The Dark Mod Great Summer Vertical FM Contest!

[DeTeEff]

As lord Sotha says We could have a summer and a winter contest and use some kind of template for these. Then when we have established some generic rules/build times for each, it should be fairly easy to come up with restrictions and themes for the individual contests i guess?

 

 

We could start a secret guild that builds some horrible maps...or maps with horrible themes for this halloween. Who's with me?

 

 

 

[Komag]

I think another contest starting NOW is too soon. Maybe a Christmas, but definitely not Halloween. But no one's stopping anyone from making a small horror themed map and releasing on Halloween, in fact such has happened multiple years with Thief 2 FMs

[Sotha]

 

We could start a secret guild that builds some horrible maps...or maps with horrible themes for this halloween. Who's with me?

 

 

 

 

Fun idea, but I'll probably have to skip.

Cannot get distracted from Knightons Manor anymore. Gotta get it finished. And after that, I need mapping break of a month or three. The wife's getting prickly on me arse.

 

 

 

As for secret guilds....

This is a free community. I see no right for anyone to prevent you from starting an unofficial Halloween Contest Thread 2010 with rules and start gathering enrollments. Deadline: all missions should be playable by halloween! Plenty of mapping time for those interested. Would be cool!

[DeTeEff]

 

 

Fun idea, but I'll probably have to skip.

Cannot get distracted from Knightons Manor anymore. Gotta get it finished. And after that, I need mapping break of a month or three. The wife's getting prickly on me arse.

 

 

 

As for secret guilds....

This is a free community. I see no right for anyone to prevent you from starting an unofficial Halloween Contest Thread 2010 with rules and start gathering enrollments. Deadline: all missions should be playable by halloween! Plenty of mapping time for those interested. Would be cool!

 

 

It's kinda itching to do something with this actually...I've learned a lot on my summermap I would like to implement into a completely new map...

Probably you'll encounter something reeealllly horrible at halloween

 

 

Why does so many of you have problems with your wives I have encouraged my gf to record voices for a pagan. Haven't had time in the summer because of the contest though and now the old man has stolen back his recording equipment :/

 

Edited August 25, 2010 by Fieldmedic

[Sotha]

 

Why does so many of you have problems with your wives I have encouraged my gf to record voices for a pagan. Haven't had time in the summer because of the contest though and now the old man has stolen back his recording equipment :/

 

 

 

 

Heh.. I had my wife betatesting The Glenham Tower, but she was too afraid to proceed once she saw the first zombies staggering inside the study. Her progress was so slow, saving the game after every step, I decided not to wait for her betatest report before releasing the mission.

 

GF's are generally problem free, but once you upgrade (downgrade?) them into wives, you will encounter some nagware, if you just sit in front of the computer too many nights in a row.

So be careful later in life, if you happen to have some rings lying around. Dangerous business.

 

[DeTeEff]

 

 

Heh.. I had my wife betatesting The Glenham Tower, but she was too afraid to proceed once she saw the first zombies staggering inside the study. Her progress was so slow, saving the game after every step, I decided not to wait for her betatest report before releasing the mission.

 

GF's are generally problem free, but once you upgrade (downgrade?) them into wives, you will encounter some nagware, if you just sit in front of the computer too many nights in a row.

So be careful later in life, if you happen to have some rings lying around. Dangerous business.

 

 

 

 

uh oh...Maybe hire a thief to steal the wedding ring (when it comes to that stage) "I told you! There must have been a thief stealing your ring! I have tested, there are at least five spots in the appartment where my light gem turned absolutely black! So there's absolutely a chance that Garrett or Farrell or somebody else has paid us a visit..."

 

 

Maybe continue in the OT-forum? *blush*

[aidakeeley]

I looked at the first post... pretty closely but still might have missed it... when is the deadline for voting, I have some love and some less-than-love to disperse, just wanting to give it all a bit more reflection and maybe play the rest before voting the rest...

