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Yeah it would be cool to see some more detailed statistics and it’s a shame they aren’t really captured. Since we are talking about fan mission platforms, where players also make the content for the game, I feel like the best thing we’ve got is you can look at the number of content releases for the games. Keep in mind the graph counts campaigns as single missions - so for example NHAT and TBP both count as 1 mission. A good year for TDM has has approaching maybe 50% - mostly we’re 25-30%. https://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=152494 You could also look at the number of ratings thief missions get on https://www.thiefguild.com/ vs TDM ones, but that is pretty iffy in that you could chalk that up to more awareness of the site in the thief community than TDM Out of curiosity is there a reason a thief player can’t be a new player? I kind of think a player is a player and new players would be ones who are playing the dark mod who weren't? Is there disagreement the base of players most likely to pick up the game are fans of the thief games? They are certainly the most fruitful place to find feedback on the game beyond the sphere of this forum that I have seen. When we were trying to finish up SLL there was a lot of discussion on the forums about how long it had been since there was a release for the game. I am thankful that the stats show at least some stability over the years in terms of releases for TDM, but the trend for all of the games is decline. Not doing anything is a valid response if that’s what the devs want to do - it is not possible to provide evidence that any effort will slow that inertia. As a player and content maker I would just prefer trying to find feedback where it is offered from players who were willing to try the game but ultimately could not engage with it and see if there is anything that can be done within reason to ease them into the game. The game has a lot to offer imo. All those players are potential contributors - contributions in turn attract players - it’d be nice to see the cycle go on as long as it can.

I saw a video on two "hidden" TrenchBroom features that might also be interesting for Dark Radiant. The two videos below link to the same video with different timestamps, for a quick example of each feature. Feature 1 - The ability to select 2 faces from 2 separate brushes, then using CSG Merge to automatically create a new brush bridging the gap between these two brush faces. This would save time in drawing a new brush and moving edges / vertices for the same result. Video example: Feature 2 - The ability to select a brush face, then when extruding (for example with the resize tool), this will create a new brush instead of extending the existing brush. This is useful for quickly creating trims without having to draw a new brush or use the clipper tool. Video example: I don't know if these features are complex to implement. And obviously these effects can already be achieved in Dark Radiant with the existing tools. These features just make the edits a little faster and more convenient. Are these features interesting enough to include in Dark Radiant?

Not sure if I understand correctly. However, you could try that: 1. make a clip brush and cover the item in question 2. convert the clip brush into func_static 3. give the func_static the property "frobable - 1" 4. bind the new func_static with the loot item

New script for mappers: my flavour of a fog density fading script. To add this to your FM, add the line "thread FogIntensityLoop();" to your map's void main() function (see the example in fogfade.script) and set "fog_fade" "1" on each foglight to enable script control of it. Set "fog_intensity_multiplier" on each info_location entity to change how thick the fog is in that location (practically speaking it's a multiplier for visibility distance). Lastly, "fog_fade_speed" on each foglight determines how quickly it will change its density. The speed scales with the current value of shaderParm3, using shaderParm3 = 1000 as a baseline. So i.e. if shaderParm is currently at 1/10th of 1000, then fade speed will be 1/10th as fast. Differences to Obsttorte's script: https://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?/topic/14394-apples-and-peaches-obsttortes-mapping-and-scripting-thread/&do=findComment&comment=310436 my script uses fog lights you created, rather than creating one for you. Obsttorte's script will delete the foglight if entering a fogfree zone and recreate it later more than one fog light can be controlled (however, no per-fog-light level of control) adding this to the map requires adding a line to your void main() script, rather than adding an info_locations_settings entity with a custom scriptobject spawnarg in my script, mappers set a multiplier of fog visibility distance (shaderParm3), while in Obsttorte's script a "fog_density" spawnarg is used as an alternative to shaderParm3 smaller and less compactly written script fogfade.scriptfogfade.map

More or less, it doesn't save any real brush data in it, it is more like a "tag", is a peace of memory where info that should represent the entire "world" is defined and handled and brush data is "tagged" has THE worldspawn. Again is where all map data that should effect the entire map is handled, it is where the map script is run/called and other global stuff.

