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Wikipedia entry for TDM

Bikerdude

By Bikerdude
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lost_soul

lost_soul

Posted
Posted

Not sure what criteria they use over at Wikipedia to determine what is allowed and what is not. Free games like Tremulous and Urban Terror have articles there (which began life as Quake 3 mods). I seem to recall some other articles about game mods getting deleted though. Hopefully there can be a TDM article, or at least a mension of TDM in the Thief articles.

--- War does not decide who is right, war decides who is left.

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nbohr1more

nbohr1more

Posted
Posted

Yep this is an interesting matter. I wonder if Demagogue or someone with more legal understanding would say about having TDM listed on the Thief series wiki. Could that be used in a body of evidence to "prove" infringement? A standalone wiki entry would be cool but Mods do have problems with their notability requirements.

 

The talk page has a Mods and Total conversions inquiry but nobody has responded to it. I suppose if no legal problems are imagined we can just bulldoze an entry into the Thief general series article and see if it gets edited into oblivion... ? :unsure:

Please visit TDM's IndieDB site and help promote the mod:

 

http://www.indiedb.com/mods/the-dark-mod

 

(Yeah, shameless promotion... but traffic is traffic folks...)

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Tels

Tels

Posted
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In the german wikipedia-article of Thief is a small section about TDM and it is actually very up-to-date (nov. 8th).

 

That was me :) I just forgot that editing in the English Wikipedia does not mean you are looged into the German Wikipedia, so it ended up as an anonymous edit...

 

On the english wikipedia is also an article about the thief series in general by the way, which would rather be the proper place for a TDM section.

 

Already thought about a TDM German article, but the Germans are quicky picky and speedy-delete a lot of things. I think we might prove we are "noteworthy" because we appeared on the disk of a UK game magazin, but I momentarily forgot the magazin,and how can we prove we really did? Does someone have scans?

"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man." -- George Bernard Shaw (1856 - 1950)

 

"Remember: If the game lets you do it, it's not cheating." -- Xarax

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Serpentine

Serpentine

Posted
Posted

iirc there was a short TDM article on Wikipedia a while back(2008-late 2009?), it was deleted because someone claimed that the mod was not notable and sounded like it had been written by a team member. Cant find the deletion log however, but I think they prune those after a while for small articles. Strangely enough there are far less notable mods, some of which arn't released and badly formatted blurbs.

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Fidcal

Fidcal

Posted
Posted

That was me :) I just forgot that editing in the English Wikipedia does not mean you are looged into the German Wikipedia, so it ended up as an anonymous edit...

 

 

 

Already thought about a TDM German article, but the Germans are quicky picky and speedy-delete a lot of things. I think we might prove we are "noteworthy" because we appeared on the disk of a UK game magazin, but I momentarily forgot the magazin,and how can we prove we really did? Does someone have scans?

I have an original copy somewhere so I could do a scan. I think it was PC Gamer or somesuch. Not sure what it proves though.
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nbohr1more

nbohr1more

Posted
Posted (edited)

They consider any mainstream (commercial) publication "notable" so that should keep them from outright insta-deleting the article. :)

Edited by nbohr1more

Please visit TDM's IndieDB site and help promote the mod:

 

http://www.indiedb.com/mods/the-dark-mod

 

(Yeah, shameless promotion... but traffic is traffic folks...)

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Tels

Tels

Posted
Posted

They consider any mainstream (commercial) publication "notable" so that should keep them from outright insta-deleting the article. :)

 

Yep, thats the point. It doesn't matter for the German wikipedia that you sell 100000+ copies on Steam, but get mentioned in the local paper, you are noteworthy :rolleyes: Anyway, a scan of that magazine would be very welcome. I'd like to mirror it on bloodgate.com, too.

