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This is what I personally know about it: No diffuse means "skip the diffuse path code for this light" essentially means don't add/mix this light color/texture color info unto the surface, only use it as a simple b&w light. No specular is essentially the same but for specular textures, it skips the specular component/code/calculation and makes the light less heavy by removing the specular effect. About performance impact, for today GPU's, I don't think is as important as it was in 2004, but still, I'm sure it does have a small impact on performance, for the better of course, specially if done for many lights, but will also make them way more unrealistic. Btw lights with both no diffuse and nospecular, were used for the "projected shadows" or lights used to project fake "shadows" unto surfaces, this was used in Doom 3 to simulate basic, shadow mapping, for rotating fans and grid materials that use alpha textures, all because stencil shadows ignore those. Now that TDM has real shadow mapping, IMO such lights are less necessary and I wouldn't recommend their use for such effect. Thou lights with no specular and no normal mapping, are still useful for some effects, like simulating casting colored light from painted glass, like something bellow, and they are faster then normal lights:

Sure! My first draft for a wiki article "Lightgem" would look like this: " [[File:Hud.jpg|right|thumb|The lightgem is shown as part of the [[The_Dark_Mod_Gameplay#HUD_(Heads-Up_Display)|HUD]]:<br/>2. A breath indicator when underwater<br/>3. The lightgem itself<br/>4. A health indicator.<br/>Two wings flank the lightgem indicating if the player is crouching.]] The '''lightgem''' is a light indigator on the [[The_Dark_Mod_Gameplay#HUD_(Heads-Up_Display)|HUD]] and an important part of [[The Dark Mod Gameplay]]. The lightgem itself indicates how visible the player is. The visibility is based on how much light is hitting the player, but also depends on whether you are crouched, moving, have a weapon drawn, or being under water. The wings on either side of the gem indicates when the player is crouching. Below the lightgem is a health indicator. When the player is injured, a small red bar appears below the lightgem. The bar shows how much health you have left and decreases from right to left. Health potions and various types of food will replenish health. The bar remains visible until the health is fully restored. Above the lightgem is a breath indicator. When the player is under water, a small blue bar appears above the lightgem. The bar shows how much air you have left and decreases from right to left. When the bar runs out, you'll begin to take damage. Surfacing or using a Breath Potion will restore your air bar. The lightgem is an object that the player always carries and is not visible in the [[inventory]]. A user can disable the lightgem and the wings in Settings - Gameplay - General - Hide Lightgem. The health indicator and breath indicator will remain visible. [[Category:Equipment]] " (With the caveat that I would need to use the preview-functionality to fix any formatting errors I may have made before publishing it.) I would also * link "BREATH INDICATOR", "LIGHTGEM", and "HEALTH INDICATOR" from "The_Dark_Mod_Gameplay#HUD_(Heads-Up_Display)" to the new article "Lightgem". * create "health indicator" redirecting to "lightgem" ("#redirect[[lightgem]]") * create "breath indicator" redirecting to "lightgem" I registered on The Dark Mod Bugtracker on 29 December and I have since reported 68 issues from a personal log of issues that I had assembled during hours of testing TDM 2.11. The reports are not perfect, but I think they show my intentions are good. I understand the reluctance, especially if there have been incidents of spammers on the wiki, but as an open source project relying on volunteer work it is also important to keep a low threshold for contributing to the product. If I'm not up to par, you'll discover it quickly. Or, rather, you would have already discovered it in the Bugtracker.

@snatcher I understand that when you feel your work doesn't live up to your goals that you don't want it out in the wild advertising your own perceived shortcomings but that leads to a troubling dilemma of authors who are never satisfied with their work offering fleeting access to their in-progress designs then rescinding them or allowing them to be lost. When I was a member of Doom3world forums, I would often see members do interesting experiments and sometimes that work would languish until someone new would examine it and pickup the torch. This seemed like a perfectly viable system until Doom3world was killed by spambots and countless projects and conceptual works were lost. I guess what I am trying to say is that mods don't need to be perfect to be valuable. If they contain some grain of a useable feature they might be adapted by mission authors in custom scenarios. They might offer instructive details that others trying to achieve the same results can examine. It would be great if known compelling works were kept somewhere safe other than via forum attachments and temporary file sharing sites. I suppose we used to collect such things in our internal SVN for safe keeping but even that isn't always viable. If folks would rather not post beta or incomplete mods to TDM's Moddb page, perhaps they would consider creating their own Moddb page or allow them to be added to my page for safe keeping. Please don't look at this as some sort of pressure campaign or anything. I fully understand anyone not willing to put their name next to something they aren't fully happy with. As a general proviso, ( if possible \ permitted ) I just want to prevent the loss of some valuable investigations and formative works. The end of Doom3world was a digital apocalypse similar to the death of photobucket. It is one of my greatest fears that TDM will become a digital memory with only the skeletons of old forum threads at the wayback archive site.

Congrats on the release! Remember to check ThiefGuild as well as the DarkFate forums (via Google Translate) for additional feedback.