[Fidcal]

It's not been fully decided. I mentioned here maybe two weeks or a month from the end http://forums.thedarkmod.com/topic/11275-the-dark-mod-great-summer-vertical-fm-contest/page__view__findpost__p__228830

 

It does not want to be too long. We want a winner! But it does not want to be too short. The last entrant needs to get a good proportion of votes. It does not matter if some FMs have more votes than others but if an FM only gets 3 or 4 votes it might be disproportionate either way.

 

So let's say two weeks provisionally (which will be noon UK time on Saturday 11th September unless there are good reasons to make it longer.

[Sotha]

So let's say two weeks provisionally (which will be noon UK time on Saturday 11th September unless there are good reasons to make it longer.

 

Hail to the voting deadline!

I'm pretty sure that now when people know when contest voting time runs out on 11.09.2010 (Vertical contest, WTC day, intentional?), they're gonna play the missions soon so they can vote while the voting box is still hot.

 

Everyone, it's time to download the missions and start playing and voting!

 

At present it looks like Grayman is winning, closely followed by Bikerdude, me and Fieldmedic. My ratings probably will not change much anymore, but other missions are still going to almost double the votes they have now.

[Briareos H]

I don't feel too good about the current way of voting.

 

Due to differences in gameplay appreciation, differences of mood while playing different FMs, time elapsed since the FM was played (I've forgotten most of the Glenham Tower already, but not how I generally felt about it), rating will not be representative. I had to go back to reevaluate some of my previous votes in the light of the recently played FMs.

You need to ask which mission people want to see winning after they've played all the FMs, not calculate a weighted average of the subjective impressions after playing a particular FM.

Different sample sizes between mission polls are also statistically problematic.

Edited August 26, 2010 by Briareos H

[stumpy]

as far as I understand its not the amount of people who vote but an adverage of the score, then the adverages are added up to get a result.

[Sotha]

I don't feel too good about the current way of voting.

 

Due to differences in gameplay appreciation, differences of mood while playing different FMs, time elapsed since the FM was played (I've forgotten most of the Glenham Tower already, but not how I generally felt about it), rating will not be representative. I had to go back to reevaluate some of my previous votes in the light of the recently played FMs.

You need to ask which mission people want to see winning after they've played all the FMs, not calculate a weighted average of the subjective impressions after playing a particular FM.

Different sample sizes between mission polls are also statistically problematic.

 

Well, maybe, but all kinds of voting systems would have their own limitations.

Maybe an objective oriented view helps:

This contest is not about someone winning, but sparking a steady flow of high quality maps for the community to play.

 

Recording the players subjective impression right after playing and some statistics indeed selects the winning map. When enough people feel great after playing a mission, that mission probably wins. However, the ranking system also applies outside the contest. Later, when new players come to TDM they can check the ratings and maybe find the excellent missions before the poorer ones. So, this system has some advantages over simple "Which map wins a) somewhere, betrayal... choose only one."

 

Statistical collection of subjective impressions is probably sufficiently accurate measurement for the most liked map in this contest, since there is no big prizes, sportscars and supermodels involved.

 

Nothing, of course, prevents people trying the missions they're forgotten about again and readjust their votes before the official voting ends.

 

It certainly would be interesting, in an academic point of view, to do the simple "who wins" -poll after the contest to see how well it matches with the winner of the collection of impressions..

[Fidcal]

Every method has its drawbacks. If we all wait to the end then vote for which FM we want to win then the later FMs have the advantage because it's always the later ones (all other things being equal) that one remembers most.

 

The current system works better for the experienced player who can give an even objective judgment throughout. Players who are new to this genre and style might get over-excited and give too high a score then can't go higher when a later FM is clearly better in some respects. That's why re-voting is available.

 

In addition, this system gives the FM maker feedback on different aspects of his FM from which he can learn. Just knowing that he 'failed' to win a contest doesn't help. Remember, anyone can run one of these polls at any time to get an assessment - not just in contests.

