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@snatcher I understand that when you feel your work doesn't live up to your goals that you don't want it out in the wild advertising your own perceived shortcomings but that leads to a troubling dilemma of authors who are never satisfied with their work offering fleeting access to their in-progress designs then rescinding them or allowing them to be lost. When I was a member of Doom3world forums, I would often see members do interesting experiments and sometimes that work would languish until someone new would examine it and pickup the torch. This seemed like a perfectly viable system until Doom3world was killed by spambots and countless projects and conceptual works were lost. I guess what I am trying to say is that mods don't need to be perfect to be valuable. If they contain some grain of a useable feature they might be adapted by mission authors in custom scenarios. They might offer instructive details that others trying to achieve the same results can examine. It would be great if known compelling works were kept somewhere safe other than via forum attachments and temporary file sharing sites. I suppose we used to collect such things in our internal SVN for safe keeping but even that isn't always viable. If folks would rather not post beta or incomplete mods to TDM's Moddb page, perhaps they would consider creating their own Moddb page or allow them to be added to my page for safe keeping. Please don't look at this as some sort of pressure campaign or anything. I fully understand anyone not willing to put their name next to something they aren't fully happy with. As a general proviso, ( if possible \ permitted ) I just want to prevent the loss of some valuable investigations and formative works. The end of Doom3world was a digital apocalypse similar to the death of photobucket. It is one of my greatest fears that TDM will become a digital memory with only the skeletons of old forum threads at the wayback archive site.

Congrats on the release! Remember to check ThiefGuild as well as the DarkFate forums (via Google Translate) for additional feedback.

I have gone outside station. So... I have 6 buttons to accelerate along 3 axes, mouselook to rotate around 2 axes and 2 buttons to rotate around third axis. And 1 button to remove velocity limit and 1 button combo to brake. I suppose this is a nod to Descent (which I also did not play). Quite surprised to see such complex controls in a modern game.

Just curious, based on this discussion: http://forums.thedarkmod.com/topic/19239-soft-r-gamma/?p=427350

Greetings. First I would like to say a huge thanks for the continued support of this game and for TDM 2.10, it loads much MUCh faster now. However on Debian Linux I have an issue where the mouse occasionally just warps. It happens both in the game and in the menus, though obviously when it happens in the game it is quite disorienting. Anyone else experience this? I never saw it in 2.09... EDIT: Seems to have gone away when I switched window managers.

A couple more: https://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?/topic/21739-resolved-allow-mantling-while-carrying-a-body/ https://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?/topic/22211-feature-proposal-new-lean-for-tdm-212/ https://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?/topic/22198-feature-proposal-frob-to-use-world-item/ https://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?/topic/22249-212-auto-search-bodies/

This is an intereting discussion. So, could one of the mods please move this to a separate thread as to not derail the beta testing thread. As a developer, you spend about 80% of your time just reading code. So, optimizing for readability is very important. The more information you can gather just by reading without cluttering up the code (by needless comments) the better. Hungarian notation helps immensely to quickly prase the displayed code in your brain. Yes, your IDE will show the desired information as well, but a mechanical interaction with the code is required to show it (mouse over or similar). Also, often you are tasked to do code review on webpages that don't offer these nice crossreferencing features of your IDE. Some things are objectively bad, 'though, so the respective rules preventing those things should universally be followed. For instance, much legacy code is nested extremely because at some point in time, it must have been a rule that you only have one return-point in your function (probably a c-residual). Such code is exhausting to read ("what was the else-if-condition some 1000 lines ago leading to this else-case again?") and very likely contains tons of code duplication. Today, we have the rule to only use little nesting and short if-else-clauses, to make the code easy to read and debug. If I come accross such a nested legacy function, I refactor the shit out of that function while trying to understand it, just so the next person after me doesn't have to deal with that horrible mess again.