Complaint From Players The player must pick up candles before extinguishing them, and then the player must remember to drop the candle. The player must drag a body before shouldering it (picking it up), and the player must remember to frob again to stop dragging the body. The player finds this annoying or easy to make mistakes. For players who ghost, some of them have the goal of returning objects back to their original positions. With the current "pick up, use item, and drop" system, the item might not return easily or at all to its original position. For example, a candlestick might bounce off its holder. (See player quotes at the bottom.) Bug Tracker https://bugs.thedarkmod.com/view.php?id=6316 Problems to Solve How can the "pick up" step be eliminated so that the player can directly use or interact with the item where it is in the game world? How can so much key pressing and mouse clicking be eliminated when the player wants to directly use an item? How can candles be extinguished and lanterns toggled off/on without first picking them up? How can bodies be shouldered without first dragging them? Solution Design Goals Make TDM easier for new players while also improving it for longtime players. Reduce tedious steps for common frob interactions. Make it intuitive so that menu settings are unnecessary. Do not introduce bugs or break the game. Terms frob -- the frob button action happens instantly. hold frob -- the frob button is held for 200ms before the action happens. (This can be changed via cvar: 200ms by default.) Proposed Solution Note: Some issues have been struckthrough to show changes since the patch has been updated. Change how frobbing works for bodies, candles, and lanterns. For bodies: Frob to shoulder (pick up) a body. Second frob to drop shouldered body, while allowing frob on doors, switches, etc. Hold frob (key down) to start drag, continue to hold frob (key down) to drag body, and then release frob (key up) to stop dragging body. Also, a body can be dragged immediately by holding frob and moving the mouse. For candles/lanterns: Frob to extinguish candles and toggle off/on lanterns. Hold frob to pick it up, and then frob again to drop. Frob to pick it up, and then frob again to drop. Hold frob to extinguish candles and toggle off/on lanterns. For food: Frob to pick it up, and then frob again to drop. Hold frob to eat food. For other items: No change. New cvar "tdm_frobhold_delay", default:"200" The frob hold delay (in ms) before drag or extinguish. Set to 0 for TDM v2.11 (and prior) behavior. Solution Benefits Bodies: New players will have less to learn to get started moving knocked out guards. With TDM v2.11 and earlier, some players have played several missions before realizing that they could shoulder a body instead of dragging it long distances. Frob to shoulder body matches Thief, so longtime Thief players will find it familiar. Second frob drops a shouldered body. Players still have the ability to both shoulder and drag bodies. Compatible with the new auto-search bodies feature. Dragging feels more natural -- just grab, hold, and drop with a single button press. There is no longer the need to press the button twice. Also, it's no longer possible to walk away from a body while unintentionally dragging it. Set "tdm_frobhold_delay" cvar to delay of 0 to restore TDM v2.11 (and prior) behavior. Candles: New players will have less to learn to get started extinguishing candles. With TDM v2.11 and earlier, some players didn't know they could extinguish candles by picking them up and using them. Instead, they resorted to throwing them to extinguish them or hiding them. Hold frob to extinguish a candle feels like "pinching" it out. Once a candle is picked up, players still have the ability to manipulate and use them the same way they are used to in TDM v2.11 and earlier. For players who ghost and have the goal of putting objects back to their original positions, they'll have an easier time and not have to deal with candles popping off their holders when trying to place them back carefully. Set "tdm_frobhold_delay" cvar to delay of 0 to restore TDM v2.11 (and prior) behavior. Solution Issues Bodies: Frob does not drop a shouldered body, so that might be unexpected for new players. This is also different than Thief where a second frob will drop a body. "Use Inv. Item" or "Drop Inv. Item" drops the body. This is the same as TDM v2.11 and earlier. This is the price to pay for being able to frob (open/close) doors while shouldering a body. Patch was updated to drop body on second frob, while allowing frob on doors, switches, etc. Candles: Picking up a candle or lantern requires a slight delay, because the player must hold the frob button. The player might unintentionally extinguish a candle while moving it if they hold down frob. The player will need to learn that holding frob will extinguish the candle. The player can change the delay period via the "tdm_frobhold_delay" cvar. Also, when the cvar is set to a delay of 0, the behavior matches TDM v2.11 and earlier, meaning the player would have to first "Frob/Interact" to pick up the candle and then press "Use Inv. Item" to extinguish it. Some players might unintentionally extinguish a candle when they are trying to move it or pick it up. They need to make sure to hold frob to initiate moving the candle. When a candle is unlit, it will highlight but do nothing on frob. That might confuse players. However, the player will likely learn after extinguishing several candles that an unlit candle still highlights. It makes sense that an already-extinguished candle cannot be extinguished on frob. The official "Training Mission" might need to have its instructions updated to correctly guide the player through candle manipulation training. Updating the training mission to include the hold frob to extinguish would probably be helpful. Similar Solutions In Fallout 4, frob uses an item and long-press frob picks it up. Goldwell's mission, "Accountant 2: New In Town", has candles that extinguish on frob without the need of picking them up first. Snatcher's TDM Modpack includes a "Blow / Ignite" item that allows the player to blow out candles Wesp5's Unofficial Patch provides a way to directly extinguish movable candles by frobbing. Demonstration Videos Note: The last two videos don't quite demonstrate the latest patch anymore. But the gist is the same. This feature proposal is best experienced in game, but some demonstration videos are better than nothing. The following videos show either a clear improvement or that the player is not slowed down with the change in controls. For example, "long-press" sounds long, but it really isn't. Video: Body Shouldering and Dragging The purpose of this video is to show that frob to shoulder a body is fast and long-press frob to drag a body is fast enough and accurate. Video: Long-Press Frob to Pick Up Candle The purpose of this video is to show how the long-press frob to pick up a candle isn't really much slower than regular frob. Video: Frob to Extinguish The purpose of this video -- if a bit contrived -- is to show the efficiency and precision of this proposed feature. The task in the video was for the player to as quickly and accurately as possible extinguish candles and put them back in their original positions. On the left, TDM v2.11 is shown. The player has to highlight each candle, press "Frob/Interact" to pick up, press "Use Inv. Item" to extinguish, make sure the candle is back in place, and finally press "Frob/Interact" to drop the candle. The result shows mistakes and candles getting misplaced. On the right, the proposed feature is shown. The player frobs to extinguish the candles. The result shows no mistakes and candles are kept in their original positions. Special Thanks @Wellingtoncrab was instrumental in improving this feature during its early stages. We had many discussions covering varying scenarios, pros, and cons, and how it would affect the gameplay and player experience. Originally, I had a completely different solution that added a special "use modifier" keybinding. He suggested the frob to use and long-press frob to pick up mechanics. I coded it up, gave it a try, and found it to be too good. Without his feedback and patience, this feature wouldn't be as good as it is. Thank you, @Wellingtoncrab! And, of note, @Wellingtoncrab hasn't been able to try it in game yet, because I'm using Linux and can't compile a Windows build for him. So, if this feature isn't good, that's my fault. Code Patch I'll post the code patch in another post below this one so that folks who compile TDM themselves can give this proposal a try in game. And, if you do, I look forward to your feedback! Player Complaints TTLG (2023-01-10) Player 1: TDM Forums (2021-03-13) Player 2: Player 3: TDM Forums (2023-06-17) Player 4: TDM Discord (2021-05-18) Player 5: TDM Discord (2023-02-14) Player 6: Player 7: Player 8:

