s attempts are fascinating to me... I got some really interesting failure points, including a rare pattern hypnosis where it fell into a meaningless cycle of iterative modulus calculations. But I doubt you guys want to read 4 pages of that, so here's the beginning and the end. Note for anyone wondering what is going on, the root mistake is a heuristic error humans also make: assuming no one would ask a stupid question. Thus the pattern recognitions assumes we want the complex systematic solution for the closest hard problem... which is what it gives above. Moreover because the question is so minimal it actually half asses its answer here: ignoring the fact that it already knows next Easter falls on March 31, 2024 from reading online calendars! What's more, it has more than enough information in its memory to attempt the computus calculation (albeit unsuccessfully in every attempt I saw). Once again we see that context is king for LLMs. In fact we can even break it out of the faulty heuristic with a small change to the prompt:

That is slightly less than 4k but imo is still a really a high rez, specially for this engine, that is ~7.3 million pixels that the engine has to calculate/shade, per pixel 60 times or more, every second! also why MSAA (multisampling anti-alising) can be very expensive on this engine, it increases pixel count. So like nbohr1more said, if you have it on, lower it or better disable MSAA, at that rez IMO you don't need it anyway and it has no effect on geometry faces/surfaces, only on geometry edges and if you really want AA, also like nbohr1more said, force a post process one (FXAA or better if possible TAA) using the Nvidia driver. You can also try to lower the rendering scale and increase the sharpening filter to counter balance the loss of definition in the video options menu. About the CPU the fact you have low CPU utilization and high GPU utilization, shows you are getting GPU bound in this case, so increasing thread count in the game console, I don't think will help but try it. Btw sorry if you already know this but if you don't, at lest may explain to you why this "old" game, is so heavy even for your modern very expensive GPU, this game uses a modified Doom 3 engine, with better support for multicore CPU's and other modern stuff making it way faster than original Doom 3 engine, but is still using the old forward render and unlike more modern renders like deferred render or forward+, that can render hundreds of (non shadow casting) dynamic lights, before getting slow, a old forward render like of Doom3/TDM, can get really slow with a relatively low number of dynamic lights in a scene, worse if they all cast shadows, and on this game all lights are fully dynamic and in many missions most of them cast shadows, real time shadows, there's no light baking of any kind.

Here you can select configuration. The default one is "Debug" for some reason. It is interesting, because we almost never use pure Debug these days The problem is that "Debug", "Debug Editable", "Debug Fast" all use FASTLINK setting for debug information, which makes PDB file useless. Only "Release" configuration can generate crashdumps that can be passed to someone else for analysis (with PDB file of course). It looks like I can see some stack traces, and the main thread seems to "wait for frontend". It would be interesting to see what is wrong with e->spawnArgs value, but my debugger does not show anything.

Yes, overwriting individual core entities with custom .def files in an FM archive is now uncomplicated after the overwrite rules were changed in a recent TDM version. The FM will be isolated from any future changes to the player entity, however - even if they may be rare.

I set it up ages ago, and yeah it was intended for the community. It was never my intention to own or gatekeep it (but it does need some administration). I was trying to come up with a central place where we could store/share assets instead of trying to hunt down .pk4 files and dealing with broken links, etc. There didn't seem to be much interest in it though (for various reasons, there's a forum thread about it somewhere). But it's there and I can help anyone get started with it. The main limitation is individual files can't exceed 100 MB. I would agree it's not the perfect solution for an asset repository, but practically speaking you can get quite far with it.