Ever since I worked on "Chalice of Kings" with Bikerdude, I have wanted to get flame particles with new particle glares into the core mod. My reasoning was that the candles have glares and the un-glared torches look mismatched. This proposal was met with mixed reactions, so (knowing the history of TDM feature proposals...) I have created a technical demo. You may download it here: zzz_flameglare.pk4.txt (fixed) Just rename without the .txt extension at the end and place it in your Darkmod directory. Here are some screens. Using particles for this is probably the wrong way to go now that Duzenko has an emissive light feature in his branch: http://forums.thedarkmod.com/topic/19659-feature-request-emissive-materialsvolumetric-lights/

Yeah, I don't know what to say. Rev 10383 works fine and 10384 does not. It is always reproducible for me, meaning that every time I try to reproduce it, I can reproduce it. After some more testing, I found that r_multiSamples set at 2 or 4 has the glitch most often at that viewpos. When set to 8 or 16, it is still possible but less likely. Setting r_fboResolution 2 made no difference. If com_maxFPS is set to something lower, such as 30, the glitched frames display for a longer period of time. Yeah, I also wonder if it driver dependent or GPU dependent. I discovered the glitch while using graphics drivers Mesa 22.0.5, so I updated my OS and graphics drivers to Mesa 23.3.2 today as a test, and the problem is still there. It's strange that rev 10384 exposed this problem. My machine specs and settings: Linux, Ubuntu 22.04 AMD Ryzen 9 5900X AMD Radeon RX 6700 XT (Mesa 22.0.5 & Mesa 23.3.2 both exhibit the glitch) com_fixedTic 1 com_maxFPS 60 Anti-Aliasing 2x (r_multiSamples 2) The video I shared shows the viewpos. Even at the same viewpos, the glitched frame will pop in and out. I've only seen this glitch happen in this single room in Accountant 1. If I move around the room at that viewpos, I can find other view positions that also expose the glitch. Here's another viewpos for Anti-Aliasing 4x, 8x, and 16x. It requires moving the mouse slightly to get into the exact viewpos to expose the glitch. (1.7 -166.4 0.0) is not precise enough. -1460.29 1425.48 172.25 1.7 -166.4 0.0 Glitched frame (Shows the curtain texture, covering most of the frame. Also, a hint of the red carpet texture?): Good frame (Same viewpos and Anti-Aliasing settings, when the glitched frame disappeared for a moment.): (Before and after rev 10384) I wonder if this might also be related to: (Before and after rev 10384) Also, sometimes on the loading screen with Anti-Aliasing enabled, I get a glitched background, which does not show with Anti-Aliasing disabled. See left side of screenshot: I don't know if the last two examples (distorted first frame on launch & loading screen distorted background) are related, but I thought I'd mention them just in case it helps track down the issue.

Updated patch along with new test builds. Windows: https://drive.google.com/file/d/13lQig7Yzfc_jovU2zZklxLV1QOKAjkXe/view?usp=sharing Linux/Ubuntu: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1j7DoWBKuBAFdVH2Y-2LcYsgdtJNBabmn/view?usp=sharing @stgatilov Could you please update test-frob-daftmugi? Changes in update: Bodies can be dragged instantly by holding frob and moving the mouse. Food can be eaten the same way as extinguishing a candle. (Pending) Add menu setting "Hold Frob to Use", with options: Quick (200ms) - short delay before use Delayed (400ms) - long delay before use TDM original Current design: Frob Pick up body and shoulder it (carry it) / Drop body Pick up candle/lantern and carry it / Drop candle/lantern Pick up food and carry it / Drop food Pick up an item and carry it / Drop item Hold frob (for special action) Drag body or body limbs Pinch out candle (also, pinch out candle while carrying it) Toggle lantern off/on (also, toggle lantern while carrying it) Eat food (also, eat food while carrying it) Hold frob and move mouse to instantly drag body. Addressed concerns from initial design to current design: Changed the candle behavior to pick up on frob and extinguish on held frob. Added @AluminumHaste's suggestion to allow un-shouldering a body on frob. Added @nbohr1more's suggestion to allow extinguishing a candle while holding it. Added @Skaruts's suggestion to allow instant dragging of bodies on mouse move. Tried to address @snatcher's suggestion of making the extinguish candle delay 500ms instead of 200ms. There's a planned menu setting to set it to "Quick" (200ms) or "Delayed" (400ms). Also, I hope the "instant" body dragging will work well for you. I think this is finally in a good place. It's evolved quite a lot since its initial design. I've tried to address as many concerns and suggestions as I could. Thank you everyone who gave feedback! It's much appreciated!

