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Thief 4 is trash.


Mystry
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Given that the PS4 and XBone are out, referring to 8 year old consoles as "current gen" seems a bit misleading. That said, I'm still optimistic that their chosen architectures being so close to PC, will result in higher quality PC ports should the industry carry on the practice of building on PC, putting on console then porting back to PC. I'm sure the industry will be trying its hardest to beat that enthusiasm out of me, though.

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Given that the PS4 and XBone are out, referring to 8 year old consoles as "current gen" seems a bit misleading.

I'm not referring to them as current-gen until something good comes out of either of them, which will probably take at least a year.

Edited by Nacht7
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...... I don't actually like The Lost City much since there's not much meat to it. Aside from plopping fire elementals with water arrows and easily avoiding a couple of mages, it's a fairly dull mission......

blasphemy!

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:o :o :o I should probably say I absolutely adore it but don't like it when compared to my preferred sneaky loot missions. Love it in general, dislike it when put in the middle of Thief's sneaky-sneak campaign. The only mission I've ever disliked is The Mage Towers, and that's because of the abundance of tile/metal and the annoying platforms in the Air tower that are intentionally set up to make you wait. I just generally don't like the direction the game takes after Undercover, and The Lost City by proxy. Edited by Airship Ballet
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Sneaky Bastard's review, for anyone still holding out hope:

 

Thief is a disaster the likes of which we could not fathom. There is no easy way to say it; we just did not think the game would be this bad. So we must ask: how did this happen? Is the game’s five years in development, with multiple restarts and lead creative churn, the key factor here? Is Eidos Montreal misguided in its attempt to focus on narrative when Thief’s story is this flimsy? Has the developer’s attempt to cater to as many players as possible resulted in mechanics that work against the core experience of the series? Does the developer possess a completely different concept of immersion to us – theirs one of regular cutscenes, full animation and high detail visuals, and ours the more abstract sense of place that arises from the creation of whole and consistent locations? Does Eidos Montreal simply not understand what made the original Thief trilogy the masterpieces that they are?

 

The answer, unfortunately, is all of the above.

 

 

Garrett regularly clambers over obstacles and drops down on the other side, only to discover that there is no way back up, so that the game can flush the previous locations from memory. This happens with such surprising regularity that, at best, Thief’s missions feel like a linear progression of smaller, non-linear interiors. At no point does Garrett sneak into a building, steal an object, and then leave the way he came

 

Thief lacks even the barest illusion of progression through systemic creativity. We’d give all the loot in our clocktower hideout for a single box to stack.

 

 

Eidos Montreal claims Thief’s more scripted and directed approach to mission design is due to a focus on the narrative. It’s a sacrifice made in vain, for the plot is weak, poorly written, and wrapped up with one of the most unsatisfying, non-sequitur conclusions that makes us wonder whether a couple of scenes are missing. Put simply, this is one of the worst stories delivered in years.

 

For those desperately looking for something positive:

 

 

Thief does introduce a couple of interesting takes on existing stealth mechanics. Failing to correctly set a pin during lockpicking creates an audible ‘clunk!’ that the AI will pick up on and investigate. This makes cracking a safe next to a sleeping guard extremely tense. In addition, Thief has rethought the context of stationary security devices, like cameras and alarms, with the use of caged birds or caged dogs. Moving too quickly or making too much noise near these caged animals causes them to cry out, bringing any nearby guards to the scene. It is a clever, thematically appropriate rework of a classic stealth obstacle.

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From Gamespot: 6/10

 

As Thief seesawed up and down, my enjoyment of it followed suit. Each time I thought I might fall in love, the game doused my passions with a new annoyance. .... I'd wager your feelings will waver as often as mine did. The Thief-franchise-inspired Dishonored waves the stealth flag far more confidently than this reboot does. Garrett is not yet on his way out, but he's been shown the door.
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PC Gamer's review has a nod to us in the part about Thief's history:

 

 

Thief’s settings are a showcase for exemplary art and level design talent, a legacy that begins with Looking Glass Studios and ends with The Dark Mod, with the gaming community.

 

It's also the most positive one I've seen yet about nuThief:

 

 

Whether you are heartbroken or merely disappointed by Thief’s muddled sense of self will depend on exactly how invested you are in PC gaming’s creation myth. This is a decent stealth game that feels nice to play, and that’ll be enough for many – and if you feared the worst, you can rest a little easier. But the thing about evading disaster is that sometimes greatness slips away too.

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Ok, and then you have Rock, Paper, Shotgun (who has been critical in the past) post this:

 

While there’s going to be controversy, I’m arguing that it’s better than good. Thief, Eidos Montreal’s reviving of Looking Glass’s insurmountable series, is a superb game.

 

What the heck?

 

Although he follows that with:

 

 

Let’s get the worst of it out of the way: the story is incomprehensible shit.

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TB's (long) take on it.