Dark Radiant includes an entity list. By pressing "J" this should appear on you screen: As already mentioned, everything but each separate brush with the classname worldspan is an entity. The total of all worldspawn brushes is equal to one entity (entity name: "world"). Only sealing geometry should be in the "worldspawn" class. If you have non sealing brushes, you should convert them into func_statics (and surround them with MC when AI can get involved). Converted func_static brushes must not necessarily be linked together - you can also have free space between the brushes. I vaguely recall that someone (maybe grayman) once mentioned, that, If you want to use multiple instances of a func_static (consisting of brushes), then you should convert the grouped brushes into a model and you should not convert the brushes into func_static and clone it. Func_static is also the classname for models in general. The "show help" info for func_static says, that "func_statics are brush models" - not sure what that means, maybe it should read "func_statics are groups of brushes converted into a func_static or models from the models list."

Thanks. If you press X to activate the clipper tool and cut a brush, can you confirm that breaks even this solution until Radiant is restarted?

The devs didn't title this thread, and @datiswous said they're attempting to mislead people by using Russell's name and a retro style to make it resemble Thief, which is cynical. I grew up on forums like I'm sure anyone who likes a game from '98 did. I actually left the Discord immediately after joining it because it was more off-topic doom-posting than anything relevant to the mod. I thought the forums might be better, but it's mostly just grown men yelling at clouds and telling strangers how mature they are, and a few brave souls actually developing anything. Depressing place, I'll just stick to enjoying new missions every 6 months without an account.

True, but, 1. this thread is called "Western stealth FPS with Stephen Russell", and, 2. nothing you said changes anything for me. The gameplay still doesn't look like something I'd enjoy. And, if you really think this forum is cynical, then you don't visit forums much. Actually, the majority of the users are are pretty mature, unlike in other forums.

We didn't make the holidays (such a busy time of year) so here's a New Year's gift, an unusual little mission. Window of Opportunity Recover an item for a regretful trader out in a wilderness setting, and discover more! Available within the in-game mission downloader or: Download: http://www.thedarkmo...ndetails/?id=79 Alternative: https://drive.google...WTMzQXZtMVFBSG8 Some unorthodox gameplay on regular/ghost difficulties. (Arachnophobes might prefer short mode...) Please expect to need your lantern in regular and ghost modes! Short ("easy") mode is a smaller map, so if you are looking for areas others reference below, or 100% of the loot, you'll need to play on another mode. I wanted to create my first mission before I became influenced by too many others' ideas, and limited myself to what has been done before. As such, this mission is not set in a city/town, and has some features that are likely to be provocative. There's a section some really like, which others don't, either way I kept it short to not last too long. That being said, I hope you do find it fun! :-) Special thanks to those who provided valuable testing and feedback: Goldwell, Kyyrma, plotzzz, 161803398874989, PPoe & Bikerdude (who also contributed a sound). (Please remember spoiler tags to not expose things meant to be discovered by playing.) Like so: [spoiler]secrets[/spoiler] If you are having trouble finding the main objective, here's what to pay attention to in the mission for hints: There is a spot it's possible to get stuck on the ground in the corner by the cliff/rockfall where there's a rope laying on the ground, please take care if you poke around there!

Beta 11 Fix finished-on state auto-update was unreliable Slighty improve scanner title/author detect Tags are now named some whatever regular-version-looking thing to force GitHub to put the newest at the top

With TDM 2.12, after the credits finished, the "Mission Complete" screen did not display. I found that the screen was black and I could hear my footsteps when I tried to move around. I think the reason for the mission not completing successfully was that the "Do not kill or harm allies" objective was never marked as "1 = STATE_COMPLETE" instead it was left as "0 = STATE_INCOMPLETE". Note, I didn't use noclip throughout the mission. Same as: https://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?/topic/18054-fan-mission-the-accountant-2-new-in-town-by-goldwell-20160509/&do=findComment&comment=458491