"...to a robber whose soul is in his profession, there is a lure about a very old and feeble man who pays for his few necessities with Spanish gold." Good day, TDM community! I'm Ansome, a long-time forums lurker, and I'm here to recruit beta testers for my first FM: "The Terrible Old Man", based on H.P. Lovecraft's short story of the same name. This is a short (30-45 minute), story-driven FM with plenty of readables and a gloomy atmosphere. Do keep in mind that this is a more linear FM than you may be used to as it was deemed necessary for the purposes of the story's pacing. Regardless, the player does still have a degree of freedom in tackling challenges in the latter half of the FM. If this sounds interesting to you, please head over to the beta testing thread I will be posting shortly. Thank you!

I've been on DR 3.8 for a while, but today it started giving me an error with the title "Real Hard DarkRadiant Failure" and message "Could not acquire frame buffer lock", "Break into the debugger?". Regardless of whether I press Yes or No, the next message is "Unhandled exception", "An unhandled exception occurred. Press Abort to terminate etc.". If I press Abort or Retry on this message the top row of buttons (File, Edit, View etc.) flash rapidly and then DR shuts down. If I press Ignore I can continue using the program, but as soon as I interact with the UI the error message comes up again. So far I already tried to wipe my user settings in AppData/Roaming, but it made no difference.

I accidentally found a bug that's easy to miss but likely also to fix: Select an arrow, in my case I was using the water arrow. Hold down the fire button to charge your shot, wait until it's fully charged but before getting tired and having to abort it. Press esc to enter the main menu without letting go of the left mouse button, then press esc again to resume. If you look and move around, the position of the hand and bow will no longer update until you let go to fire, you can see your first person hands floating in mid-air from a distance till you release the mouse button which will fire and update the hands again.

