Itches, Glitches & Anything Else...

[i30817 24]

Far better to identify the fp bug(s) in darkradiant....

Edited October 5, 2012 by i30817

[RPGista 604]

Im finding several mutilated brush/patch constructions (even func_statics) around my map the more I edit it. I had noticed them before sometimes, but this is really keeping me from editting it further as many complex objects I built are becoming corrupted, some of them quite hard to rebuild (roof layers, cornices, shelves, wood constructions, etc).

 

 

Is there any way of solving this DR issue? I dont really feel safe in editting the map anymore, if the editor will keep altering those geometries, and there's no way of preventing the gradual deterioration from happening.

Edited October 27, 2012 by RPGista

[RPGista 604]

Double post.

Edited October 27, 2012 by RPGista

[Sotha 1909]

Is this due to the DR object corruption bug?

 

Anyhow, if the ASE-exporter is working properly now, you might turn the objects you build in DR into ASE models. Then they will not change ever again. Also memory impact will be lower if you use multiple times the same ase model. This would be perfect for some windows/shelves/etc. The problem with the ase-exporter was that it sometimes applied wrong textures on the wrong faces, but that was long a while ago.

[ungoliant 120]

Was messing around with in the north in DR, and noticed the use of "snd_move" spawnarg on doors. This spawnarg is not listed on the default spawnarg list for adding properties, and the bloodgate documentation states its use for moving elevators. 1-2 years ago i spent about 6 hours of my life writing a custom script to accomplish what this spawnarg does by itself, because I didn't know it could be used for doors, or in what context. The only documentation i was able to find afterwards (when i knew what to look for), was here: http://wiki.thedarkmod.com/index.php?title=Doors. Just this one place.

 

This is such a useful tool, I really think that mover_doors, and sliding doors, should inherit this spawnarg by default, (with a proper description, not: for use with elevators), to save people like me that don't know any better a lot of trouble.

 

Oh right, before i forget to metion, the actual function of this spawnarg with doors is to play a sound when a door *starts* closing, and can still be augmented with a sound *on* close when it snaps shut, snd_close

[Bikerdude 3742]

Im finding several mutilated brush/patch constructions (even func_statics) around my map the more I edit itIs there any way of solving this DR issue?

Is this due to the DR object corruption bug?

As Sotha has said this will be the object corruption bug, but this only happens when you move the items around the map. So have any of the items that have corruption been moved at all..?

[grayman 2982]

What exactly is the object corruption bug? I'm aware of DR's problem with brush faces shifting around when the map is saved and re-read, but not a bug that causes corruption because something gets moved.

[Sotha 1909]

Be it zis one?

http://forums.thedarkmod.com/topic/13983-object-corruption-in-dr/

 

At least I noticed my stuff in PB got corrupted. I made a slanted roof out of two brushes and copied and rotated it around. At some point I noticed there was a crack between to brushes through which I could see caulk. That could not have possibly been there when I made the original roof: I used clipper to cut it. So the crack must have come from some floating-point-calculati-o-matic thingy I don't understand at all during the cloning & moving & rotating. I cannot remember what DR version I used with PB, though...

[Obsttorte 1556]

some floating-point-calculati-o-matic thingy I don't understand at all

 

, what a beautyful neologism

 

for the floating-point errors:

 

imagine a 2D grid where the gridpoints are only whole numbers and a square with side length one, that has it's lower left corner at (0,0)

if you now take this square and rotate it by 45 degrees around its center, the new corners of it will be fitted to the grid points again, what will most certainly not end up with a square anymore

 

floating-point errors are roughly the same, only that the grid is not as rough

there also be some rounding errors during the calculation of the rotation, of course

[RPGista 604]

Indeed. The object shown (cornice) is composed of patch surfaces and regular brushes, made func-static and wasnt moved at all. If you play the mission, it is there, intact. The picture shows how it is looking now after working with the map for a bunch of weeks, in a different area altogether. Like this object, Im noticing many others as I move around. This means I'll have to go through the whole map looking for objects to replace by copying and pasting from a previous version of the map, considering you still have one.

 

Im quite sure I snapped most, if not all surfaces and brushes to the grid, with complex things I would snap them to the smallest one. The problem seems particularly agressive towards small geometry, things of 1-2 units and below.

 

This was discussed before but I thought I should point it out again as this problem seems quite serious to me.

Edited November 2, 2012 by RPGista

[Tels 279]

Was messing around with in the north in DR, and noticed the use of "snd_move" spawnarg on doors. This spawnarg is not listed on the default spawnarg list for adding properties, and the bloodgate documentation states its use for moving elevators. 1-2 years ago i spent about 6 hours of my life writing a custom script to accomplish what this spawnarg does by itself, because I didn't know it could be used for doors, or in what context. The only documentation i was able to find afterwards (when i knew what to look for), was here: http://wiki.thedarkm...hp?title=Doors. Just this one place.

 

This is such a useful tool, I really think that mover_doors, and sliding doors, should inherit this spawnarg by default, (with a proper description, not: for use with elevators), to save people like me that don't know any better a lot of trouble.

 

Oh right, before i forget to metion, the actual function of this spawnarg with doors is to play a sound when a door *starts* closing, and can still be augmented with a sound *on* close when it snaps shut, snd_close

 

Since I've stumbled over the same issue (and even tracked a needless bugreport), I've just commited the following:

 

Index: def/tdm_mover_base.def
===================================================================
--- def/tdm_mover_base.def	  (revision 13248)
+++ def/tdm_mover_base.def	  (working copy)
@@ -54,12 +54,13 @@
    "editor_var lock_picktype"			  "This is a sequence of characters defining the lockpick types which need to be used on this mover. For instance, 'bs' means that the player must use the 'bent' lockpick ('b') and the 'snake' lockpick ('s') - in this order - to pick this lock."
    "editor_var lock_pins"				  "This goes alongside 'lock_picktype' and defines how many samples each pin has (minimum is 5)."