How about using TDM automation framework (and maybe pcem/qemu)? More info see: https://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?/topic/19828-automation-features-and-discussion/

I'd like to ask a (hopefully) easier favor from the DR devs on this, considering it's such an issue and making me struggle to keep mapping normally. I know the root issue seems to rely on WxWidgets and may not be solvable on our end, but at least one part of it I consistently run into should be. Like I said I can initially avoid the problem by exporting the "GDK_BACKEND=x11" variable in my shortcut, this makes it go away for the 2D and 3D viewports and only persist in the model viewers which I can care less about. There's just one exception: The moment I press X to use the clipper tool and cut a brush, the 2D view starts experiencing the issue and becomes impossible to drag normally. Because of this I need to avoid using the clipper as much as possible, and whenever I have to in order to get a triangle brush I must restart Radiant immediately after. Would it be possible to figure out what the clipper does that's so unique to triggers this? Does using it reset the 2D views and somehow gets them reloaded by Wayland? If yes could this be avoided so in the meantime it doesn't break that workaround? If at least this can be solved and the GDK_BACKEND workaround keeps otherwise working, it will be a lot easier to wait for the proper full fix. Sorry for the annoyance with this... just want to make some good FM's and using DR this way is running on a handicap that makes the already complex process of mapping even slower.

Using Map->Find Brush->Entity # produces 0 results. If I check my map file, it shows // entity 100 { "classname" "atdm:torch_metal_wall" "name" "atdm_torch_metal_wall_7" "origin" "-641.601 1104.32 99" "rotation" "0.503569 0.863956 0 -0.863956 0.503569 0 0 0 1" } If I do a search for entity 100 with that dialog box, I get no results, nothing shows in console either. It works for brushes just fine though, if I type in 200 in the box and hit OK, it selects that brush // primitive 200 { brushDef3 { ( 0 0 -1 -274 ) ( ( 0 0.007811999879777431 234.5014801025391 ) ( 0.007811999879777431 0 255.9998931884766 ) ) "textures/darkmod/stone/flat/smooth/marble_grey01" 0 0 0 ( 0 0 1 266 ) ( ( 0 -0.007811999879777431 234.5014801025391 ) ( -0.007811999879777431 0 9.1552734375e-05 ) ) "textures/darkmod/stone/flat/smooth/marble_grey01" 0 0 0 ( -0.390549898147583 0.9205817580223083 0 -2.343303442001343 ) ( ( -0.007811999879777431 0 19.79111862182617 ) ( 0 0.007811999879777431 3.812256097793579 ) ) "textures/darkmod/stone/flat/smooth/marble_grey01" 0 0 0 ( -0.9743911027908325 -0.2248600125312805 0 64.75949096679688 ) ( ( -0.007811999879777431 0 251.1657409667969 ) ( 0 0.007811999879777431 3.812256097793579 ) ) "textures/darkmod/stone/flat/smooth/marble_grey01" 0 0 0 ( 0.2265130281448364 -0.9740081429481506 0 0.3396595418453217 ) ( ( -0.007811999879777431 0 235.0602722167969 ) ( 0 0.007811999879777431 3.812256097793579 ) ) "textures/darkmod/stone/flat/smooth/marble_grey01" 0 0 0 ( 1 0 0 -191.9998779296875 ) ( ( -0.007811999879777431 0 9.1552734375e-05 ) ( 0 0.007811999879777431 3.812256097793579 ) ) "textures/darkmod/stone/flat/smooth/marble_grey01" 0 0 0 } }

If the "mission fails as soon as stealth score turns non-zero," that would not be good for ghost players. They might need to find out "how" they failed and experiment to avoid alerting guards. They might need to take those score points as a "bust". They might need to take those score points to complete an objective. Then, mission authors would need to encode exceptions into their missions, which would be a lot of work (if they decide to do it at all). However, part of what makes ghosting challenging and fun is when mission authors do not create their missions with ghosting in mind. Please see: Official Ghosting Rules: https://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=148523 Writing code for these rules would be a huge undertaking. Ghost Rules Discussion: https://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=148487 Creating an official mode could alienate these dedicated ghost players, because it would clash with what is considered ghosting in the community. Including the Stealth Stat Tool mod in the official release would be more useful. Or, making the audible alert states of guards quick and easy to recognize could help as well. For these reasons, I don't agree with an official "Ghost" mode. If the dev team were to do it, we should consult with @Klatremus so we get it 100% correct or not pursue it at all. (This ghosting bit should probably be in its own thread.)