Here is version 6 of the script. What's new in v6? 1) Mouse wheel sensitivity (number of steps up or down) is no longer a thing. Just move the mouse wheel up one or more steps in a row to accelerate. Move the mouse wheel down one or more steps in a row to decelerate. 2) You can again navigate the inventory, turn pages, numbered dials and move objects you are holding back and forth by using Parry/Manipulate plus the mouse wheel. Please pay attention to the configuration. ------------------------------------ ADJUST PLAYER SPEED WITH THE MOUSE WHEEL v6.0 Credits: Obsttorte, snatcher. Description: Err... adjust player speed with mouse wheel? Topic: Adjust player speed with mouse wheel Installation and execution: Download AutoHotkey, install it, open Notepad, paste the below script inside, save it as TDM.ahk and double click on the file you just saved. The script will run in the background. To end the script, go to the Windows taskbar, look for a green icon with an "H", right click on it and select Exit. Configuration: Settings > Controls > Weapons: Remove mouse wheel bindings from Next Weapon and Previous Weapon (or from any other setting you may have set the mouse wheel to) Settings > Controls > General: Make sure Toggle Crouch is enabled and Always Run is disabled Settings > Controls > Movement: The Forward, Backwards, Left, Right, Run and Creep keys must match in both TDM and the script. Settings > Controls > Actions: The Parry/Manipulate key must match in both TDM and the script. Settings > Controls > Inventory: The Next Inv. Item and Prev Inv. Item must match in both TDM and the script. Recommended controls: Forward / Backward / Left / Right: W, S, A, D Run: Z Creep: C Parry/Manipulate: Right Mouse Button Next Inv. Item / Prev Inv. Item: Right Arrow, Left Arrow Known limitations and workarounds: You can move through the inventory, turn pages, numbered dials and move objects you are holding back and forth using Next / Prev Inv. Item or Parry/Manipulate + the mouse wheel. To prepare for a long jump from idle, move the mouse wheel up before executing your move. Remember the script will switch you automatically from running to walking after one second of inactivity. You cannot lean forward and switch speeds at the same time, for some reason... ; ===================================== ; Adjust player speed with mouse wheel ; ------------------------------------- ; An AutoHotkey script for The Dark Mod ; version 6.0 by Obsttorte & snatcher ; ===================================== ; ------------------------------------- ; Configure your keys below ; ------------------------------------- ; In-game movement keys key_left = a key_right = d key_forward = w key_backward = s ; In-game run and creep keys key_run = z key_creep = c ; In-game manipulate key (recommended right mouse button: RButton) key_manipulate = RButton ; In-game Next/Prev inventory keys key_next = Right key_prev = Left ; ------------------------------------- ; Do not edit anything past this point ; ------------------------------------- delay = 1000 ; delay in miliseconds between running > walking [default = 1000] speed = 0 ; init speed (-1 = creep | 0 = walk [default] | 1 = run) state = speed; counter for state switch #IfWinActive ahk_exe TheDarkModx64.exe ; run only when TDM is focused HotKey, *~%key_forward% up, keyForwardHandler return keyForwardHandler: if (speed == 1) ; we are running { sleep, delay if (!GetKeyState(key_forward) && !GetKeyState(key_backward) && !GetKeyState(key_right) && !GetKeyState(key_left)) { speed = 0 ; walk Send {%key_run% up} } } return *wheelup:: if (GetKeyState(key_manipulate)) { Send {%key_next%} } else { state += 1 if (speed == -1) ; we are creeping { speed = 0 ; walk Send {%key_creep% up} } else if (speed == 0) ; we are walking { speed = 1 ; run Send {%key_run% down} } state = 0 Sleep, 300 } return *wheeldown:: if (GetKeyState(key_manipulate)) { Send {%key_prev%} } else { state -= 1 if (speed == 0) ; we are walking { speed = -1 ; creep Send {%key_creep% down} } else if (speed == 1) ; we are running { speed = 0 ; walk Send {%key_run% up} } state = 0 Sleep, 300 } return Change-log: v6.0: You can now use as many mouse wheel steps as you like to switch speeds. You can navigate the inventory, turn pages, numbered dials and move objects you are holding back and forth by using Parry/Manipulate plus the mouse wheel. v5.0: To prevents sudden halts when running, a one-second delay has been added between the moment the player stops going forward and the script takes you automatically back to walking mode. To allow for a greater freedom of movement, the script requires to know now your backwards, right and left keys. v4.0: Altered so that when player is running and stops, you are back to walking mode. v3.0: The script only runs when TDM is in focus (tested in Win 10) v2.0: Second version by Obsttorte v1.0: First version by Obsttorte Cheers!