[Briareos H]

I'm not saying the current polls should be removed, I think they're a great addition and especially useful when appended to every mission even outside of a contest. I'm just thinking that the voting system is a bit unrepresentative of the relative quality of the missions (the important point during a contest) as it will be hard for non-experts to judge them objectively, while it's not hard at all to say "this is the one I like most".

 

I also agree that the current system will yield good and meaningful results with objective and experienced players, yet I would question the ratio of such players in the polls. Anyway, I understand that picking a winner may not really be the ultimate purpose and I have probably been overzealous in neglecting the fact that people around here are a mature crowd

[Fidcal]

... it's not hard at all to say "this is the one I like most".

I honestly cannot answer that question for myself. I don't know which I liked best. If I was the only one voting I do not know which one would have scored most from my votes alone. That's the beauty of it. I don't have to choose. I just judge the different merits of each independently.

 

But not all contests have to be run exactly the same way nor organized by the same person so we may see some variation just as they do over at ttlg.

[grayman]

So what's the general feeling about releasing a 1.1 version of a map?

 

I've spent today correcting parts of Somewhere that received multiple negative comments, and will release it at some point.

 

The question is whether it's kosher to release it before the contest voting completes, or wait until afterward so the map is judged on its original merits.

 

Thanks.

[nbohr1more]

I'd say that voting can be revised for changes made up till the final submission date (28th?). That's my preference (in the interest in better FM's all around).

[Fidcal]

Yes, that makes sense. No voting on changed aspects of FMs submitted after noon 28th. Use your own judgment. Of course, anyone who has already voted are not obliged to revise their vote.

[aidakeeley]

Yeah, do what's best for the mission.

 

I would hope no one gets seriously competitive about any of this; 'twould be a mess and a shame.

[LEGION]

Yes, but I think one should vote the mission right after finishing and not alter that vote (except an update arrived). It´s the impression you have at that moment that counts in my opinion. And anyone who thinks otherwise shall look at an devastating lawsuit, well, when I can afford one someday...

Also an 'Who wins?'-poll/thread would be nice, I think, or a poll were one can vote for the first three and that could serve as the end result?

[Sotha]

Also an 'Who wins?'-poll/thread would be nice, I think, or a poll were one can vote for the first three and that could serve as the end result?

 

Hey, yeah, that would be nice. The three best maps are obtained by the 'normal' voting and then there would be a separate final voting where the winner is chosen by "which one map should win" voting. It would increase excitement, since you cannot estimate which map will really win from the normal votes. And the community would have the final say which map is the best of all of the contest entries.

 

Fidcal is the boss of this contest, so it is his decision. What say you?

[STiFU]

I think what you suggest is a step back from professional evaluation, because the question "Who should win?" takes it to a personal level, e.g. people thinking that someone deserves to finally win the contest would vote for him regardless of the quality of his map. I would rather like to keep it strictly professional.

 

Yes, that makes sense. No voting on changed aspects of FMs submitted after noon 28th. Use your own judgment. Of course, anyone who has already voted are not obliged to revise their vote.

But voting will go on some longer, right? Still got two FMs to finish...

[Fidcal]

We'll stick with the original rules for this contest. I agree the extra vote for your favourite is just a subjective personal opinion. I suspect that many, like myself, just won't know who to vote for so won't vote. I have a spectrum of favourites but I think I cannot choose between them and all entrants are quality winners.

 

@STiFU: You are joking right? The competition is already closed except for special requests who have up to noon on the 28th which is only Winter. If you've previously made a special request for an extension then you'd better link me to it quick or you won't get in. Maybe I missed one? two?

[aidakeeley]

I think he's talking of playing...?

[aidakeeley]

As for "who wins" ishelldy type of things

 

Maybe we can have an "Everybody Wins" type of thing wherein each mission gets a "Best This or That"

 

Like a Senior Year "Most Likely To..." designation. A thread that we use to nominate such titles for the various missions.

 

"Best Little Underappreciated Detail" (The bloody smear on the cutting board in... St Alban's)