To cater to both audiences. I mentioned LibreGameWiki as one example. nbohr1more mentioned other uses. Explicitly allowing reuse and spread will help TDM reach a wider audience and would hopefully attract more volunteers. More volunteers which can help improve both TDM versions. There are several benefits for a project of being in the Debian repo. One is that TDM Debian-users can report defects on any package directly to Debian (no need to register on separate forums). Debian may then fix the issue themselves (in their "TDM-libre" package) and will offer the patch upstream to TDM, who can then choose to accept or reject the patch. I envision "TDM-libre" to have the same capability of downloading any mission as regular TDM. The only difference is that "TDM-libre" would come packaged with the regular engine (which is GPL+BSD) and an included mission that has libre media/gamedata. When I play TDM by myself, I want the unlimited-play and can accept commercial restrictions. But if I were to promote it somewhere, or charge for a stream when playing online, or make a video, I would want a version without commercial restrictions (and can temporarily accept limited-play) to make sure I don't violate anyone's copyright. Perhaps. That's what I'm trying to find out.

I suggest you use the term "I", to make clear that it is something YOU want, and that you speak for yourself. But, as wesp5 mentioned, I don't really know what this is about, at all. And, I'm also wondering about all the newly registered people lately, who just arrived at this forum, and already want to revolutionize this mod. This is a thing I noticed 2 or 3 years ago, and which hasn't been present in the 15 years I play this mod and frequent these forums now. Really seems like a common thing these days, to not knock on the door, but kick it in, and stomp right in.

TDM has tons of textures from "free" texture resources that do not allow redistribution and cannot be incorporated into a commercial project. Someone would need to create a huge replacement pack of textures that do not break the look of existing missions and do not infringe on the copyrighted textures. Also, many artists who contributed to this project do not want 3rd party entities to use their work in commercial projects. They intended the models, textures, sounds, animations to be exclusively used for Darkmod content. You would either have to replace ALL assets or contact every contributor and ask them to re-license their assets. Many contributors are no longer active with the project and haven't visited the forums in years so it would be no easy feat. I cannot speak to Debian policy but I think that they treat installers that add non-free content the same as non-free content itself. One could argue that Steam is such an installer but I guess Debian would counter that there are a few fully Libre games on Steam. I think Debian, Ubuntu, or Linux Mint need to consider a repo that allows for games (etc) that include non-libre content but intentionally offer this content for free to the community with no stipulations other than "don't try to sell it as a product".

The gamepad implementation allows for a great degree of flexibility to personalize settings, aside from a few minor issues that I mentioned here: https://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?/topic/22337-gamepad-bindings/ I would say that playing TDM with a gamepad works very well, especially considering that it was implemented as experimental and hasn't been changed since then. If I could, I'd go back to 2021-you and congratulate you on buying that gamepad. I notice that your DarkmodPadbinds.cfg looks very different from mine...

It seems like more and more "thief" and "thief players" is becoming a short hand to dismiss community members earnest desire to improve the game - which happens to be a barely legally distinct "thief style" game which was made by thief fans for thief fans and is "designed to simulate the stealth gameplay of Thief". Who is the predominant player base of the game supposed to be beyond fans of the thief games? Is there some better avenue to find feedback for the game beyond this forum? FOSS and linux forums? I have seen maybe half a dozen posts from that segment. I am a thief fan, I play thief fms, my association with those games is what drives me to play and make things for this game. Are we supposed to pretend the original games are not a huge reason why most of us are here at all? TL;DR version: