Story, Plot and Narrative Design Discussion Thread

[Springheel]

Yes, that's great. Does it fit the canon? Thank you very much.

Bridgeport doesn't have a baron. I suppose it might have once, but barons usually rule over territories, not individual cities. Also, why would a baron have a crown? Anyone with a crown is either a price, king, or emperor.

 

I'd recommend making him either a past emperor, a reknowned king that was conquered by the empire, or a king of Menoa. What purpose does the bust serve?

[Baal]

It is a piece of the private collection of someone and is not an integral part of the story. It can be anything, really. The crown can go if it's unfitting.

The bust is part of a sideobjective, so it needs to stand out a little. And a name that I can refer to in the objective text would be good. That's it for constraints.

[Springheel]

If it's not something that's going to be expanded upon in a readable, it would probably be best to keep it as an emperor. That way no explanation is necessary. I don't think any past Emperors have been named yet. Any vaguely Romanic name would do. Emperor Honorius III?

[Baal]

That would be fine too. Something more than just a name would be nice. But neither writing nor history are my strong suits.

@Moonbo Want to try again?

[Noordung]

Bridgeport doesn't have a baron. I suppose it might have once, but barons usually rule over territories, not individual cities. Also, why would a baron have a crown? Anyone with a crown is either a price, king, or emperor.

 

I'd recommend making him either a past emperor, a reknowned king that was conquered by the empire, or a king of Menoa. What purpose does the bust serve?

Does the titles have to be the same as in real world? Could not baron be lower/higher title as in real world? Could we not use new titles for royal/church people?

Or are there titles in wiki article?

Edited March 31, 2015 by Noordung

[Moonbo]

@Baal, feel free to tweak what I wrote, I'm happy with it as-is.

[Baal]

Ok, I'll just take of the crown and he's a baron.

[Springheel]

Does the titles have to be the same as in real world? Could not baron be lower/higher title as in real world? Could we not use new titles for royal/church people?

 

It doesn't have to be, but what would be the point of changing it? The less consistent our setting is with what people are familiar with, the more exposition it takes to explain it, and we don't have really good means of doing that kind of thing. That majority of people don't even read the information on wiki, and the stuff that's there just barely scratches the surface of what a mapper might want to know, as this thread demonstrates.

[Melan]

Also, why would a baron have a crown? Anyone with a crown is either a price, king, or emperor.

Why would some petty lord have a sceptre and keep it in a private throne room?

[Noordung]

It doesn't have to be, but what would be the point of changing it? The less consistent our setting is with what people are familiar with, the more exposition it takes to explain it, and we don't have really good means of doing that kind of thing. That majority of people don't even read the information on wiki, and the stuff that's there just barely scratches the surface of what a mapper might want to know, as this thread demonstrates.

Good point.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baronbut baron is very low title. So if there are lords in Bridgeport there should be even more barons.

[Bikerdude]

Why would some petty lord have a sceptre and keep it in a private throne room?

[VanishedOne]

In the real world there is such a thing as a baronial coronet, though whether a baron would be 'crowned' with it is another question.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coronet

Edited April 1, 2015 by VanishedOne

[Springheel]

Why would some petty lord have a sceptre and keep it in a private throne room?

 

A egotistical baron might make a crown for himself, but it's not likely his statue would have a crown, unless he commissioned it himself or something. Anything is possible, but generally, if it quacks it should be a duck unless some exposition is provided to explain why it's not.

 

So if there are lords in Bridgeport there should be even more barons.

"The head of the city council is the Lord Mayor, who is elected by the council aldermen to serve a limited term. Beneath the Lord Mayor are Aldermen and Councillors who represent city wards.

Bridgeport is a Free Imperial City, meaning the Lord Mayor answers directly to the Emperor. In practice, the City Council wields a great deal of power."

In the real world there is such a thing as a baronial coronet, though whether a baron would be 'crowned' with it is another question.

 

That's just for coats of arms, isn't it? Did they ever actually physically wear them?

[VanishedOne]

That's just for coats of arms, isn't it? Did they ever actually physically wear them?