-	   "editor_snd snd_open"		   "Points to the sound shader to play while the mover opens."
-	   "editor_snd snd_close"		  "Points to the sound shader to play while the mover closes."
+	   "editor_snd snd_move"		   "Points to the sound shader to play while the mover is opening or closing."
+	   "editor_snd snd_open"		   "Points to the sound shader to play when the mover starts to open."
+	   "editor_snd snd_close"		  "Points to the sound shader to play when the mover has been closed."
    "editor_snd snd_lock"		   "Points to the sound shader to play while the mover locks."
    "editor_snd snd_locked"		 "Points to the sound shader to play when the mover is frobbed while being locked."
    "editor_snd snd_unlock"		 "Points to the sound shader to play while the mover unlocks."
-    "editor_snd snd_silence"   "Points to the empty sound shader. Don't change this."
+	   "editor_snd snd_silence"	    "Points to the empty sound shader. Don't change this."

    "editor_snd snd_lockpick_pin_NN"	    "Defines the sample sound for the pin with NN being in the range 00..14. The number must have a leading zero in it (e.g. '02')."
    "editor_snd snd_lockpick_pin_sweetspot" "Defines the sweet spot sound to be inserted into a pattern."

 

That should cover it.

[ungoliant 120]

@tels - one thing: are you sure this also plays during the opening? that could be... problematic. I assumed snd_open had the whole thing covered, since it can play from the time the door starts opening until it finishes opening. Is it possible that snd_move can be used only during the close process??

[grayman 2982]

snd_open plays once when the mover leaves the closed position. it does not loop,regardless of how long the open takes.

 

snd_move loops during opening or closing.

 

 

[Fidcal 175]

Is save snapshot dependent on autosave or is it separate? I've got it set but no shapshots folder has been created.

 

What I'm looking for is a backup to be created each time I save the main map, not on a timed basis.

[Obsttorte 1556]

What does the patch subdivide treshold setting in DR do?

[Mortem Desino 66]

What does the patch subdivide treshold setting in DR do?

If, for example, you have a cylinder patch: a low subdivide value will make it appear less round, like an 8-sided cylinder, High subdivide values will make it appear more round, like a 24-sided cylinder.

[Obsttorte 1556]

thank you

[Bikerdude 3742]

Under windows 8 the transparent patch issue is even worse than than under windows 7.

 

At some point soonish, I will do a bug report for it.

[SirGen 49]

I'm not sure if this is the right place to post this. I browsed for quite awhile without finding a similar thread.

 

I have very little experience with DarkRadiant. All I have done so far is remove some no kill objectives from a few missions.

 

I eventually want to make a mission, but in the meantime I've just been brain storming. I want to make a level inspired by a Final Fantasy III(VI) town. http://www.spriters-.../fullview/6679/ I don't know if this will run well or have bad framerate since It won't have twisting and turning streets that can take advantage of visportals.

 

Can anyone tell me if my idea could work well please.

Edited October 22, 2013 by SirGen

[rich_is_bored 281]

That's a pretty ambitious project that will require almost every trick in the book. I can sort of envision how you might use fences, skyboxes, and archways to assist with compartmentalization but overall it's a giant technical exercise. You will have to make compromises.

[Sotha 1909]

I'd say it is perfectly doable if you make it almost planar, or with only mild height differences. The images below show how I would do it:

 

See how the mountains and houses always block the view fully, they are like walls. If you would do it like this it would be pretty simple and the performance would be good. See how I added a dark gray house on the 3d image so that I can complete a visportal (green). RED on the top image is worldspawn, light gray and dark gray on the 3d image is ws, too.

 

If you would need to have a vista point from the top house to the houses below (if the projection is like how I read it), then it would be really difficulty. You would need to use a lot of LOD models and only a few AI in the outside area.

 

If you would do it like I propose in the pictures, you could have a lot of freedom and use plenty of AI.

[Sotha 1909]

Third method would be to do it by the vista-bubble -method, which is good for forests and other organic locations.

 

Again, you have visiblity bubbles with visportals in the choke points. The areas marked red must be worldspawn void sealing. i.e mountains, houses.

[SirGen 49]

That's a pretty ambitious project that will require almost every trick in the book. I can sort of envision how you might use fences, skyboxes, and archways to assist with compartmentalization but overall it's a giant technical exercise. You will have to make compromises.

Thanks for the good advice Edited October 22, 2013 by SirGen

[SirGen 49]

@Sotha Wow! Thanks for the help. This may sound silly, but since you are one of my favorite mappers, I feel honored that you put what seems to be a decent amount of effort into helping me understand how to go about making this mission I don't plan on copying this map exactly. I was just using it as inspiration. You and Rich have helped me visualize how I need to break up my map into smaller sections. Thanks again!

[Sotha 1909]

@Sotha Wow! Thanks for the help. This may sound silly, but since you are one of my favorite mappers, I feel honored that you put what seems to be a decent amount of effort into helping me understand how to go about making this mission I don't plan on copying this map exactly. I was just using it as inspiration. You and Rich have helped me visualize how I need to break up my map into smaller sections. Thanks again!

 

You are welcome!

 

Now, go forth and create! Reward me and the community with a new Kickass TDM FM!