His pros:

- Good options / customization (~12 min look at the options menu at the start)

- Focus on stealth instead of combat

- Graphics, lighting, effects, engine

- Ambient converstions (mentions the bawdy humor bits as negative though)

- Good PC port

 

His cons:

- Combat system (although not really important)

- Lack of variety in opponents

- Lack of exploration, level linearity

- Overuse of cutscenes

 

 

This was actually the first long vid I've been watching (mostly due to lack of interest). Graphics look pretty ok imo, though he's running a monster rig I couldn't dream to afford.

 

The HUD is awful. Whoever thought that moving HUD elements would be a good idea? At least you can turn it off.

 

I like TB's ranting, but in this case I think I'd like to have a sample of the game's audio without his chatter, can't comment on the quality of it.

 

The combat looked painfully easy. Alerted guard? Poff him a few time with the BJ, done. Or one not particulary aimed arrow.

 

Swoop just looks like straight cheating, but meh, no need to use it I guess? Same with focus.

 

Well.. it doesn't look terrible. don't think I need to pick it up day one, but maybe sometime when the price has gone down a bit.

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Well good news, my keys are now available so going to see if they will activate! But I have way too much mapping and testing to do before evening thinking about playing.

 

Follow the steps below in order to redeem the code:

1. Launch Steam and login to your Steam account.

2. Click the Games Menu.

3. Choose Activate a Product on Steam.

4. Follow the onscreen instructions to complete the process.

 

Code: #################

Opp DLC: #################

Bank DLC: ################

 

What is the Opp DLC as Ive not heard of that one..?

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I wouldn't place too much sway on what Total Bitchtits Biscuit has to say. He has a terrible elitist attitude for one and he's ironically pretty awful when it comes to actually playing games, and that contributes his infamous whining. He rarely reviews games, but rather plays them and complains that he's not doing well live. That's after talking over an options menu for half an hour.

 

Still, glad I didn't waste money on the pre-order. It's got the good, it's got the bad and it's got the ugly. One of those games I'll enjoy at times and curse in others, but not for full price.

Edited by Airship Ballet
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Well, I just finished the game a bit ago. Here are some of my impressions, mainly negatives. It's really just easier to blurb out the bad stuff. While I can't deny I've had a lot of fun with the game, in the end the it was a big let down for me.

 

 

  • The story and voice acting are simply put terrible. There isn't a single likeable character, and all the motion capture stuff that was the reason for Stephen Russell getting the boot is awful. That didn't stop the devs from flaunting it though - the game is completely littered with cutscenes. The villains are the worst of the bunch. For whatever reason every single person who has ever enlisted in the City Watch is now a homicidical maniac that likes rape, killing babies and cackling maniacly. They also say fuck a lot in a jarring american accent. Whatever little they have to say, they say again and again. Its like whiskey and cigars part 2. Best comparison for the story would be Thief fanfiction written by a terribly edgy 13-year old.

  • There is very little character interaction. Although its not a staple of the Thief-series, I was actually expecting something more akin to Human Revolution in this respect. You can accept odd jobs from a few NPCs and buy items from merchants however, and the side quests are actually some of the best levels in the game.There are no decisions or dialogue choices to make, the story is strictly on rails.

  • The city hub itself is initially very impressive. It's huge in size, and you can travel freely and break into peoples homes at your leisure. However as soon as you realize its cut up into tiny little segments separeted by loading times, it starts becoming more of a chore than fun sandbox to play around with. For example, want to buy new equipment? You have to go through a loading screen. Want to buy focus upgrades? Three loading screens from the clock tower. The mini-games they use to cover up the loading screens require you to tap a button. QTEs like this feel out of place on a keyboard, but worst of all no matter how fast you tap the button, it doesn't speed up the process. It's appears to be completely pointless and only affects the animation. You'll get through once the loading is done.

  • Moving Garret around and all the body awareness stuff is amazing. It's probably the best implementation of that in a first persong game since Mirror's Edge. I was also happily surprised to find three movement speeds instead of the current stealth staple of a simple walk / run toggle. The swoop action is pretty fun to use, but its both immersion breaking (it instantly propels Garret 5 meters forward compeltely silently) anda bit overpowered. Its clearly something they added after they saw blink in Dishonored, no matter what the devs say. Its too similar for it to be a coincidence. You aren't forced to use it though, and it makes traversing air ducts much more pleasant.

  • The swoop button (space) is also the context sensitive navigation key. Basically you press space in front of a crate and Garret jumps on it. Press it in front of a wall and Garret climbs on top. Unfortunately it doesn't actually work in any reliable way. Sometimes you can't walk on top of trash or stones on the ground, sometimes Garret can make massive leaps upwards when the level design calls for it. That is why most mantling points are marked with a white splash of paint, much like in the new Tomb Raider. After the amazing mantling system of Dishonored, this feels like a huge step back.