In the British peerage they're part of the ceremonial dress for monarchs' coronations, so yes, albeit extremely rarely. You can see peers in coronation dress in this image: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Parris_-_Coronation_of_Queen_Victoria.PNG

 

I don't know about other peerages, offhand. Edit: also, coronets may formerly have been worn at investiture: http://www.reocities.com/noelcox/coronets.htmsays, 'Investiture, or Coronation Robes, and their coronets, have only been worn at Coronations since the formal investiture was replaced by the informal practice of introducing peers in 1621.'

Edited April 1, 2015 by VanishedOne

[Obsttorte]

Why would some petty lord have a sceptre and keep it in a private throne room?

Reminds me of the proverb with the nail and the head Very good.

[Petike the Taffer]

If I am not too late, I propose naming the fellow represented by the bust as "Imperator Athanasius II. (741-792), great reformer of The Empire".

Alternatively, some shorter version, like Athanasus.

Edited November 9, 2019 by Petike the Taffer
more compact post

[Noordung]

Athanasus II. Emperor of whole civilized world first hammer of empire builders church... I think he need at least 3 more titles.

[Baal]

Thanks, I already went with Moonbo's suggestion. Can someone else put this name on a bust and build a mission around it?

[Deadlove]

It's most likely outside the range of most mission authors, but the player having voice over triggers at different spots are what furthered the story a lot in this other game that I like a lot called Thief, they had a dedicated voice actor that did voice overs during gameplay and it was one a highlight of the game. Maybe if the mission author can post to ask someone for help doing voice over work and be able to give someone a script to read off of. I know Goldwell does good voice overs for this kind of thing.

[Petike the Taffer]

I've been thinking about triggered voice overs a bit too, as I'd like to incorporate some into my own FM. The story won't work without the two main characters exchanging some banter, so I'll need to figure it out.

[Petike the Taffer]

Demagogue's Story and Plot design article on the wiki has already been recommended here, but reading through the various tutorials on the wiki, I think sotha's Mission Design Tips article is also worthy of a mention. It focuses on the non-technical, but still gameplay-related challenges of designing a mission. Naturally, this also relates to how the basics of the mission are plotted out and how the objectives of a mission are presented to a player. I especially like the "always bet on stupidity" remark aimed at overly vague or overly complicated puzzle/secret design.

[Petike the Taffer]

Not one for necros, but if anyone would want to discuss narrative elements for their FMs, I feel this is by far the best thread on the subject. Yes, it is old, but as the person who started it in the first place, I say to all FM authors, old and new: Feel free to jump in here and discuss things.

[Jedi_Wannabe]

Through VO’s and internal monologue I want my thief to grow over the course of my campaign from being arrogant, cynical, self-absorbed and cold-hearted, to someone who forced into a predicament uses his growing taffing skills to unravel a mystery for the greater good. The last mission will see him take up more of a Robin Hood role, as opposed to “steal this to pay the bills”.

a four and a half year necro ain’t bad, I revived a decade old dmap thread one time lol

Edited December 3, 2019 by Jedi_Wannabe

[Petike the Taffer]

35 minutes ago, Jedi_Wannabe said:

Through VO’s and internal monologue I want my thief to grow over the course of my campaign from being arrogant, cynical, self-absorbed and cold-hearted, to someone who forced into a predicament uses his growing taffing skills to unravel a mystery for the greater good. The last mission will see him take up more of a Robin Hood role, as opposed to “steal this to pay the bills”.

a four and a half year necro ain’t bad, I revived a decade old dmap thread one time lol

A very good narrative goal !

I have something similar planned for the main characters in my Partners in Crime series. On the other hand, I don't want to have too many in-game voiceovers or pre-scripted conversations in those missions, and I want to keep most of the character development to readables and what the situation is at the outset of each mission. At least in my case, I feel less is more, and being very precise in how many player-based VOs and conversations between characters I use in a single mission could yield better results to what I have in plan.

Obviously, everyone has to approach their own works from their own individual angle. That's for the best.

[Petike the Taffer]

As the author of this older thread, is it all right if I revive it ?

I myself have a few questions about narrative structure while making an FM, and I don't want to make a completely new thread. Especially when this thread is still rather short. We don't need ten different threads with the exact same topic.

 

Edited March 31, 2024 by Petike the Taffer