So, as everybody seems to have his own mapping thread, I thought about starting my own. I'm currently working on my map for the "unusual gameplay contest" and just set up a nice working elevator. I took a look one the multi-level elevator tutorial on the wiki and I think that my approach is much more easy to implement, so I thought I could describe it here. The elevator consists out of three parts: - a func_mover entity that will be our elevator-platform - the buttons that will control the elevator - a couple of waypoints, one for each floor what else do we need: a really short script, I'll go to explain further down The first step is to create an elevator-platform. This is your part . If your done with it change its classname to func mover (under entities/func/movers). Rename it to platform. (The names are for referance. Of course you can choose them as you like). The next step is to create some path_corner entities and place them, where you want your platform to stop. Be aware that the origin of the platform entity will move to the center of the bottom face of the pink block representing the path_corner. Let the platform target the path_corners. Make sure you start with "target0", then "target1" and so one. Start with the lowest path_corner and move upwards level by level. Create buttons for every floor on one of the levels. For the other you can just copy them around when we've set them up. On the buttons, you have to set three spawnargs. - target: let the buttons target the platform (so you have to insert its name here) - state_change_callback: set this to "movePlat". This is the name of the function we'll use to move the elevator - moveDir: set this to "0" for the lowest button, "1" for the next one and so one. This spawnarg controls which path_corner the platform should move to When you're done, copy the buttons to where else you'll need them. Ok, that's the setup in Dark Radiant. Now everything that's is needed is a script. And here it is. void movePlat(entity button,boolean bOpen,boolean bLocked,boolean bInterrupted) { entity mover = button.getEntityKey("target"); entity target = mover.getEntityKey("target"+button.getKey("moveDir")); mover.moveTo(target); } The "state_change_callback" is called everytime when the state of the specific object was changed, for example if a button is pressed. The function receives four arguments, of which we will only need the first one. The entity that we get here is the one who has called the script. In this case, the button we have pressed. Now what does the code do. The first line brings us the entity targeted by the button. This is our platform. We need to know this as we want to make it move The second line gives us the path_corner the platform should move to. Here you can see why you should start targeting them from 0 upwards and what the "moveDir" spawnarg is used for. An example: If you push a button whichs "moveDir" spawnarg is "1", than the platform targeted by the button will move to the path_corner targeted by the platform via the spawnarg "target1". The last line is quite self-explaining. It tells the platform to move to the designated path_corner. That's it. Pro's: - short code that is used for every elevator in the map (in fact you can use it for everything that translates) - fast setup Con's: - As I didn't tested it very much I don't know any if you find some please report here What is missing: - there are no sounds set up yet (will add them as soos as possible) - AI's should not yet be able to use the elevator (dido)

The real St. Alban was a pagan who became a celebrated religious personality, this All Saints Day 2010 The Dark Mod places its own spin on this mythical figure. Screenshots: Intro: "'Business' has been slow lately, even more so after most of my gear got snatched during a Watch raid... I've since been forced to hit the streets and pick pockets for a living. But my luck was about to change, last night I was approached by a red hooded figure with a proposition... As we sat down in a dark corner of a nearby inn, he told to me that the Builders of St. Alban's Cathedral in the Old Quarter had recently unearthed a discovery that might lead to the final resting place of some saint." " But before I do anything, I need to get my tools and stash from the evidence room at the local watch station." "with the hawks, doves will congregate they will drop honey from the cliffs wine will surge over the earth the sheep will wander harmlessly with the wolf then the wicked will rise, but to retribution" - 'scripture of St Alban' There is a new version out now, see the following thread St Albans Cathedral version 1.6 Build Time: about 2-3 months. Thanks:- Huge respect to the Dark Mod team for such a great mod and for all the hard work they put into it and continue to put into it. Special thanks to Fidcal, Serpentine and others for their help on the forums and to Testing:Ugoliant, Baddcog, Grayman, Lost soul, Bjorn and Baal (for doing all the Vp work in the town. Readables: Ungoliant and Mortemdesino for all awesome work on the readables. Resource: Fids, Grayman, Ungoliant - guis, models & images. Misc: Loren Schmidt - the author of the map I based the cathedral on. Info: # Like Thief2, some things are climable, pipes, wall vines etc.. You can also drop some of the keys, some door that are frobbabe mean there is another way inside - explore u taffer! # Due to TDM being a lot more of a resource hog than T2 I have been forced to limit the number of Ai in the mission, but they have better placement than my last mission. # On all difficulty levels the player starts with vertualy no tools/weapons, there are weapons to be found - read, read, read! # For the love of all that is holy, read the briefing otherwise you will problems completing the mission. Known issues:- # This mission will have less than optimal fps at a few points on the map, mid range DX9 card(X1900/GF7800) or higher required. # On low end PCs I recommend, V-sync is off, AA is off, Aniso is 4x or lower and that any and all background apps are closed.