"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man." -- George Bernard Shaw (1856 - 1950)

 

"Remember: If the game lets you do it, it's not cheating." -- Xarax

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Aprilsister

Aprilsister

Posted
Posted

TDM deserves it's own Wikientry and then to have a mention on the Thief Wiki where the TDM Wikientry is linked and vice versa. If the entry is well-written (which nbohr can do) I think Wikipedia will keep it. And as you guys say if you can put some citations along the way all the better so if there is anywhere that TDM has been mentioned do your best to put those in and link them in the footnotes.

 

DarkRadiant as well might be mentioned in the TDM or even given its own Wikientry and it can be linked to Wikis for D3, mods and on and on. It is already mentioned here

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GtkRadiant

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Tels

Tels

Posted
Posted

Here's the original scan:

 

 

 

Thanx a lot, mirrored here:

 

http://www.bloodgate.com/mirrors/tdm/pub/pcGamer_tdm.jpg

 

http://www.bloodgate.com/mirrors/tdm/pub/

 

Unless someone beats me to it, expect a German Wikipedia entry in a few hours.

"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man." -- George Bernard Shaw (1856 - 1950)

 

"Remember: If the game lets you do it, it's not cheating." -- Xarax

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Tels

Tels

Posted
Posted

Unless someone beats me to it, expect a German Wikipedia entry in a few hours.

 

Done: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Dark_Mod

 

Given that the English version was deleted in 2007 (phew, glad we don't pay attention to Wikipedia), I expect the German version will be speedy-deleted, too. :( But maybe they surprise us and let it be.

 

Edit: Now also with an infobox and a bit of backgrouns story (needs expanding, but I think I'll wait a few days if it gets deleted or not). I found a few other mods by searching for "moddb", like http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_Selection or http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Reality so I think if they delete our article, we have a few things to say about that.

"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man." -- George Bernard Shaw (1856 - 1950)

 

"Remember: If the game lets you do it, it's not cheating." -- Xarax

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greebo

greebo

Posted
Posted

Speed-deleting wikipedia articles? What has happened to Wikipedia, for fuck's sake? Does this article contain images of two girls doing a threesome with a monkey or - even worse - violate any copyright? I can understand deleting spam and porn stubs or maybe misleading or bluntly written advertisements, but deleting articles just because it isn't worth keeping?

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7upMan

7upMan

Posted
Posted

The magic word is "relevance". If an admin thinks that the article is not relevant, then he'll delete it without any second thought. It's the same crap with inclusionists vs. exclusionists. My stand on this is that Wikipedia is the place where mankind's knowledge is collected, so I think that exclusionism should have no place there. After all, who decides what is relevant or not? My thinking is that it's better to include everything that's connected with the topic of the respective article and to structure the information in a way that you can find the info you're looking for fast. That's what hyperlinks and anchors are for, after all.

My Eigenvalue is bigger than your Eigenvalue.

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7upMan

7upMan

Posted
Posted

Here's the original scan:

 

Thanks. Say, has the model of that guy ever been used anywhere else? I don't remember seeing it in any FM. Or maybe it's just the light?

My Eigenvalue is bigger than your Eigenvalue.

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Tels

Tels

Posted
Posted

Thanks. Say, has the model of that guy ever been used anywhere else? I don't remember seeing it in any FM. Or maybe it's just the light?

 

This is from Thief's Den, the first version. I think he no longer exists (as we have no "fat" characters or animations for them, sadly).

"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man." -- George Bernard Shaw (1856 - 1950)

 

"Remember: If the game lets you do it, it's not cheating." -- Xarax

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Melan

Melan

Posted
Posted

Wikipedia has developed a false sense of importance since they have been mentioned in the mainstream press, which results in a lot of editors thinking that this sort of content is beneath them (while obsessive, five-page writeups of comic book characters aren't, because they are, uh, notable in an online encyclopedia for being published in print). The social dynamics are all screwed up too, since the decision-making process is highly dependent on whoever can invest more time into hair-splitting, obfuscation, and using a collection of protocols to stifle opposing views. It is the ultimate experiment in post-modernism, and the world's greatest prowling ground for obsessive nitwits.