Just curious, based on this discussion: http://forums.thedarkmod.com/topic/19239-soft-r-gamma/?p=427350

Adding a switch breaks it. It would require a workaround since the switch acts like a trigger, similar to the arrow. Interestingly If you turn it off and on again the bulb shatters, but the light also comes on.

Oh wow, that is amazing! It must require a custom script I imagine? Didn't think that was possible even with one and the S/R system, that's very impressive. Definitely curious about a few things: Does it distinguish between collisions with the glass and frame? If the arrow hits a metal part it shouldn't do anything, it should only break if the glass in particular was hit. If the lamp is triggered by a switch, does flipping it no longer turn the light on once it's broken? Can you use a broken skin rather than model? With some lamps it would be easier to only change the skin and replace the glass, of course both should be supported based on what works best for each lamp.

Yes, definitely needs to be distinguishable. Clear glass with light bulb visible would be the best way: You know that if you see clear glass and the bulb inside you can shoot it. The distinction isn't always possible to make without first trying it out though... paintings are the best example, you always need to get close to see if a painting can be looted. As for players learning about this, we should add those lights to the tutorial level where the basics of TDM are taught: In one of the hallways we'd have examples with the message "solid lights can't be shot, but ones with fragile glass and a lightbulb can be broken with broadhead arrows", the player is given arrows and can shoot at different lamps to compare. As for explosive barrels those would be cool to have too! In their case they should already be doable with a script, just that no one's ever done them: Remove the barrel, spawn the same explosion as the fire arrow or mine, and some temporary lasting physical debris if possible. Breakable lights would need support added to the builtin spawnfunc.

Thanks, that would be one of the issues down. Could you also make it so when both creep and run are set to toggle, toggling one on also turns the other off? This way whenever you come out of running or creeping, you know you'll be back to walking instead of jumping straight to the other mode. Currently creeping blocks running entirely, you need to manually turn it off before the run toggle works at all which can be inconvenient if want to just jump to the mode of the key you pressed. I've always wondered if the HUD and menu graphics could be modernized to be a little more high resolution: We could surely have a nicer looking lightgem, one that actually looks more like a gem and maybe makes light level even clearer. I've tinkered with the HUD and could technically look at it, but I'm working on several projects now and don't even know for sure what changes would be accepted in vanilla. Hope someone else can provide more feedback and maybe take a look! Can't say I'm a big fan of the current crouch indicator in general: It's two decorations on the side of the lightgem that stretch to the bottom of the screen, makes the point clear but looks kind of ugly. I can't readily think of anything else that wouldn't be distracting though. Normally we could use an icon indicating posture as a silhouette of the person, but that might be too large and distracting and modern looking... the later issue can be fixed by making it more like a symbol carved into a rune.