The Alchemist is a full-size city and mansion Dark Mod FM, the fourth in the Thief's Den series in which you play Farrell. It follows on from Heart of Lone Salvation so you should play that first. The main build of this FM was by Sotha who was unable to continue work on it. I (Fidcal) could see the potential so completed it, somewhat roughly and quickly, so it could be enjoyed rather than abandoned. Even so, it exceeded my original estimate! Read the notes below while you ... DOWNLOAD HERE. (27MB) Sam's death hit me hard and I've not been feeling so good. I'm worried I didn't get rid of the Heart of Lone Salvation quickly enough. I don't want to end my days like Martha Edridge. A health potion is too weak; I need something stronger. Only a holy healing potion will lift a curse so I need to find a good alchemist. But the city watch have been tipped off and the district is alive with guards searching for any intruder they find on the streets. I have no choice: I must get that potion... This FM needs Dark Mod Update 1.02 or later. TIP: You cannot drink the holy healing potion if you are perfectly fit! As said in the briefing, the city watch are already ALERT right from the start and much more likely to notice you in the dark. You'd better be ready to move! ALLOW 2 TO 4 HOURS PLAY FIRST TIME AROUND Players with low end machines will find this slow in some places especially when there is an alert. Hide. Let things calm down. Closing doors behind you may help. In Dark Mod some glass is breakable using any weapon. It may require several hits. But there is also toughened glass which cannot be broken. Only one way to find out which is which! Do not use Esc during the briefing or the cursor becomes invisible. (You can still select blind though looking for highlights.) You can skip the briefing with the left mouse button. If you miss anything you can use the back button to show it again. Above all, Enjoy! [EDIT] updated with debugged combination lock script 5 June 2010. If you had a previous version installed make sure it is totally removed first, ie, doom3/alchemist and darkmod/fms/alchemist. [EDIT] If you get strange crashes there is a known bug caused by the spiky balls. This is fixed in Dark Mod but I think not released until 1.03. Try my patch from http://www.fidcal.com/TEMP/alchemist_patch2.zip It makes the spiky balls passive - they don't do damage - but apart from that no difference. Close Dark Mod Unzip the patch into your game folder doom3\alchemist Start the FM afresh, don't use earlier gamesaves.

Yeah it would be cool to see some more detailed statistics and it’s a shame they aren’t really captured. Since we are talking about fan mission platforms, where players also make the content for the game, I feel like the best thing we’ve got is you can look at the number of content releases for the games. Keep in mind the graph counts campaigns as single missions - so for example NHAT and TBP both count as 1 mission. A good year for TDM has has approaching maybe 50% - mostly we’re 25-30%. https://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=152494 You could also look at the number of ratings thief missions get on https://www.thiefguild.com/ vs TDM ones, but that is pretty iffy in that you could chalk that up to more awareness of the site in the thief community than TDM Out of curiosity is there a reason a thief player can’t be a new player? I kind of think a player is a player and new players would be ones who are playing the dark mod who weren't? Is there disagreement the base of players most likely to pick up the game are fans of the thief games? They are certainly the most fruitful place to find feedback on the game beyond the sphere of this forum that I have seen. When we were trying to finish up SLL there was a lot of discussion on the forums about how long it had been since there was a release for the game. I am thankful that the stats show at least some stability over the years in terms of releases for TDM, but the trend for all of the games is decline. Not doing anything is a valid response if that’s what the devs want to do - it is not possible to provide evidence that any effort will slow that inertia. As a player and content maker I would just prefer trying to find feedback where it is offered from players who were willing to try the game but ultimately could not engage with it and see if there is anything that can be done within reason to ease them into the game. The game has a lot to offer imo. All those players are potential contributors - contributions in turn attract players - it’d be nice to see the cycle go on as long as it can.

Overnight my mouse has stopped working - ie moving my viewpoint - when I'm inside a TDM mission. It previously worked fine in my current mission. I tried running a different mission, but same problem. The mouse works fine when I'm in the Main Menu, but not in the game itself. I'm running TDM 2.09, and I just ran 'tdm_update' just in case. Any advice please? That would be much appreciated.

Welcome to the forums Ansome! And congrats on making it to beta phase!