 

Granted, I like a lot of the content, and it is convenient, but don't expect anything pleasant. Assumptions of good faith and open-mindedness are not wiki-protocols.

Come the time of peril, did the ground gape, and did the dead rest unquiet 'gainst us. Our bands of iron and hammers of stone prevailed not, and some did doubt the Builder's plan. But the seals held strong, and the few did triumph, and the doubters were lain into the foundations of the new sanctum. -- Collected letters of the Smith-in-Exile, Civitas Approved

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Tels

Tels

Posted
Posted

@greebo:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deletionism_and_inclusionism_in_Wikipedia (Although it does not really cover the most controversial things). Also, the German Wikipedia is deleting things much much faster than the English one.

 

See: http://www.spiegel.de/netzwelt/web/0,1518,656214,00.html and http://aggregat7.ath.cx/2009/10/19/99-aller-deutschen-sind-irrelevant (which summarizes the entire German "shizophrenie" best).

"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man." -- George Bernard Shaw (1856 - 1950)

 

"Remember: If the game lets you do it, it's not cheating." -- Xarax

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OrbWeaver

OrbWeaver

Posted
Posted

I can understand why Wikipedia don't want any old nutter writing an article about themselves, so some level of notability is probably necessary. However, the whole "it isn't notable unless it's printed" thing is just hilarious. What century do they think we are living in?

 

I've also seen some very stupid arguments along the lines of "Wikipedia shouldn't allow articles about X, Y, Z because of $(some reason which basically boils down to "I'm not interested in them")". It seems to be based on the same logical fallacy that underpins the "There are too many Linux distros" meme: if we somehow prevent people from working on the thing's I'm not interested in, they will be forced to work on the things I am interested in.

DarkRadiant homepage ⋄ DarkRadiant user guide ⋄ OrbWeaver's Dark Ambients ⋄ Blender export scripts

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7upMan

7upMan

Posted
Posted

This is from Thief's Den, the first version. I think he no longer exists (as we have no "fat" characters or animations for them, sadly).

 

This is too bad, because I bet Noisycricket would have a blast doing those animations - once he's finished with the female anims, that is.  ^_^

My Eigenvalue is bigger than your Eigenvalue.

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Bikerdude

Bikerdude

Posted
  • Author
Posted (edited)

hair-splitting, obfuscation, and using a collection of protocols to stifle opposing views. It is the ultimate experiment in post-modernism, and the world's greatest prowling ground for obsessive nitwits. Granted, I like a lot of the content, and it is convenient, but don't expect anything pleasant. Assumptions of good faith and open-mindedness are not wiki-protocols.

It dosent help that wikipedia along with the likes of google and facebook are jewish-american owned so will be inherently biased. But that is whole nother ball game and shouldn't have any direct effect on tdm.

Edited by Bikerdude
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Springheel

Springheel

Posted
Posted
Thanks. Say, has the model of that guy ever been used anywhere else? I don't remember seeing it in any FM. Or maybe it's just the light?

 

That was an old character that has been updated since (see below).

 

This is too bad, because I bet Noisycricket would have a blast doing those animations

 

The thug was never one of the "heavy" characters, but we do have a few of those sitting around that need animations.

TDM Missions:   A Score to Settle  *  A Reputation to Uphold  *  A New Job  *  A Matter of Hours

Video Series:   Springheel's Modules  *  Speedbuild Challenge  *  New Mappers Workshop  *  Building Traps

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Melan

Melan

Posted
Posted

Well, the goofy round-headed fellow would qualify as a different character - even if only as a separate head.

Come the time of peril, did the ground gape, and did the dead rest unquiet 'gainst us. Our bands of iron and hammers of stone prevailed not, and some did doubt the Builder's plan. But the seals held strong, and the few did triumph, and the doubters were lain into the foundations of the new sanctum. -- Collected letters of the Smith-in-Exile, Civitas Approved

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