It took awhile to get used to the size of this mission. The long loading times didn't help, but after passing a certain point, I get it now. However, I will say this - the AI is crazy on this map. I started, right? And the first thing I see - all guards going ape because some thug cut loose. I sat in the dark corner, for like ten minutes, waiting for them to calm down, because I figured I should look around for loot (I only found some of it much later when I was returning here after finishing the mission) The same thing happened later, when I needed to pass an abandoned mansion. I waited for the epic battle, instead it was a massacre, but like an idiot I saved AFTER I left the tunnel, not before. So I couldn't reload and see if next time the battle will go differently. (Am I crazy or do leather thugs spawn after a moment?) I had to use up all gas arrows to pass that part because they kept trimming the bushes. The evidence part got me confused because I dropped a piece of evidence, but it didn't count, so I dropped everything that said evidence. Only then it counted, but later, as I was still hunting for loot, I finally remembered that I had a vent key and came looking and found yet another piece of evidence?! Finding Smythe was funny, because he kept saying "Show yourself" and the moment I did... I gathered skulls before I was prompted to, but Edgar... I don't get it. edit: Those glasses, tho. Holy crap, I did not expect to see "actual glass" in this game. The hidden room took me ages to find, despite TWO blatant hints. But I was sleep-deprived at the time. There was one snag, and one confusion that I had. The snag was that, when I finally reached the alchemist, the note told me to use the vent, right? But... I couldn't open the second vent in his lab. I don't know which key I was missing for that. So I figured - I could just go back the same way... and game CTD. I walked there again - CTD. I noclipped through that locked vent, killed the spiders, and tried to open the doors to my left (got spooked by friendly guards) - CTD. Only when I walked right and up the stairs did I finally progressed. Not sure what that was about. The confusion, however, came from Builders. I knocked out most of them in the Builder's outpost, but when I dealt with the Mr. Nom-nom-zom, they vanished. I guess they needed that many people to dig him out of the spider outhouse? (Never found the second news flash either) I still somehow missed 3.5k, and noticed that lights kept poking through walls (there is a piece of light pointed at doors leading into the inner garden of Builder's outpost that nearly got me killed a few times) Overall, however, this was an impressive piece of work.

As soon as I started, I was hooked. Intro, our thief's reactions (can never have enough of those), cutscenes (YES!), dialogue with NPC's... It was great. And the further I went, the more it opened up. Overhearing conversations, a freaking tape recorder?! I found a very sus table in the pantry, and thought that maybe I need to light the candle, which did nothing. But you gotta admit, that looked like a puzzle of sorts. Turns out I was overthinking it... I too completely missed the hidden "chest" with the second book, only after coming here did I went back and found it. , but it's sad that Mage's readable turned out to be only partially true. =D Thank you for your work and release!

I think it's a good idea if done that way - a new light asset that mappers can use. Seems to lend itself especially well to streetlamps. Could be fun to use. I might try to make one using stims, just for schitzengiggles.

That's why last night I went with the idea of making new lamps with this mechanic: They should have transparent clear glass casing and show the light bulb inside, making it obvious they're different and can be shot. Something like this should make them easy to distinguish: Indeed I run into the painting problem myself: I always check every painting to see if it highlights and can be looted. Then again it's the same with doors in some FM's, which don't use a special door handle to make it clear that's a decorative door and not one you can go through.

I just added (in-game) a background color to the rectangle of the "Acquired" message for better reference. I think you better let it be Some players might make the light-gem a little smaller or larger and these players have been serviced. Players with tiny or huge HUD elements are on their own (and they know it!)

As designed, this should avoid overlap of the subtitles with the resizable central HUD elements: health bar, light gem, breathe bar, pickup message. It would not avoid all potential overlaps with the resizable corner elements.

It's okay! I'm down with any option hence why I asked. But I agree: Most players would likely not approve of such a change being done retroactively and affecting all old FM's, so it would likely be best as a derivative entity for mappers to use in the future based on new or existing lamps that can provide one. In any case it would likely require engine changes, not something you can currently do with a script: Lights already use their own hardcoded script classname which can't be overridden. Even if it weren't for that I don't think there's a way to intercept broadhead arrow collisions and check what kind of surface they hit, even with the Stim / Response system. There should probably be two new spawnargs: A breakable boolean enabling the feature on an entity, and a skin_broken to specify the skin used when a light was smashed.