I read the FAQ. Nothing in there. I read the wiki. Nothing in there. This forum software does not permit searching (until logged in). Before [creating an account, verifying it, and] logging it, I had to go to each page in this forum using the search in the web browser to see if anyone had previously discussed how to swap the mouse buttons. Nope, nothing there. So I created an account so I could get the ever so precious search function, searched on "mouse", but none of those articles discussed how to swap the mouse buttons. Just used the updater to retrieve all the files (had to do twice since the updater did not retrieve thedarkmod.exe file during the first session) so I have the latest version available. I am right-handed but prefer the mouse on the left side of the keyboard. Why? Because keyboards are lopsided. Both the numpad and arrowpad are on the right side of the keyboard. That means the keyboard to be in front of the user (as expected for proper touch typing without having to look at the keyboard) has the mouse way over to the right. That also means the right arm is not extended straight forward but at an outward angle to the right. That creates more fatigue. So despite being a rightie, I use the mouse on the left side of the keyboard so my arm extends straight forward to use the mouse. I do have the mouse buttons swapped in the OS; i.e., the right button is the primary button and the left button is the alternate button. However, TMD does *not* honor that orientation. This is not the only game that ignores the user's preference in the OS and instead defaults to an ancient de facto standard that the mouse is on the right side of the keyboard. The game developers totally ignore righties that use the mouse on the left or lefties. Do a simple test. Place your knuckles on a desk and extend out all fingers except the middle finger. With the middle finger folded under and its knuckle kept on the desk, you can raise all fingers except the ring finger. Well, with a 3-button wheeled mouse, the index finger will be on the primary button, the middle finger on the middle button, and the ring finger on the alternate button. So the lack of a mouse button swap function means a leftie player will have to use their ring finger because the game makes the left button the primary button rather than honor the orientation configured in the OS. The ring finger should NOT be used for the far more exercised primary mouse button. So the Mouse applet in the OS lets me swap the mouse buttons. The game totally ignores that orientation. There is no swap mouse button function in the GUI config screens when I load TMD. There are games that initially ignore the orientation defined in the OS for the mouse buttons but they do have a means of swapping the mouse buttons. Either they have a "swap buttons" function or the user can reconfigure the bindings to reverse the default of primary and alternative mouse buttons. The latter looks possible in TMD; however, that means there is one orientation of mouse buttons during gameplay (that matches the button orientation defined in the OS) and a different orientation in the menus (which make them clumsier to use). While possible to get gameplay to use the same orientation as defined in the OS, the workaround is definitely not elegant. Is there a valid reason the developers did not include a built-in function to swap the mouse buttons? Redefining bindings for use only during gameplay does not obviate that a swap function got totally missed in the GUI design for the menus. I have games that are ignorant of the OS orientation of the mouse buttons and it is always clumsy when orientation changes depending on which part of the game you are using.

This looks better, but still to me shouldering should swap places with toggle-grabber. Or to make it consistent with loot and tools, the body could also appear as symbol in your inventory. It clearly is the one things that sticks out in this list...

I get that and full disclosure: I did not read the full thread, it's just too much! I was absent in recent months, so I missed all of this. That makes a lot of sense. Although, to solve this, one could communicate via audio cue ("uh uh") that no use-type-interaction is available for that entity. Anyway, there is an incredibly easy way to solve the inconsistency while staying true to the original control scheme and that is to simply swap shouldering and grabber. Entity type Short Press Long Press ...Release Button Junk Grabber Nothing Nothing Food Grabber Eat Nothing Loot Pick-up Nothing Nothing Bodies Grabber Shoulder Nothing Lights Grabber Exstinguish Nothing Tools Inventory Nothing Nothing This way, every interaction that was originally "frob + use" (shouldering, eat, exstinguish) will the become long-press-frob. So, the long-press simply becomes a shorthand for special action, nice and clean. While I do love the hold-type-grabber to death, I'd be willing to sacrifice it for a consistent control-scheme. (@stgatilov @Daft Mugi) Right now, we have this weird mixture of hold-type- and toggle-type-grabber that I guarantee you, will confuse new players (and streamers). I say, either fully embrace the lovely new hold-type-grabber (which I am still all for) or drop it completely.