  • While the city hub is almost like a sandbox (despite the loading times) the main missions are increasingly linear towards the end of the game. They would best be compared to levels in Deus Ex: Human Revolution. Large chambers where you have a few alternative routes, which then funnel into a cutscene and the next room. Its all very disappointing, and even more so when you get to the few levels where you actually get freedom to roam around much like in old Thief games. It's terrible to see all the wasted potential.There is for example an excellent haunted house level, although a bit too much inspired by Shalebridge Cradle. Some of the Mansion-type levels are fantastic as well, and getting around the city while dodging patrols can be a lot of fun.

  • The AI on master difficulty is certainly challenging enough. Unlike previous Thief games, these guys also have a pretty good peripheral vision, so you can't approach them recklessly from the side either. They don't seem to relight torches however, and the stuff about the noticing missing patrols appears to be scripted and only occurs on a few levels. I do like that they don't all head to check out disturbances, instead you can hear them saying things like "You go check it out!" while the other guy stays put.

  • Graphically the game is truly impressive. It's possibly some of the most detailed level design I have seen. There is small items, clutter and trash everywhere, and the textures are amazing. Although the game can be visually a bit samey, its not quite as bad as screenshots would let you think. There area lot of visually very different locations in the game, all as impressive.

  • There are tons of immersion breaking HUD elements and hints shoved at the player if you don't turn those functions off. Unfortunately, if you do, you run into exactly the same problem as in Hitman: Absolution with Professional-mode. There are actions you simply can't know how to perform without the hints enabled. For example, sometimes loading screens between areas are hidden in a mini-game where you slide between stacks of large crates. The only way to spot an entry like this is the hovering interaction marker by the boxes. If you have that disabled, you will have no idea to hold the action key down near the crates to get to a new area. What is worse, those stacks of crates are all around the city, and not all are portals to different areas.

  • Another example would be the interaction highlight. Initially I though the interaction highlight worked just like in old Thief games. You look at an item, and it gets a bright white glow to indicate you can interact with it. However toggling that on also activates environmental highlighting, which is the most immersion breaking crap I've ever seen. What it does is highlight all ladders and mantling points in a neon blue at all times, completely ruining the artstyle. I can't fathom what they were thinking when they made the decision to make these two go behind the same toggle.

  • If you decide to disable it for immersions sake, you will have a hard time collecting all the loot. That is because the level design is so busy with all sorts of tiny items and clutter around, and there is absolutely TONS of loot on every level: Garret is no longer bothered with only stealing valuable items either. in fact he now has a strange fondness for office supplies. During the game you will mostly be picking up scissors, pens, inkwells and trinkets of the like. Making them out from non-loot items without the highlight is almost impossible, so you will end up just slamming the interact key to loot everything if you haven't the highlighting on.

  • When you start a new game, there are also difficulty modifiers. You can remove functions like Focus and takedowns completely, and add tweaks like halving the movement speed of Garret. HOWEVER DON'T DO THAT. I cut down Garrets movement speed in half, and later in the game in one of those cinematic escape sequences what would have been a 3 minute run took me almost three hours to complete :D I finally managed it by glitching one of the AIs that shoot arrows at Garret as he escapes through the rooftops. Every time I had to restart this sequence, I had to watch an unskippable cutscene. You can't disable modifiers from the menu. you have to start a new game, and I actually already started a new game at one point thinking the escape was impossible. The game obviously hasn't been tested with all the different settings you can create.

  • There are unfortunately tons of bugs in the game: Audio often de-syncs during cutscenes, subtitles seem to always be timed incorrectly, going to stores and watching cutscenes sometimes leaves the letterbox bars on the screen and the only way to remove them is shut down the game and restart. The save system is all over the place. It appears to be timed, so you can only quicksave once and then it has to cool down. However there is no instructions about it in the game, it just sometimes works and sometimes doesn't. The game also crashed frequently, at least on my PC.
     
 

 

 

I'm expecting that a lot of the technical issues and those related to lack of testing will be quickly patched after release, which will make the experience much more enjoyable. It's understandable that when they give you so many customization options, something is going to break.

Edited by kyyrma
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I've only watched a handful of Let's Plays, and that's what I'll be sticking with going forward. For me, they've clearly and undoubtedly missed the point of Thief. The gameplay is hand-held and misses engaging the player's mind; just follow the path and click the glowy things. The dialog and characterizations are embarrassing. Considering the parent company, it's no surprise that there's so much cinematic showiness going on, rather than gameplay. I could go on and on but it's not really worth the time.

 

Why is gaming evolving this way? We're a smart species. More developers SHOULD be making games for MIT grads. It's why we signed on with them in the first place. Challenge our minds; don't insult us.

 

Greed kills. Press 'X' to Flush.

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Well, it's finally went below a seventy. I have the feeling it will only get lower.

I cannot imagine what the user rating will look like.

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