This kind of mechanic would break a ton of existing FMs. Some (I dare say even most) mappers often choose electric lamps so that they can't be extinguished or turned off, forcing the player to time their movements through the light. There are of course switchable electric lights, but that is up to the author on how they want to implement those. It would definitely be fun to see an FM implement this Splinter Cell-style mechanic, where the mapper has designed their map to function in such a way, but to add this as a core feature would break the gameplay of countless maps

Sounds like a good idea to me. I'm all for breaking glass, also windows (the "penalty" is that it should be very loud to A.I. So, a thing you surely will only do very rarely.). I think this will take a lot of consideration on the mapper side, though. Amount of arrows in the starting gear and in the mission itself, consideration where to put destructable lamps, and where to avoid them. Not to mention that I don't know how much effort has to be put in the technical side (making the lamp destructable and killing the light it sheds). Thinking about it, I think it kinda defeats the "stealth" element, doesn't it? Why would you make loads of noise and possible alert half the A.I. in a mission, for pretty little benefit? A thief surely will do everything to avoid that kind of noise and attention.

It casts shadows, and it is a proper point light. Not sure what else can go wrong with a light.

"...to a robber whose soul is in his profession, there is a lure about a very old and feeble man who pays for his few necessities with Spanish gold." Good day, TDM community! I'm Ansome, a long-time forums lurker, and I'm here to recruit beta testers for my first FM: "The Terrible Old Man", based on H.P. Lovecraft's short story of the same name. This is a short (30-45 minute), story-driven FM with plenty of readables and a gloomy atmosphere. Do keep in mind that this is a more linear FM than you may be used to as it was deemed necessary for the purposes of the story's pacing. Regardless, the player does still have a degree of freedom in tackling challenges in the latter half of the FM. If this sounds interesting to you, please head over to the beta testing thread I will be posting shortly. Thank you!

damn i just broke the mainboard on my gaming pc switching PSU i did not notice that the cable for the 8 pin cpu power was the wrong type for that PSU and now it wont boot at all sigh... strangely it does light up the leds but the fans and qcode display stay of no matter what, there are 2 leds at the buttom that light up but according to the manual they just show the board has power so lol. luckily my 2080 ti still works and the ram also seems to have survived, havent tested the cpu or disks yet.

Myself and Baal have extensively used BounceLights in our WIP, the problem is that while they create superior lighting mood they effect the LG when we would rather they didn't. So my question is: Is there an arg or a script that can be applied to these BL's to stop them effecting the lightgem..?

Saw this FM in my list and it said my last playthrough was in 2020 so figured I'd try it again to see what was updated. What a good gem this one was! I think it's at the top when it comes to story and world building, one of the FM's where readables do a lot to immerse you and paint what's going on while events are dynamic and actually feel involved: I'd paint this as a textbook example on doing progression and elements of surprise in a FM... just my own feeling, but recent ones have become a bit too linear and predictable even if the graphics are more impressive, I feel kind of nostalgic for missions like this. With that being said, I should end with a hilarious thing that happened at the end and had me laughing out loud.

The new "tap" feature helps with that IMO. You don't have to commit to leaning all the way out, you can just take quick peeks. Aside from that, I think the light gem behaves just as I'd expect. If you're in shadow and lean out into the light, your light gem brightens but not by as much as if you stepped out into the lit area. That's completely sensible behaviour and I wouldn't want to be able to peek around corners without any penalty at all. Besides, it works the other way too. Lean away from light sources, or squash yourself into shadowy corners, and you become more concealed. In T1/T2 leaning never makes you less visible. It's one thing that I think TDM does better.